What's the deal????? (venting on fuel costs)

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Alice":17lehl9w said:
Aplusmnt, are you gonna type real slow and try to spell it out to all of those 22 republican and democrat governors that are calling for an investigation of gasoline price gouging. I know they'll really appreciate hearing from you and you setting them straight on it. :lol2:

Alice (the yeah yeah girl) :)

Every year, prices go up in the summer and every year politicians say they are going to investigate it and look into price gouging. Bla bla bla.

Who cares what these people say they are going to do? They either do not do it or they do not find any gouging. Which is it? If the big oil companies are gouging and the Republicans control the big oil companies. I imagine the Democrats would go find something then.

Just a bunch of crap to appease the week minded that think the government is the answer to their problems. The government Democrat or Republican will never help things. I follow my Grandpa's advice, Do something about the things you can change and do not worry about those that you can not.
 
aplusmnt":245tcfax said:
I am going to type real slow so you can understand this. Because this is about as basic as it gets.

Gas after adjusting for inflation is cheaper now than in the 80's you just got spoiled with all the extremely cheap gas for the last 20 years.

And I'm going to point out AGAIN that you don't know what you're talking about.

"But retail gasoline prices keep rising, nearing inflation-adjusted highs. On Monday, the Energy Information Administration said the national average retail price for regular-grade gasoline rose 11.5 cents to $3.218 a gallon, just shy of the inflation-adjusted high of $3.223 a gallon reached in March 1981. The nominal price then was $1.417 a gallon."

And we're paying $3.35. So we are above the highest price ever, even adjusted for inflation.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/bus ... 28036.html

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? :lol:
 
This thread isn't locked yet? :lol:

I won't say that there needs to be regulation. I would like to think that in a perfect world there would be no need for that. I am afraid I've let my liberal side hang out a little. Something needs to happen, though. We can't go on like this. People have to be able to get to work.
 
Lammie":3h5cr5us said:
This thread isn't locked yet? :lol:

Nope, but we're peddling as fast as we can! :lol:

Alice (the yeah yeah girl)
 
Lammie":68dslvcv said:
This thread isn't locked yet? :lol:

I won't say that there needs to be regulation. I would like to think that in a perfect world there would be no need for that. I am afraid I've let my liberal side hang out a little. Something needs to happen, though. We can't go on like this. People have to be able to get to work.

I'm sorry. I had planned to leave it alone, but CC came along with the usual excuses and I couldn't resist. I promise not to post on it again. :oops:
 
Lammie":1y5y0a9g said:
This thread isn't locked yet? :lol:

I won't say that there needs to be regulation. I would like to think that in a perfect world there would be no need for that. I am afraid I've let my liberal side hang out a little. Something needs to happen, though. We can't go on like this. People have to be able to get to work.


Lammie, haven't you been reading? All people gotta do is figure out a way to make more money! :)

Alice (the yeah yeah girl)
 
Alice":32213y37 said:
Aplusmnt, are you gonna type real slow and try to spell it out to all of those 22 republican and democrat governors that are calling for an investigation of gasoline price gouging. I know they'll really appreciate hearing from you and you setting them straight on it. :lol2:

Alice (the yeah yeah girl) :)

If you think the political hogs are going to stop feeding the trough you fell and hit your head.
Those politicans are smoke and mirrors when the average tax is 40 cents a gallon do you think they care what it cost not hardly. They are going to feed you what you want to hear!
The hogs at the trough will only be concerned when the feed gets cut off.
 
Frankie":2x4bj06l said:
aplusmnt":2x4bj06l said:
I am going to type real slow so you can understand this. Because this is about as basic as it gets.

Gas after adjusting for inflation is cheaper now than in the 80's you just got spoiled with all the extremely cheap gas for the last 20 years.

And I'm going to point out AGAIN that you don't know what you're talking about.

"But retail gasoline prices keep rising, nearing inflation-adjusted highs. On Monday, the Energy Information Administration said the national average retail price for regular-grade gasoline rose 11.5 cents to $3.218 a gallon, just shy of the inflation-adjusted high of $3.223 a gallon reached in March 1981. The nominal price then was $1.417 a gallon."

And we're paying $3.35. So we are above the highest price ever, even adjusted for inflation.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/bus ... 28036.html

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? :lol:
 
http://www.conocophillips.com/newsroom/ ... rofits.htm

copied this from the above site.

"data from the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) indicates that when the average price of unleaded regular peaked at about $3 a gallon in the middle of 2006, major companies were making a profit of about 10 cents a gallon on their U.S. refining and marketing operations."

