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Travlr said:
Some of the the people here are veterinarians, some have degrees in Animal Science or other Ag related fields, and almost everyone that is on this site has long term real experience in the outdoors and particularly with livestock and predators. Many have a lifetimes worth of experience.

What is your education and experience? Opinions are not all equal...
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Neither is knowledge of the area. No one cut down the forest here. There are no forest here and there weren't any here when the first travelers on the Oregon Trail passed through here. Back over a hundred years ago there was a whole lot more people here than there is now. What are these proper mechanics you talk about? Ranches here are thousands of acres. And I mean that much private land not the BLM of Forest Service grazing leases. These cattle were killed down in the hay meadows. I my case within 300 yards of the house. I know of one case near here where the wolves killed the family dog in the backyard. Same backyard that there 3 and 5 year old kids play in. In Idaho the Lolo elk herd was estimated at over 9,000 elk. Wolves came in and wiped them out. It is now estimated that the elk herd is less than 1,000. Ever been to that area? It is huge and eqsily supported the old numbers of elk.
"It is literally your fault that your cattle is getting attacked". I am working hard to remember this is a family site so I won't say what I think of you and your opinion. But I refuse to get into a battle of wits with an unarmed man.
 
Ned Jr. said:
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I've known a couple of guys that hunt coyotes with greyhounds. Usually two dogs at a time. They usually make short work of a coyote. I wonder how several greyhounds would stack up against a wolf? Maybe even use some slower but more lethal dogs to catch up to the greyhounds once they've stopped the wolf.

I guess the issue there is that it's hard to find a wolf. They don't make themselves visible like a yote will.
 
TheBurningRedRose said:
Alright, that is your opinion. Think about this though...it is literally your fault that your cattle is getting attacked, you don't have the proper mechanics in place to keep prey out, and we as humans...I see the wolves attacking our cattle as karma..for us taking their homes, forest, and prey. Still, if you have the proper mechanics in place, you may have fewer wolve attacks on your livestock. I'm not saying you are a bad livestock owner, and I realize that not everything is in our hands let alone in our control, but you have to realize again, that wolves are only doing what instinct tells them to do to survive. Yes, nature is cruel sometimes, but...we are crueler and we need to think more about our actions toward wildlife before we act on them. Still my condolences to you as well if you are also losing livestock to wolves.
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Wolves are incompatible with ranching. They are neither endangered nor threatened. There are thousands of them. Forcing them back into areas of the Lower 48 states was purely a political move. It's easy to think wolves are great if you don't have to actually deal with them.
 
Dave said:
Neither is knowledge of the area. No one cut down the forest here. There are no forest here and there weren't any here when the first travelers on the Oregon Trail passed through here. Back over a hundred years ago there was a whole lot more people here than there is now. What are these proper mechanics you talk about? Ranches here are thousands of acres. And I mean that much private land not the BLM of Forest Service grazing leases. These cattle were killed down in the hay meadows. I my case within 300 yards of the house. I know of one case near here where the wolves killed the family dog in the backyard. Same backyard that there 3 and 5 year old kids play in. In Idaho the Lolo elk herd was estimated at over 9,000 elk. Wolves came in and wiped them out. It is now estimated that the elk herd is less than 1,000. Ever been to that area? It is huge and eqsily supported the old numbers of elk.
"It is literally your fault that your cattle is getting attacked". I am working hard to remember this is a family site so I won't say what I think of you and your opinion. But I refuse to get into a battle of wits with an unarmed man.
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I think you replied to the wrong post there, Dave. But have at it. It needs saying.
 
That's nice if that is how you feel. You are simply assuming that is why I like wolves...is because I don't have to deal with them. You're wrong. I like Wolves, Hawks, and Eagles, to me, they are special animals that should not be harmed period. But what would you know right? You are just some person on the internet, just like the rest of us...trying to act like you know me...who is a stranger to you. Have a good night, I'm done with this conversation, and with this topic on this forum. I gave my condolences, it's up to them to accept them or not.
 
