Trespassers & Damage

[HOSS]

Just have to vent a little. Yesterday I went out to a 60 acre piece of land that I run a few head on. Upon entering the gate I noticed that it was unlatched and I also noticed horseshoe prints in the mud. I do not own any horses. I back tracked them to the back gate where the chain staple was busted out of the post and the gate was standing open. Lucky for me this gate is down a wooded lane and the cows seldom go down it but stay up in the pasture. It was obvious that horse was used to push up against the gate and pop the chain. The riders went on through even though there are no trespassing signs on each gate post. They rode through and threw out beer cans every couple hundred yards. They opened the front gate because my gates are set up so that they cannot swing out from the inside but only in. This keeps cows that push against or lean on the gate from popping the chain. I was ticked. I am adding heavy chains and padlocks as well as trail camera to catch these maggots. I could have lost some cows or had them get into the road and get someone hurt.

 

[msscamp]

Venting is allowed. I'm glad your cows were where they were supposed to be, and I wish you the best of luck in identifying the people responsible. I'm thinking kids, considering the number of beer cans you found, but I could be wrong on that.

 

[Mahoney Pursley Ranch]

Hot wire the gates. When them horses throw off the rider they will stay off your property.

 

[msscamp]

Hot wire the gates. When them horses throw off the rider they will stay off your property.

Great idea! :lol: :lol:

 

[mdmdogs3]

careful on the hotwire - liability --
the kid on the horse gets thrown - the EMS crew sees the hot wire while waiting for the chopper - they testify against you in the courtroom........... you now are the former owner of cows and property and the attorneys have bigger bankaccounts

 

[msscamp]

careful on the hotwire - liability --
the kid on the horse gets thrown - the EMS crew sees the hot wire while waiting for the chopper - they testify against you in the courtroom........... you now are the former owner of cows and property and the attorneys have bigger bankaccounts

The property is posted for no trespassing, what is the issue? I don't understand.

 

[mdmdogs3]

ok - I jumped to a conclusion that he was setting a trap - bad thing jumping to conclusions
now excluding my conclusion jumping - if that hotwire were attached to an entire perimiter hot fence now that is another matter and could quite easily be used to keep critters out as well as critters in.... ;-)

 

[cypressfarms]

My sympathies Hoss,

I can't stand people like that. Makes you want to stay up all night with a shotgun full of rocksalt.

From what you said, it was done on Saturday night. Make note of it. As Msscamp said, the beer cans could be a sign of younger guys, but I wouldn't think too young. Any other clues to go by???

 

[msscamp]

ok - I jumped to a conclusion that he was setting a trap - bad thing jumping to conclusions
now excluding my conclusion jumping - if that hotwire were attached to an entire perimiter hot fence now that is another matter and could quite easily be used to keep critters out as well as critters in.... ;-)

Yeah, I hear you - been guilty of that myself on more occassions than I care to count. I'm not clear about what you mean with regard to the perimeter fence because, generally speaking, the whole purpose of a perimeter fence is to keep some animals (the neighbors) out, as well as to keep some animals (the property owners) in. :? Maybe it's a difference in regions, but a hotwire attached to a 5 or 6 strand barbed wire fence will do that with no problem. Might be a bit of overkill, but it looks to me like the owner of the property is justified in his/her decision.

 

[aplusmnt]

careful on the hotwire - liability --
the kid on the horse gets thrown - the EMS crew sees the hot wire while waiting for the chopper - they testify against you in the courtroom........... you now are the former owner of cows and property and the attorneys have bigger bankaccounts

I would be careful with this also. What we think is common sense justice and what the courts think, is two different things. Any time you set a trap that could hurt someone even if it is posted you MIGHT be liable in the laws eyes. Depends on a lot of things, such as your local state laws.

I know of a case in MO years ago where a guy put up a fence wire were some kids had been riding motorcycles through his property that adjoined a common area were they rode. He probably had 20 no trespassing signs in that area. He got mad they still went through there and put up a fence right were the worn trail was. It was not a fence to keep in animals it was obvious it was set up just to get the people riding the motorcycles. A person got hurt and he got into some serious trouble. Not sure how it all panned out but they filed charges against him and I know the family sued.

Laws are real touchy on rather you do something to try to hurt someone vs doing something to keep them out such as big chain and locks.

 

[aplusmnt]

Googled this issue and a few articles came up about it. For a few states.

http://www.askthelawguy.info/ask2/2006.03.01_arch.html

North Carolina

While a property owner has the right to exclude others from his property and even use reasonable force to prevent someone from entering his property, in general you cannot set traps to catch trespassers.