The site below is a list of state taxes on gasoline.

http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp

and the federal tax is 18.4 cents per gallon.

The government does nothing to find the oil, pump the oil, transport the oil, or refine it but make 4 times off of a gallon of gas than the company doing all the work. You people are mad at the wrong folks.

Walt
 
Frankie":37zpo6sc said:
aplusmnt":37zpo6sc said:
I am going to type real slow so you can understand this. Because this is about as basic as it gets.

Gas after adjusting for inflation is cheaper now than in the 80's you just got spoiled with all the extremely cheap gas for the last 20 years.

And I'm going to point out AGAIN that you don't know what you're talking about.

"But retail gasoline prices keep rising, nearing inflation-adjusted highs. On Monday, the Energy Information Administration said the national average retail price for regular-grade gasoline rose 11.5 cents to $3.218 a gallon, just shy of the inflation-adjusted high of $3.223 a gallon reached in March 1981. The nominal price then was $1.417 a gallon."

And we're paying $3.35. So we are above the highest price ever, even adjusted for inflation.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/bus ... 28036.html

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? :lol:

Not everyone is paying above the adjusted for inflation rate. and You will be paying that for maybe a few weeks and it will come down. Gas came down here 10 cents just last couple days. When they talk about inflation adjusted prices they are not talk about a one week or two week peak. I am sure if they used memorial day stats from 1981 instead of march 1981 then it would be different.

But you basically proved my point only on Memorial day of 2007 is gas any higher than it was 26 years ago. We can talk about this in a month or two and it will be way cheaper than it was in in 1981 when it drops back to 2 dollars and change per gallon. And when you look at the whole year of 2007 average I am willing to bet you that gas will have been cheaper in 2007 than it was in the year 1981.

Am I wrong about this? Is gas when averaged out over 2005, 2006 or 2007 been cheaper than when it was $1.41 a gallon and no one whined about it. It takes a Holiday weekend for you to try to make your point. What you going to do now, quote a specific gas station that is full service in Beverly Hills to try to prove your point?

The fact is gas i cheaper now than it was in the 80's when you take account for inflation. As long as you look at the whole year and not cherry pick one weekend out of the year.

Plus this is the first weekend that it ever went that high, you whined when it did not reach that $3.23 benchmark. And you will be whining when it is $2.90 in a week or so and way below the 1981 figures.

But you have learned well from your Liberal Hero's that are masters at cherry picking specific things to try to prove their points instead of admitting what the over all big picture is.
 
Txwalt":2p7rixuw said:
http://www.conocophillips.com/newsroom/other_resources/energyanswers/oil_profits.htm

copied this from the above site.

"data from the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) indicates that when the average price of unleaded regular peaked at about $3 a gallon in the middle of 2006, major companies were making a profit of about 10 cents a gallon on their U.S. refining and marketing operations."

The site below is a list of state taxes on gasoline.

http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp

and the federal tax is 18.4 cents per gallon.

The government does nothing to find the oil, pump the oil, transport the oil, or refine it but make 4 times off of a gallon of gas than the company doing all the work. You people are mad at the wrong folks.

Walt

When you look at state and city also. The Average taxes on a gallon is 42 cents and that was in 2002. I doubt the government lowered them, most likely they have been increased in last 5 years.

http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/stati ... _2002.html
 
Txwalt":kzyizx4p said:
http://www.conocophillips.com/newsroom/other_resources/energyanswers/oil_profits.htm

copied this from the above site.

"data from the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) indicates that when the average price of unleaded regular peaked at about $3 a gallon in the middle of 2006, major companies were making a profit of about 10 cents a gallon on their U.S. refining and marketing operations."

The site below is a list of state taxes on gasoline.

http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp

and the federal tax is 18.4 cents per gallon.

The government does nothing to find the oil, pump the oil, transport the oil, or refine it but make 4 times off of a gallon of gas than the company doing all the work. You people are mad at the wrong folks.

Walt

A point of production today is when our refineries were built they were built on oil fields in the middle of nowhere.
The oil companies were monitizing crude this was cheap and profitable and hugh savings could be passed to the public it was a volume business . This is not so today as they are having to buy crude from Opec producing countries paying almost 2 dollars a gallon for the crude. This is because we don't want to drill in our waters today or our country today.
The average oil well in America today produces 16 barrels of crude a day we import over half of our oil appetite everyday. The major refinery I work at brings in 500,000 barrels a day of OPEC crude. Those of you that have never seen the petrochemical infrastructure of this country down this way should drive over the Fred Hartman bridge in Baytown Texas, nothing but refineries as far as the eye can see with tanker after tanker of foriegn crude coming in to satisfy our appetites. We keep sending more dollars to terrorist countries every year.
 
