sync methods

[certherfbeef]

Not sure where this belongs and I know it has been touched on before. Just thought it might help the newbies to hear some syncronation protocals that everyone else uses.

I use CIDR's.
Give a shot of GnRH the day I insert the CIDR=day 0
pull CIDR and give lute (or equivelant) on day 7
**breed on standing heat
I also use the estrus alert patches. Red for first heat, when I breed they get a pink one so I know if the bull covered them or if they stuck AI.

I will admit to using the CIDR's more than once. Heifers get the new ones and cows that haven't shown heat yet. Cows that have cycled get the recycled ones. I do not use them 3 times.

 

[franseen]

How do your repeats work. The first year we used them we used them each twice. The last two years repeats seemed to work poorly. Our vet said he thinks the manufacturer may have made them a little less "potent". This way they could make some extra money. