IluvABbeef
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Texas Longhorn sets record...
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TxStateCowboy
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Garbage.
KANSAS":2eltxd0r said:
He probably thinks she's a watusi cross to get those kinds of horns. Dickinson does also raise watusi, and Bue Lingo... but then again Dickinson has been raising longhorns since 1967 so could it have been all those years of breeding selectively to do what they thought were 'improving' their cattle?
heres a link to the webpage on Dickinson's website for the cow:
http://www.texaslonghorn.net/reference/ ... g=I-230255
I would like to know what some, or all, of you Longhorn breeders think about the breeder selling clones of this cow?
Is it different than cloning a great major beef producing breed, Angus, Hereford, Beefmaster, ect? I'm not trying to start a debate about wether are not a Longhorn is a beef breed, this is clearly about the horns.
Alan
Is it different than cloning a great major beef producing breed, Angus, Hereford, Beefmaster, ect? I'm not trying to start a debate about wether are not a Longhorn is a beef breed, this is clearly about the horns.
Alan
I would not consider myself a longhorn breeder, but I do have 20+ longhorn heifers/cows. However, I have no interest in owning a clone of anything. I run longhorns because they are the most self sufficient breed I can find, and I do not have alot of time to care for cattle.
Running Arrow Bill
Well-known member
Dickinson Cattle Company isn't the only breeder that has "gorgeous" cows/cattle...lol. They do a lot of advertising and promoting...
We have some gorgeous LH's too... ;-)
Anyhoo...I'm AGAINST CLONING! One of the special things about Longhorns created by "natural" methods is the uniqueness of each new calf born. This is their special attraction...new Christmas present every time a new calf is born.
IMO cattle cloning is a "money" thing that the breeders with lots of money to spend/waste who want to sell the same animal "several times" in a legal way...lol.
We have some gorgeous LH's too... ;-)
Anyhoo...I'm AGAINST CLONING! One of the special things about Longhorns created by "natural" methods is the uniqueness of each new calf born. This is their special attraction...new Christmas present every time a new calf is born.
IMO cattle cloning is a "money" thing that the breeders with lots of money to spend/waste who want to sell the same animal "several times" in a legal way...lol.
Bill,
I have checked out your web-site and I am well aware of the fact that you do indeed have beautiful cattle. I must admit, it is true what they say: "once you have a longhorn it is an obsession" I purchased mine this year from the B&C sale in Missouri. Do you know of anyone I could send my pedigrees to to look at and let me know the quality I have? Even though I have spent countless hours looking up their ancestry I still do not fully understand what makes a 500.00 heifer and what makes a 3000.00 heifer.
P.S. Take a look at Dickinson's 2005 bull "Unforgotten" let me know what you think.
I have checked out your web-site and I am well aware of the fact that you do indeed have beautiful cattle. I must admit, it is true what they say: "once you have a longhorn it is an obsession" I purchased mine this year from the B&C sale in Missouri. Do you know of anyone I could send my pedigrees to to look at and let me know the quality I have? Even though I have spent countless hours looking up their ancestry I still do not fully understand what makes a 500.00 heifer and what makes a 3000.00 heifer.
P.S. Take a look at Dickinson's 2005 bull "Unforgotten" let me know what you think.
Alan":pohhvz1k said:
Personally, I have no problem with anyone selling a clone of anything. Whatever they feel is right, is up to them. However, I have no interest in cloning anything or owning a clone, at this moment. I do however feel that if an animal is cloned it should be only the best animal(s) available. I do agree that the individuals cloning in the Longhorn industry strively solely for horns ( http://www.maranch.com/Clones/Clones.htm ). Although, I think the theory is the same when cloning any breed, Angus - Hereford - Longhorn - Whatevever: maximize the genetic availability of a certain animal. There are many subsets of that theory: too old to produce, ET not feasible for some reason, etc. I dont mind them doing it, not my herd or my place to tell someone else how to run their operation. I do have problems with cloning on two fronts: 1) exhibition and 2) animal selection. 1) I strongly feel that cloned animals should not be allowed to compete against non-clone animals. Among other things, I feel you lose much of the competitiveness when clones compete with other animals. 2) Animal selection to me should be the number one most important thing in any operation, whether its a commercial operation, purebred, show stock, seed stock, a.i., et, or cloning or anything else. I feel that the animals selected to be cloned should be held to only the absolute highest standards by the breeder and breed. Single-trait selection has never been a good idea, and now in the Longhorn industry there are a lot of breeders honed in so closely on one trait (horns, obviously) that some of them are actually beginning to mass-clone to perpetuate one single trait.
It baffles me. I've been trying for years to gain some/any understanding of breeding for only horns, or horns and color, or horns and color and then conformation. But I just can't figure it out. I went to the horn showcase and looked around at the animals there, some 500+ entries. Not a single bull there would I use if given to me and maybe a handful of females I would have accepted into my herd.
Don't get me wrong I like big/bigger horns. But not at the expense of conformation, correctness, reproductive ability, or anything that actually has some influence the quality, performance, or reproductivity of an animal.
Sorry for the rant... actually, I'm not sorry, thats just how I personally feel. Needless to say, I'm a little passionate about the Longhorn breed.
Ryan
KANSAS":3glr7smm said:
Check Your PM. Personal preference, conformation, color, horn, pedigree, eye appeal, desire, etc... those are just some of the many factors that go into the price of an animal. As time passes and you get more experience in the breed you will be more able to pick out not only the one's you like, but you think others will like. If you can, post some pictures of your animals, I know I, and others, would love to see them.
I like the "Unforgotten" bull. Lots of length, good color and horn, looks like he has some good bone. maybe like to see him a little straighter and smoother through the rear half, but looks okay. He is a heavier fronted bull. Shows some good masculinity. Lots of good stuff there, just like to change the straightness through the rear half, other than that a pretty solid bull.
Is he your "pick" for all the 2005 bulls on that page? If they were all equally priced, would you pick him first? If not who? Which are your top 3 or 4 bulls on that 2005 Bulls list page? Why? We'll pretend that the ones that say "Sold" arent really sold and are still available for the picking. I'll tell you what I think if you tell me what you think.
Ryan
KANSAS":sowb818i said:
I like that pick, he would have been my personal #3. He looks to be a solid, well made bull. Good horn growth. Lots of length and height, with a good straight topline. Like you, the thing that I would like to change first, is to see some more muscle. Nice bull. Looks like Dickinson agrees, too, with that kind of price tag. He looks like the type of bull that could improve a lot of the females out there.
My '05 bull:
Its close between the Phenome Not bull (solid red) and the Precious Blade bull. I like the power, growth and size of the red bull. Plus, he's an own son of Senator which I like. Has adequate horn, but might like to see him a little straighter hipped, although he is one of the bigger hipped calves. The Precious Blade bull is a real eye catcher. He is smooth, colorful, balanced and has good horns. I like the way he is put together, and I like his hip structure better than the red bull. Although he is not as powerful as the red bull, I think those two bulls compliment each other.
Another pick I like. I know this pick is harder, b/c they are just pictures and these are some pretty young calves. Just looking over the pictures quickly, he is definantly in my top 3 or 4 and a case could be made for him to be my number 1. Although young, he looks to be pretty well balanced and has one of the better hips of the group. He has a good straight topline, looks to have good legs, and is pretty cleanly made. A solid bull calf prospect all the way around. I would maybe like to see him with a little more depth and a maybe a little more bone, but thats just some personal preference.
A couple of choices that I could definantly agree with. I do not consider myself an expert at all, but I do have a lot of experience and really enjoy looking at and studying longhorns. Hope this helps some, or atleast its another perspective. Just remember this is all just my opinion, today.
Ryan
