Worn out topic

[JMJ Farms]

Dang !!! At $ 450 a year carrying cost per moma cow. If that cow was to conceive on day one. And if you kept the calf until it was 9 months old. You would have around $ 675 carrying cost in that cow by the time you sale it's calf ? Does that sound right ? I have to miss figured some how ? If that is right, about everything you make from the sale of the calf goes to take care of the cow ?

Your figuring is correct with the exception that the cow should be bred back with calf #2 while she is still nursing calf #1 so therefore part of that $675 would be attributed to calf #2. Assuming she weans a sellable calf every 12 months then the carrying cost would still be $450 per calf.

 

[Dave]

I don't know. Changing directions seems to work pretty well for me. I generally make around $400 or so a head. I buy bred broken mouth cows in January. Ship the cows in late August. Sell the calves the first of October. But back in 2012 I saw that the bred heifers were going to do well. I didn't buy cows. I bought heifers instead. I bred them and sold for an October delivery. I did real well for four years. Saw that market was turning so I went back to broken mouth cows. This last year I saw that feeder heifers were under priced so I split between stocker heifers and the broken mouth cows. Both are looking to do well.

So normally you don't carry any cattle (other than bulls I assume) from Oct-January?

One of the benefits. That is the most expensive time of the year to own cattle. Cows are going to kill so I don't carry bulls. Cows that are bred and not cycling gain better so I do put out bulls. But I buy thin bulls who look like they will gain. I am not worried about the genetics as the calf will not be born. The bulls leave right along with the cows.

 

[Lucky]

Keep cow cost simple. Cows need hay, supplements in the winter, mineral, and vaccinations. Fencing and equipment does cost money but at the end of the day that stuff is a capital investment that should make you money. Keep things simple and keep the cattle money in it's own account Allot of people get out because they don't Know how to count their money.

 

[504RP]

So if a cow doesn't breed back for some reason. You lose $ 450 carrying cost or $ 675 if you figure from the time the cow conceived up until the calf would have been 9 months old. Plus the money the calf might of sold for. Depending on the market at the time say $ 600 give or take a little.

You lose around $ 1275 in
carrying cost and no calf sale over that cow not having a calf. Am i right about that ? If so what would be the best thing to do with that cow ? Ship it, give it another shot to breed back ?

I have always had mine preg tested 3 or 4 months after pulling the bull off of them but didn't last year.

 

[Caustic Burno]

So if a cow doesn't breed back for some reason. You lose $ 450 carrying cost or $ 675 if you figure from the time the cow conceived up until the calf would have been 9 months old. Plus the money the calf might of sold for. Depending on the market at the time say $ 600 give or take a little.

You lose around $ 1275 in
carrying cost and no calf sale over that cow not having a calf. Am i right about that ? If so what would be the best thing to do with that cow ? Ship it, give it another shot to breed back ?

I have always had mine preg tested 3 or 4 months after pulling the bull off of them but didn't last year.

Yep now figure the cost of that retained heifer.
It just doesn't pencil out in a commercial operation IMO.

 

[JMJ Farms]

So if a cow doesn't breed back for some reason. You lose $ 450 carrying cost or $ 675 if you figure from the time the cow conceived up until the calf would have been 9 months old. Plus the money the calf might of sold for. Depending on the market at the time say $ 600 give or take a little.

You lose around $ 1275 in
carrying cost and no calf sale over that cow not having a calf. Am i right about that ? If so what would be the best thing to do with that cow ? Ship it, give it another shot to breed back ?

I have always had mine preg tested 3 or 4 months after pulling the bull off of them but didn't last year.

You're double figuring some of that. You can't "lose" what you never had. If she doesn't have a calf, then you can't "lose" what that calf "would have brought"

So let's say it's January 1st, 2020. Bull is turned in with cow. She should calve let's say October 1st, 2020. Ideally you would preg check her around April 1st. If she's pregnant that's good. If not, you sell her and buy a replacement. Figuring $450 a year to keep her, you only lost 1/4 of that, $112.50.

If you were to wait until January 1st, 2021 (one year from breeding) and she didn't have a calf, then you lost $450.

If you were to keep her anyway, then anything you spend on keeping her after that, then that should be considered a hobby expense, bc there's no practical reason for keeping her if you're viewing it as a business.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[504RP]

Your 100 % right. I should have worded what i meant to ask differently.

Your right you can't lose money on a calf that was never born. And i was including the cost of a calf that was never born.

All of my cows have bred back and had a calf around 9 months after that. I normally have them preg checked 3 or 4 months after i pull my bull off of them. But this time i couldn't schedule a farm call that would work for that would work with me and the vet so i didn't have them preg tested.

So what i was meaning to say. If one of thoes cows did not breed back for some reason. I will end up loseing not only the $ 450 carry over cost i have in the cow that didn't breed back but, the money that i could have potentially made if she had of had a calf like she had in the past few years ? That sound right ?

 

[Caustic Burno]

Your 100 % right. I should have worded what i meant to ask differently.

Your right you can't lose money on a calf that was never born. And i was including the cost of a calf that was never born.

All of my cows have bred back and had a calf around 9 months after that. I normally have them preg checked 3 or 4 months after i pull my bull off of them. But this time i couldn't schedule a farm call that would work for that would work with me and the vet so i didn't have them preg tested.

So what i was meaning to say. If one of thoes cows did not breed back for some reason. I will end up loseing not only the $ 450 carry over cost i have in the cow that didn't breed back but, the money that i could have potentially made if she had of had a calf like she had in the past few years ? That sound right ?

No you just paid 900 dollars inputs on a cow with no return. The only loss is the input.

 

[Dave]

When I have carried cows I preg check asap after weaning the calf. If she is open she goes to the very next sale. I don't care how good of a cow she has been. If you never make an excuse for a cow pretty quick you will have cows that don't need excuses.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Not to muddy the thought process - but, if you have a commercial herd raising bigger weaned calves, a steer could pay for 2 years worth of a cows "keep". You are talking $450 cow cost - last year I got $1.44/# for steers. Steers averaged 724# at delivery on 10/11/19 = $1042.56
After weaning, steers were fed about 3# WSC for about 1 month - so about 100# = $7 expense and the little grass/hay he ate in that 1 month time. "My" cow cost is closer to $700/yr. with my show expenses/high semen price added in. But, my weaning weights are not out of range for a good commercial cow.
I am NOT trying to talk anyone into keeping an open cow. It is proven time & again, that the best financial practice is to ship open cows - in a commercial herd.

 

[Lucky]

Ideally you would sell the open cow and recover her carrying cost plus maybe $100-200. Now you have to buy or keep a replacement. If you buy a replacement cow that is bred the same as what you have you'll be out the difference. If you keep a heifer you can figure it to were you made money or lose out big time. Buying bred cows generally just becomes a wash by the time you sell the calf, Nothing gained or lost that year.

 

[Little Joe]

I've never made any money playing the long game in the cattle business, every time I've bought good cattle and was looking long term things go wrong and I loose my butt. I do better on short game stuff like finishing steers to sell on the quarter or buying longhorn cows bred to good bulls. This way I'm not tied down to any particular thing and if something goes wrong it's not that major of a deal, I can make up the difference on another deal. I like dealing with cattle that make me money quick instead of 5 years down the road. On the other hand I know lots of people making money in the long game with good cattle, that game has just never been good for me.