We don't have a wolf problem around here thankfully. But it's open season year round on coyotes. The cows are stirred up something fierce at the lease place. I've never seen em act the way they are. Very tight nit. And calves are always in a group. Very tight. Mamas always close and on alert.

Gonna try and call some up this weekend. The triple deuce is sighted an inch high at 100. I'll take pictures. I like pictures.
 
TheBurningRedRose said:
That's nice if that is how you feel. You are simply assuming that is why I like wolves...is because I don't have to deal with them. You're wrong. I like Wolves, Hawks, and Eagles, to me, they are special animals that should not be harmed period. But what would you know right? You are just some person on the internet, just like the rest of us...trying to act like you know me...who is a stranger to you. Have a good night, I'm done with this conversation, and with this topic on this forum. I gave my condolences, it's up to them to accept them or not.
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I think it would be better if you not only gave your condolences, and the good bye done with the conversation speech, and go find another forum with people of your same thoughts. You make references that @Dave was wrong in his assumption that you do not have to deal with them... but you offer absolutely NO other references to what experience you have dealing with them; if you have animals or what your experience is. Do not go about making suppositions and comments about a person's life or about what they do or don't know when you have done nothing but make comments about people you know nothing about either. Most on here have operations that can be proven... most on here are hard working, gut busting people that can verify their operations in a heartbeat... and they refrain from making such sweeping comments about others in most cases until their own integrity is questioned.

Most every farmer and rancher is not anti wildlife... but we get tired of the ones that espouse all the wonderfulness of the wildlife and yet complain and bi#@H about the costs of their food. I dealt with losing 122 free range laying hens one year and listened to neighbors that went on and on about how beautiful the eagle was... yet accused me of being "cruel" by using a LGD in the pasture, to try to protect the hens from the eagle with it's presence in the pasture... and then continued on to have a fit over the fact that my free range eggs cost too much money when they could go buy eggs in the grocery store for less... but that eggs from "factory farms" were not healthy.... I do not believe in going about and just killing animals for no reason... but that eagle would have been put 6 ft deep in a hole if they were not reintroduced into this area and most are chipped... it was too easy for it to live off my chickens... and dropping them in a neighbors yard some days... that to target the mice/rats/rabbits/fish they were supposed to be brought into this area for. I have no desire to go to jail, but I am not going to listen to people that think they should not be controlled when one becomes a menace to the surrounding livestock. The next thing is where would you be if they killed a child..or an adult... like the cougars in CA have done with some of the joggers....
 
The reality is, there is only so much anybody can do to keep predators out.
Coyotes put me out of the sheep business due to heavy losses and we tried about every form of protection there is and nothing was perfect.
When somebody looses 1 or more calves /cattle that is a substantial loss to an already thin profit margin at best.
When you go out and find dead and mangled livestock that's not a nice feeling at all.
We have to constantly worry about black buzzards and coyotes killing newborn calves.
We lost a calf to buzzards this year, and over the last few years probably 3 more, and had to save several calves from them or the losses would be much higher.
As far as I'm concerned these predatory animals don't need any protection status and should only be in a zoo.
 
Ky hills said:
The reality is, there is only so much anybody can do to keep predators out.
Coyotes put me out of the sheep business due to heavy losses and we tried about every form of protection there is and nothing was perfect.
When somebody looses 1 or more calves /cattle that is a substantial loss to an already thin profit margin at best.
When you go out and find dead and mangled livestock that's not a nice feeling at all.
We have to constantly worry about black buzzards and coyotes killing newborn calves.
We lost a calf to buzzards this year, and over the last few years probably 3 more, and had to save several calves from them or the losses would be much higher.
As far as I'm concerned these predatory animals don't need any protection status and should only be in a zoo.
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I'd be okay if they released wolves inside an appropriately fenced area, like Yellowstone, as long as they also allowed any wolves, black buzzards, etc. to be shot outside of the fences. Let the people interested in restocking wolves donate their own money to pay for the fences and let's really see how many people are interested in having wolves in the park.
 