Think about it this way: a landowner might decide to put up an electrified fence to keep out trespassers, but if the fence was not marked with signs, the owner might be liable for injuries to someone touching the fence.


http://www.cwmuutahwildlife.org/trespass.htm

Utah

The duty of care owned by landowner or person in charge to a trespasser is to refrain from willfully, maliciously or recklessly injuring them. In other words, a landowner or person in charge cannot set traps for trespassers. A trap is a hazard that is known to the landowner or person in charge, but concealed to others. If a trespasser is injured by a trap, the landowner is open to liability for the injury, even though the trespasser violated he law by trespassing.

 

[Crowderfarms]

Hoss,

Sorry that happened, but there is a growing number of individuals that think what you own is there for their recreational purposes. Here in Tennessee, all people are trespassing if they are found on your land without written permission.

We had a similiar problem out at our other Farm over the weekend. We had been hauling out rolls, and left the gate open for a couple days, the Coon hunters and Bow Hunters had made themselves a hiway out there.Locked it down and I hope that PO'd a few.

 

[warpaint]

As a trailride enthusist and also a beer enthusist ,I find this kind of behaviour despicable. I hope the bigger chains and padlocks work for you Hoss.
Wouldn't it be a hoot if you could actually catch them in the act and lock em into your pasture?

 

[jcummins]

The law is not the will of the people. Trepass is not right, and no amount of laws will change that.

Thought I was a law abiding citizen....but when it comes to this, I guess I'm on the wrong side of the law.

 

[cypressfarms]

Wouldn't it be a hoot if you could actually catch them in the act and lock em into your pasture?

Great idea Paint. I would go one step farther. I would lock them in and call the police. You can press criminal charges against them. Throwing beer cans as well; that's littering. I'd hit 'em with the book. (would prefer to hit 'em with something else)

Come to think of it, Hoss, it may be a good idea for you to file a complaint with your local sheriff's office. That way they will have something on file if the stuff hits the fan.

 

[HOSS]

My sympathies Hoss,

I can't stand people like that. Makes you want to stay up all night with a shotgun full of rocksalt.

From what you said, it was done on Saturday night. Make note of it. As Msscamp said, the beer cans could be a sign of younger guys, but I wouldn't think too young. Any other clues to go by???

I could tell by the tracks that one horse was bigger than the other and was a paint or multi-colored based upon the hair left on the gate. The big horse left a funny print that suggested a heavy rider shifted to one side.

A few months ago before we fenced it off two guys rode through and said they were looking for a dog. One was riding a big paint and the other a chestnut. The guy on the big paint was your stereotypical big bellied redneck and his saddle bag was dripping water from melting ice. I assumed it might be beer due to his red faced demeanor. They had asked if we cared if they rode across the property (this was after they had ignored the signs and came on it anyway). Said that they had been riding across it for years. I politley told them that it was being fenced for cattle and would not be open to riders. He seemed a little put out. These two could be my tresspassers.

 

[sidney411]

I'd bet they were. They probably know when your there and when your not and how to get away with it. If you could get them on tape could you prosecute them?

 

[Jogeephus]

I'd bet they were. They probably know when your there and when your not and how to get away with it. If you could get them on tape could you prosecute them?

Yeah, don't you love it. My daddy's brothers cousins sister said it was OK to ride out here since mamma's sister cousin used to date the man the worked for the man the owned the place before you bought it. I here that #$@% all the time. Caught 4 Sunday. They were upset when I asked them to leave and informed them they were trespassing as though the gate and the signs weren't sufficient.

Key point. If you are going to prosecute, what will you get them for? Next to nothing. Key is to be sure they do at least $500 worth of damage to your gates or whatever. Document it. This is felony trespass. DA won't snivel at this.

 

[msscamp]

Wouldn't it be a hoot if you could actually catch them in the act and lock em into your pasture?

Come to think of it, Hoss, it may be a good idea for you to file a complaint with your local sheriff's office. That way they will have something on file if the stuff hits the fan.

That is an excellent point, Cypress!

 

[AngusLimoX]

Come to think of it, Hoss, it may be a good idea for you to file a complaint with your local sheriff's office. That way they will have something on file if the stuff hits the fan.

Best suggestion yet. If it gets dirty ( you find some cattle shot,buildings burned, fence tore out ) you wanna have a paper trail with the law. Especially if it goes civil because credibility will be an issue.

Don't let them get away with it.