Trouble with calf.
- Thread starter Carnivore
- Start date
Bez?
Well-known member
Muratic":2o2hvh86 said:
Grab one for me too please.
Bez?
A
Anonymous
Beefy":tcferqc3 said:
give it a shot huh?...convince Carnivore of that, about his "natural selection"...and this situation is coming from a person who once asked if every black cow in the world was a black angus...in my opinion, I really don't believe carnivore has any business raising cattle, if someone is not willing to even seperate them, to give the calf the slightest chance or living. then they shouldn't be allowed to raise cattle...just my opinion
Jogeephus
Well-known member
I think some of you are being too hard on Carnivore. You are assuming a lot. Each person's situation is different and whether or not you put down a calf is a private matter. Each situation is different.
Carnivore
Well-known member
Okay, relax everyone. I put the calf down.
It actually turns out the calf was likely not pre-mature, just small and as it turns out, deformed. It's hips looked like the rear legs were out of socket, and front legs too short. I have had four previous calves, and none looked like this one did.
After posting my first post, I went out in the pasture to work with the calf, came back in to read the posts, and then took the .22 out.
Now, a little history...
The first calf the mother had, it head butted it around the pasture for several hours, but that calf was pretty mobile, on it's feet immediately after birth, and eventually mom let it suckle and the calf did just fine. That was why I felt this one might have a chance.
Interestingly, (and unfortunately) this calf was a result of an inbreeding mistake, as the father of this calf was incorrectly castrated, (banded, but missed the testicles), which stayed up in the abdomen. The result should have been a sterile bull calf, but obviously there was some viable semen. And, the bull was the son of the cow, which apparently and/or likely lead to the deformation.
I have posted this to educate people who might face a similar situation. I admit to making mistakes, and hope others do not make similar ones.
I am a little suprised at the vehemance of some of the posts though, I had thought this board was about solving problems and education, not castigation. But, to each his own.
Thanks to those who gave some reasoned insight and guidence.
It actually turns out the calf was likely not pre-mature, just small and as it turns out, deformed. It's hips looked like the rear legs were out of socket, and front legs too short. I have had four previous calves, and none looked like this one did.
After posting my first post, I went out in the pasture to work with the calf, came back in to read the posts, and then took the .22 out.
Now, a little history...
The first calf the mother had, it head butted it around the pasture for several hours, but that calf was pretty mobile, on it's feet immediately after birth, and eventually mom let it suckle and the calf did just fine. That was why I felt this one might have a chance.
Interestingly, (and unfortunately) this calf was a result of an inbreeding mistake, as the father of this calf was incorrectly castrated, (banded, but missed the testicles), which stayed up in the abdomen. The result should have been a sterile bull calf, but obviously there was some viable semen. And, the bull was the son of the cow, which apparently and/or likely lead to the deformation.
I have posted this to educate people who might face a similar situation. I admit to making mistakes, and hope others do not make similar ones.
I am a little suprised at the vehemance of some of the posts though, I had thought this board was about solving problems and education, not castigation. But, to each his own.
Thanks to those who gave some reasoned insight and guidence.
Carnivore":2kjz2iqg said:
This is the main problem with this board in my opinion. it causes people to either not ask questions and/or comment or to do so privately and either way not as many people benefit from it. i am guilty of it too from time to time.
Beefy":fh31qcuw said:
Ok, I understand what you are saying...about asking for advice and getting criticism. And, you are right about that.
This just tweaked me. I can remember helping my Daddy pull calves that weren't breathing and him jerking them up and blowing in their noses. AND, if a cow wouldn't let the calf nurse, she got milked and I fed that calf...AND, if the calf didn't want to drink, I sat on that calf (I was but a mere child at the time), and did my best to force that calf to drink. AND, if I couldn't get the calf to drink, the calf got tubed the colostrum.