Dave said:
Next door neighbor had 3 calves chewed by the wolf last night. All 3 confirmed to be a wolf attack. None of them are dead right now but they figure one might make it. Little to no hope for the other 2. After we kill this wolf we need to find the people who thought reintroducing them was a good idea. This makes 5 confirmed and one that the fish and wildlife guy wouldn't confirm but we know it was a wolf all in a relatively small area. How much are 6 weaned calves worth on today's market? Now with 2 separate confirmed attacks we will get a kill permit. But that will take at least 2 weeks. How many more will it kill before they issue the kill permit?
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shoot, run over with truck and shovel
 
Travlr said:
I'd be okay if they released wolves inside an appropriately fenced area, like Yellowstone, as long as they also allowed any wolves, black buzzards, etc. to be shot outside of the fences. Let the people interested in restocking wolves donate their own money to pay for the fences and let's really see how many people are interested in having wolves in the park.
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That's what I'm saying, have those wolves where they can't be a threat to people or livestock, and if there are any free roaming wolves do not place them under any kind of protection status.
Like the recent proposal to release grizzly bears somewhere. I can't remember where it was, but the people of that area were understandably opposed to it as the were concerned for their safety as well as livestock.
I'm being a bit facetious but why shouldn't the people in cities that want these animals released want them in released in their cities after all those cities were once natural habitats too and animals are very adaptive. They would have a lot of reasons why that was a bad idea, yet they don't care about the safety and financial hardship they cause rural people.
 
Wolves are wandering through quite a bit the last while. I did see 4 a few mornings ago but no time to get a shot off.
Wolves are easy enough to kill, they come in to a bait well enough. The trick is having the spare time to put in sitting in a blind for hours on end.
 
Ky hills said:
That's what I'm saying, have those wolves where they can't be a threat to people or livestock, and if there are any free roaming wolves do not place them under any kind of protection status.
Like the recent proposal to release grizzly bears somewhere. I can't remember where it was, but the people of that area were understandably opposed to it as the were concerned for their safety as well as livestock.
I'm being a bit facetious but why shouldn't the people in cities that want these animals released want them in released in their cities after all those cities were once natural habitats too and animals are very adaptive. They would have a lot of reasons why that was a bad idea, yet they don't care about the safety and financial hardship they cause rural people.
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Maybe we should start an environmental group to repopulate wolves and grizzlies in Central Park and the east coast cities. I'm game... could be fun.
 
Travlr said:
Maybe we should start an environmental group to repopulate wolves and grizzlies in Central Park and the east coast cities. I'm game... could be fun.
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I have thought that for a long time. Grizzlies need to be returned to the streets of San Francisco. The cougar was once present
from coast to coast. The gangs need something to focus on besides destroying other peoples lives.
 
Travlr said:
I'd be okay if they released wolves inside an appropriately fenced area, like Yellowstone, as long as they also allowed any wolves, black buzzards, etc. to be shot outside of the fences. Let the people interested in restocking wolves donate their own money to pay for the fences and let's really see how many people are interested in having wolves in the park.
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That will never happen because those types like spending other people's money.
 
CowboyRam said:
That will never happen because those types like spending other people's money.
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Yeah those folks in the city think it's fine to turn problematic animals loose in the rural areas, but when they reach the city you start seeing people scared and worried about dangerous animals in the city.
Not to long ago it made the Lexington news about a coyote in a neighborhood.
All of a sudden people were scared for their children and pets, yet people in surrounding counties have been dealing with coyotes for decades.
Same with black bears. it makes the news and people in the city get interviewed about being scared of them when they've been several surrounding area counties for quite a while and those peoples concerns are never heard.
 
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