Turn around

[Jake]

Had the bull get in with the repl. heifers last winter and evidently bred one as we had one that was pregged 6 mo. calve today. Pretty good turnaround for her to calf unassisted at 18 months. Grant it the average weight was right at 975# at preg time a month ago so they can all handle calving right now anyways. Make a guy think about always turnin the bull in that early.

 

[Chris H]

Ohio St university has done some work on breeding spring heifers to calve in the fall as 18 month olds. It's been 5 years or so that I read about it. We have a couple due Nov 1st because the bull broke the gate. We'll watch them a bit closer but they are good size heifers. It's usually the real growthy ones that come in early anyway.

 

[ENNOT]

It makes a guy really realize to pull the bulls after at most 90 days. We have a friend that had two heifers get knocked up when they were real young last summer. They calved alright, but it sure is hard on them.

 

[Jake]

we quite regularly have heifers calve at 14-17 months with no problems. Probably two a year on average.

 

[sidney411]

We'll see how ours turn out this year. I put a young bull with 3 heifers that I just weaned. I've heard from quite a few sources that do it this way so we are trying it this time.

 

[Ronald Boggess]

We'll see how ours turn out this year. I put a young bull with 3 heifers that I just weaned. I've heard from quite a few sources that do it this way so we are trying it this time.

I don't understand why you would do that. Maybe I am missing something here.

Ron

 

[Brandonm2]

I agree with Ronald. I don't know ANYBODY who turns a bull loose with weaned heifers. Why stunt the heifer??? or risk killing it?? For your sake I hope the heifers were at least 600 lbs and that bull was a Longhorn or Jersey.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

Had the bull get in with the repl. heifers last winter and evidently bred one as we had one that was pregged 6 mo. calve today. Pretty good turnaround for her to calf unassisted at 18 months. Grant it the average weight was right at 975# at preg time a month ago so they can all handle calving right now anyways. Make a guy think about always turnin the bull in that early.

you get away with it because yall have a good program . its plain too see yall are cattlemen. dont think i would mess with a good thing

 

[Jake]

you get away with it because yall have a good program . its plain too see yall are cattlemen. dont think i would mess with a good thing

Thank you, we pelvic most all our heifers and if they can't pass a Buick we won't keep them but we still breed heifers and cows to calving ease bulls because there isn't enough difference in a 100# cow and 75# calf come wean time. Not to mention I have no market for dead calves...

The only calves we've had to pull out of heifers even as young at 15 months old are malpresentations. Grandpa's old culling technique for calving ease was they had it or died. :lol:

 

[msscamp]

We'll see how ours turn out this year. I put a young bull with 3 heifers that I just weaned. I've heard from quite a few sources that do it this way so we are trying it this time.

I don't understand why you would intentionally do this, either. :???: First calf heifers that calve at apprx 2 years of age don't produce as much milk as their more mature herdmates, it will undoubtedly only be worse for a younger heifer. I know that has been the case when we've had weaning age (or younger) heifers get bred and calve. Not to mention the added stress due to probable calving difficulties, increased chances of rejecting the calf, and high probability of the mother not attaining her full potential - growth wise. I'm missing something. :?

 

[sidney411]

MSCAMP, you are saying you should not calve a heifer at 2 years = 24 mts? You should wait longer then that? I have had no problems calving at 24 mts, it's time for them to start paying their own room and board by that time.

So I left out a few details....geez. They are 11 mths old and the bull is 12 mts. They (heifers) have been in the weaning pasture (fenceline weaned) a month to make sure they know what a feed bunk and water trough is. The absolute earliest calf would come at 20 mts IF they bred the day I put them together. Do you still see a problem with that?

My grandfather-in-law has been running cattle for 50 years and this is how he raises heifers every year, 50 to 100 every year. He has never had a problem except malpresentations, which can happen in any heifer or cow. He told us how he runs his operation and we are trying to follow some of his direction that makes since to us. We've been calving heifers at 24-26 mts for the past years and wanted to try it earlier. If I am missing something then I would sure like to learn.

 

[dun]

MSCAMP, you are saying you should not calve a heifer at 2 years = 24 mts? You should wait longer then that? I have had no problems calving at 24 mts, it's time for them to start paying their own room and board by that time.

So I left out a few details....geez. They are 11 mths old and the bull is 12 mts. They (heifers) have been in the weaning pasture (fenceline weaned) a month to make sure they know what a feed bunk and water trough is. The absolute earliest calf would come at 20 mts IF they bred the day I put them together. Do you still see a problem with that?

My grandfather-in-law has been running cattle for 50 years and this is how he raises heifers every year, 50 to 100 every year. He has never had a problem except malpresentations, which can happen in any heifer or cow. He told us how he runs his operation and we are trying to follow some of his direction that makes since to us. We've been calving heifers at 24-26 mts for the past years and wanted to try it earlier. If I am missing something then I would sure like to learn.

In your post you said you had just weaned the heifrs. Most people wean around 6-7 months not as short yearlings. I think that's where the confusion came in. Her comment about the 2 year olds calving was more of a qualification for a 15-16 month calving which is what you would have with heifers that were weaned at 6-7 months

dun

 

[ALACOWMAN]

MSCAMP, you are saying you should not calve a heifer at 2 years = 24 mts? You should wait longer then that? I have had no problems calving at 24 mts, it's time for them to start paying their own room and board by that time.

So I left out a few details....geez. They are 11 mths old and the bull is 12 mts. They (heifers) have been in the weaning pasture (fenceline weaned) a month to make sure they know what a feed bunk and water trough is. The absolute earliest calf would come at 20 mts IF they bred the day I put them together. Do you still see a problem with that?

My grandfather-in-law has been running cattle for 50 years and this is how he raises heifers every year, 50 to 100 every year. He has never had a problem except malpresentations, which can happen in any heifer or cow. He told us how he runs his operation and we are trying to follow some of his direction that makes since to us. We've been calving heifers at 24-26 mts for the past years and wanted to try it earlier. If I am missing something then I would sure like to learn.

well atleast you wean them neighbors on both side's of me just let the heifer's stay in with the cows year after year their cows that should mature at around 1100-1200 and wean a 6 weight calve too a 800 pound cow that weans a 3 weight calve. nothing wrong with a small cow if she has the potentail to wean a heavy calf but a structurally stunted cow can be a problem

 

[msscamp]

MSCAMP, you are saying you should not calve a heifer at 2 years = 24 mts? You should wait longer then that? I have had no problems calving at 24 mts, it's time for them to start paying their own room and board by that time.

So I left out a few details....geez. They are 11 mths old and the bull is 12 mts. They (heifers) have been in the weaning pasture (fenceline weaned) a month to make sure they know what a feed bunk and water trough is. The absolute earliest calf would come at 20 mts IF they bred the day I put them together. Do you still see a problem with that?

My grandfather-in-law has been running cattle for 50 years and this is how he raises heifers every year, 50 to 100 every year. He has never had a problem except malpresentations, which can happen in any heifer or cow. He told us how he runs his operation and we are trying to follow some of his direction that makes since to us. We've been calving heifers at 24-26 mts for the past years and wanted to try it earlier. If I am missing something then I would sure like to learn.

Sidney, you stated that you put the bull in with 3 heifers that you just weaned. That, to me, means that those heifers were 6 - maybe 7 months old. That is the sole reason that I questioned why you would do this. I think you will agree that there is a world of difference between a just weaned heifer and a heifer that is 11 or so months of age. I certainly don't have a problem with heifers calving at approx 24 months of age - we do it every year. I'm really sorry that I flunked mind-reading 101, but I can only go by what was actually posted instead of what was meant.

 

[Beefy]

just weaned may to one person mean that i just took my calves away from their dams, or it may mean they have been successfully weaned (a few weeks to a few months of separation). that could be 6 months or 12months. i guess a weanling may be just weaned until its just bred and yearlings could qualify as just weaned. whoa, and ouch. time for me to go to bed.

 

[msscamp]

just weaned may to one person mean that i just took my calves away from their dams, or it may mean they have been successfully weaned (a few weeks to a few months of separation). that could be 6 months or 12months. i guess a weanling may be just weaned until its just bred and yearlings could qualify as just weaned. whoa, and ouch. time for me to go to bed.

I guess this is another of those regional differences things. A 'just weaned' heifer in my area means exactly that - that she was very recently taken off her mother. A weaning/weanling (sometimes called a coming yearling) calf, on the other hand, means that the calf has been weaned anywhere from a week up to the age of being classified as a yearling. Calves do not qualify for the 'just weaned' terminology past a week (although they are not actually weaned, they have quit bawling for their mother), nor are yearlings referred to as weaning calves- they are yearlings. Past the 'yearling' stage, they are referred to as 'coming 2-year olds'. Just the way I learned it.

 

[sidney411]

OK, so if I have this right:
from birth to the day they are removed from their milk source, be that man or beast, they are just a calf.
from that day for the next 1-2 weeks they are "just weaned"
from then to 12 mts they are weanlings
from 12 - 24 mts they are yearlings
from the day they give birth for the 1st time they are cows till they die. Unless you get into the whole 1st calf heifer, 2nd calf heifer, heferette, ect.

Is this right? This is so confusing

 

[dun]

OK, so if I have this right:
from birth to the day they are removed from their milk source, be that man or beast, they are just a calf.
from that day for the next 1-2 weeks they are "just weaned"
from then to 12 mts they are weanlings
from 12 - 24 mts they are yearlings
from the day they give birth for the 1st time they are cows till they die. Unless you get into the whole 1st calf heifer, 2nd calf heifer, heferette, ect.

Is this right? This is so confusing

That pretty well sums it up. But regional variations are alwasy a possibility.
With us a steer is a calf until he's butchered. Heifers are short eyarlings, 10-11 months or so, yealring 11-13/14 months, long yearlings until about 20 months then coming 2 year olds.
But before they calf they are heifers, after they calve for the first time, thery're cows. But we call them first calvers or second calvers, but they're still cows.
Never really worried all that much about terminology, but I guess it can be confusing if you don;t know what the other person means.
I've heard so many srange variations that I convert whatever they other guy calls them to what I call them in my head.
Thinking back, now I understand why a guy that I was looking at some cows with got so confused. He kept referring to 2nd calf heifers and I was calling them 2nd calf cows.

dun

 

[dcara]

On a similar note, I finally got a copy of Ensminger's "The Stockmans Handbook" a couple weeks ago. In it he says, in effect, that it is less stressful to the calf to move them completely out of sight, smell, and hearing range of the cow. Yet I had always heard that fence line weaning was less stressful. Has anyone tried both ways to see which is less stressful? And how do you measure stress in such a situation? Maybe by how long they moo, or how much weight they loose?

 

[dun]

On a similar note, I finally got a copy of Ensminger's "The Stockmans Handbook" a couple weeks ago. In it he says, in effect, that it is less stressful to the calf to move them completely out of sight, smell, and hearing range of the cow. Yet I had always heard that fence line weaning was less stressful. Has anyone tried both ways to see which is less stressful? And how do you measure stress in such a situation? Maybe by how long they moo, or how much weight they loose?

When was it written? All the references I see were back in 1965. I would think that maybe the industry ahs progressed and figured out better ways of doing things in 40 years. But I agree that total removal would be less stressful then having them within hearing range, unless they are in adjoining pastures where they can interact to a degree along the fence.

dun