Beefy, it's hard for me, raised the way I was, to accept freakin' "natural selection," that's all. In defference to what you've pointed out about people getting nothing but criticism, I won't say another word. Mea Culpa
Alice
Alice":1ktwtm59 said:
ive been raised the same way. as a result i have a pretty good instinct about whats salvageable and whats not. the concept of natural selection makes good sense to me (i mean its worked thus far), however my wallet and heart tend to disagree with it.
A
Anonymous
Beefy":29ainvpg said:
so we was just supposed to say "yeah...good idea...just let the calf lay there until it dies
"????...yeah...that would have really helped something huh? :roll: ...things are different when the well being of an animal is on the line...the calf can't lay there for days and days...he was told what to do, and he was told to do it quickly...vehement?...maybe so, but he did the right thing in the end anywaysCarnivore
If you had stated all the facts as you just presented them you would have most certainly have gotten different responses.
That is a problem most of us when asking questions we don't give all of the information that is needed to get advice.
If you had stated all the facts as you just presented them you would have most certainly have gotten different responses.
That is a problem most of us when asking questions we don't give all of the information that is needed to get advice.
Heritage_Farmboy":npu8u19h said:Beefy":npu8u19h said:
so we was just supposed to say "yeah...good idea...just let the calf lay there until it dies
no but it would have been a little classier than insinuating the man or woman is retarded or dumb for his/her beliefs.
A
Anonymous
Beefy":2e3bswgy said:Heritage_Farmboy":2e3bswgy said:Beefy":2e3bswgy said:
so we was just supposed to say "yeah...good idea...just let the calf lay there until it dies
no but it would have been a little classier than insinuating the man or woman is retarded or dumb for his/her beliefs.
well I sure as heck got more class than to sit and watch one of my calves lay there and die...that's for sure...I got more class than to hide behind some "natural selection" crap...my cattle are my responsibility, I put them on the farm, I fenced them in, so i'll take care of them too...natural selection...what kind of BS is that...natural huh?...what part of our cattle businesses are natural...is it natural for cattle to built fences around themselves and is it natural for them load themselves on a bus and go get butchered? there nothing is natural about it, so I dont give a crap about natural selection, now if were to walk around and see a bunch of wild cattle somewhere...and the calf laying on the ground half dead, then I wouldn't bother it...that really would be natural selection, but that's not how it is on a farm...we chose to put them on our own farms, so we should be the ones taking care of them...I aint sure how you run your farm but i'd sure like to see what part is natural about it :roll:
Carnivore
Well-known member
I would have liked to have had the time to state all the facts to begin with, but I was faced with having to make a decision, and wanted some quick input before I made that decision. To have taken the time to write out the entire history might have been seen as cruel, when I had to do something outside.
Again, thanks for the input.
Again, thanks for the input.
If you needed quick input as what to do your first thought should have been what is the vets phone #. There is alot of useful information and experience on these boards, but not the place to make fast decisions from. The internet may be fast but not as fast as the call to the vet.
Carnivore
Well-known member
Angus Guy":15j44gx0 said:
Angus Guy:
I understand, but this wasn't a medical problem, but a calf raising problem. ANY vet I would have called, (even if I could have called one at 7:00 pm), would not have the collective knowledge and experience of this board.
BTW, it was the vet who told me that the bull calf was likely sterile.
Alice":8y79ujap said:
My vet tells me you can purchase Bovine IgG for IV use, similar to the equine version that's used regularly on foals that do not get their colostrum. So far I haven't been able to locate the stuff but I'm almost positive I saw it in the clinic fridge the other day. :? When I find the manufact. name and all I'll let you know.
Any vet worth his/her salt would have been more than happy to answer your questions at 6:00AM. Asking the vet about non-medical problems often times helps to avoid medical problems down the road. I constantly ask my vet about nutrition, minieral, and various other things.Most vets want to look at the whole herd management to be able to give the best advice. So heres some advice since we have the time to gather all the information. Put the vet on speed-dial and don't be afraid to use it.