It is would not be difficult to lower gas prices.

1. Kill the EPA
2. Drill every reserve we have in Alaska
3. Tax break to incourage building refinery
4. Lower the taxes that we currently pay

I do not think that gas prices are hurting the country. People that I know that are complaining, everyone in family has a cell phone, they eat out every meal, keep buying new cars, and building huge houses. Its all about choices, what is important to us, and what is not important.

CSM
 
The price of a barrel of crude is way up so the price of gas is going to be higher. The gas companies have a profit margin that basically does not change. Compare the oil companies to people selling hay. If they have to pay more to make the hay. They are going to charge more to sell it. Atleast as long as people keep buying it. We can whine about the executives making to much but they all do. CEO's from all fortune 500 companies are racking it in. The thing that upsets me is all the government taxes that get us. Soc SEC 6.2%, Medicare 1.45%, federal income tax, gasoline tax, phone tax, property tax, vehicle registration, toll roads, and thats just off the top of my head. The government wants to penalize us for having an income. But if we don't work they'll pay us and give us food stamps and housing. Hard to understand how this country revolted against the British over taxes and we allow this to happen today. I guess since we are represented now we'll take it in the WAWA.

Walt

I should add that I don't like the gas prices being so high either but I don't think its the oil companies fault.
 
Txwalt":38cm0t2h said:
The price of a barrel of crude is way up so the price of gas is going to be higher. The gas companies have a profit margin that basically does not change. Compare the oil companies to people selling hay. If they have to pay more to make the hay. They are going to charge more to sell it. Atleast as long as people keep buying it. We can whine about the executives making to much but they all do. CEO's from all fortune 500 companies are racking it in. The thing that upsets me is all the government taxes that get us. Soc SEC 6.2%, Medicare 1.45%, federal income tax, gasoline tax, phone tax, property tax, vehicle registration, toll roads, and thats just off the top of my head. The government wants to penalize us for having an income. But if we don't work they'll pay us and give us food stamps and housing. Hard to understand how this country revolted against the British over taxes and we allow this to happen today. I guess since we are represented now we'll take it in the WAWA.

Walt

Oil Companies actually make less of a profit percentage wise today than they did in the fifties. In the fifties they were primarily running their own crude to their refinery. If the price of crude went up a dollar a barrel it was incentive to run every barrel of crude you could pump out of the ground as your profit margin was larger on barrels from the well. This no longer holds true as they buy the majority of there crude. Oil was shallow and easy to find many a well in the East Texas field was 500 feet. Today we are drilling 5000 feet and deeper in a 1000 feet of water.
 
Txwalt":10orbmdd said:
The government does nothing to find the oil, pump the oil, transport the oil, or refine it but make 4 times off of a gallon of gas than the company doing all the work. You people are mad at the wrong folks.

Walt

Amen. In fact, I posted on the same subject a while back and it was locked after a few threads. Why is this one still going? It's a heckuva lot more "political" than that one was. I don't mind playing by the rules, but let's be consistent here.

This whole thread is a bunch of crap! I've got news for all you folks that are up in arms over gas prices: whining on the internet about it ain't gonna change it. It's gonna take getting off your butts and doing something about it. If you're too lazy, or can't figure out what to do, then learn to deal with it.

Wait. I've got an idea! Let's pass more laws. Yeah, that's it! No wait, let's pass a thousand more laws! We could drive the evil oil companies out of business which would in turn force someone to come up with an alternative fuel source. In the meantime, just ignore the 80% unemployment rate followed by the 100 or so Chinese divisions landing on our beaches.
 
VanC":1rh9b1y8 said:
Txwalt":1rh9b1y8 said:
The government does nothing to find the oil, pump the oil, transport the oil, or refine it but make 4 times off of a gallon of gas than the company doing all the work. You people are mad at the wrong folks.

Walt

Amen. In fact, I posted on the same subject a while back and it was locked after a few threads. Why is this one still going? It's a heckuva lot more "political" than that one was. I don't mind playing by the rules, but let's be consistent here.

This whole thread is a bunch of crap! I've got news for all you folks that are up in arms over gas prices: whining on the internet about it ain't gonna change it. It's gonna take getting off your butts and doing something about it. If you're too lazy, or can't figure out what to do, then learn to deal with it.

Wait. I've got an idea! Let's pass more laws. Yeah, that's it! No wait, let's pass a thousand more laws! We could drive the evil oil companies out of business which would in turn force someone to come up with an alternative fuel source. In the meantime, just ignore the 80% unemployment rate followed by the 100 or so Chinese divisions landing on our beaches.

:nod:
 
There was a new refinery totally permitted and ready
to break ground in the Tuscon AZ area as I understand---
nothing was started because they could not get a contract
for crude supply from Mexico. The giant field in Mexico
is in serious decline.

There is such a thing as Minimum Operating Level in our
gasoline market that most people don't think about.
Below is the article by Tom Whipple, editor of the
Falls Church News-Press in Virginia. He is a retired
CIA analyst. Very enlightening.


The Peak Oil Crisis: The Minimum Operating Level
By Tom Whipple
Thursday, 24 May 2007


There has been much discussion about gasoline inventories in the US lately and rightly so. Every Wednesday morning the Department of Energy releases a snapshot of US oil and product inventories at the end of the preceding week. As US gasoline inventories fell dramatically during the past few months, it is this report, as interpreted by many buyers and sellers of gasoline, that is largely responsible for the record high prices we are paying for gasoline.

Last Thursday, after the report was issued, gasoline prices jumped nearly 10 cents in a single day. On Tuesday of this week, before the report was issued, gasoline prices fell by 10 cents a gallon based on analysts' guesstimates that inventories would increase and there would not be serious shortages this summer. It is clear that the size of our gasoline stockpile has become an important number, not only for everyone who drives, but also for the future of our economy.

The number is currently around 197 million barrels, but there is more to the story than one number. Now that we are all fixated on gasoline inventories, it is important to know that America has two largely unconnected oil worlds – the five west coast states (California, Oregon, Washington, Nevada, and Arizona) and the rest of the country. The West Coast gets its imported gasoline supplies by tanker across the Pacific. The rest of the country gets its imports from tankers across the Atlantic. As there is little transfer of gasoline between the two regions, what comes to the west coast is consumed on the west coast. Thus when one reads of a big change in gasoline imports, it is important to find out which coasts got the imports. Last week for example, 1.2 million of the 1.7 million barrel increase was on the west coast leaving very little to increase the stockpile in the rest of the country.

The next important point about gasoline stockpiles is that not all of it is useable. As gasoline is largely delivered by pipeline, barge and coastal tankers these days, a lot of gasoline is tied up in transit. Thus the amount of gasoline "trapped" in transport is substantial. This "trapped" gasoline is known as the "minimum operating level."

The Department of Energy used to publish this number, but stopped doing so a few years ago on the grounds they were not confident that it was accurate. This week, however, the old number for the minimum operating level surfaced in a 3-year-old government report and it turned out to be 185 million barrels – very close to the 197 million in the inventory. It really does not matter what the actual minimum level is, for any figure remotely close to 197 million is cause for concern. If stockpiles – on either coast – drop much more, we are going to find out, the hard way, exactly where the minimal operating level is, for that will be the day the shortages develop.
Another important factor in the gasoline situation is the increasing amounts of ethanol we are burning. Last year when Consumer Reports tested a bi-fuel Chevrolet first with gasoline and then with 85 percent ethanol, they confirmed that using ethanol drops mileage by 27 percent. The more ethanol produced the more motor fuel we will have to buy just to go the same distance.

This week's stockpile report was on the whole neutral regarding prospects for the summer ahead. Although US refineries managed to increase gasoline production by 100,000 barrels a day to 9.2 million, imports dropped by 200,000 barrels to 1.3 million – still a high number. Total US gasoline inventory increased by 1.5 million barrels last week to 196.7 million barrels, still well below normal and still a cause for concern given the increased demand and the proximity of the summer driving season.

Demand for gasoline over the last four weeks increased by 1.2 percent over the same period last year; however some of this increase is caused by the ethanol mixed into the gasoline in some parts of the country. There is still no sign that $3+ gasoline is having a substantial impact on demand.

There is still a good possibility of trouble ahead; last week's stockpile increase certainly was not enough to prepare us for a Gulf hurricane, or any other kind of major disruption, but it may be enough to get us through the first part of the summer driving season without shortages. These issues are how much we continue to consume and whether imports will stay high. We will know shortly. The distribution of the US stockpiles is still not good with the Midwest and East Coast being the most vulnerable to shortages.

Large US imports of gasoline, mainly from Europe, are starting to raise questions. Last weekend gasoline in Germany went over $7 per gallon and analysts are talking about the possibility of $8 gasoline later this summer. The Europeans note that the US is now importing roughly 1 out of every 8 gallons of gasoline consumed and that there is no end to this imbalance in sight. Some Europeans are beginning to ask whether their governments should be taking action to slow the exports to the US.
 
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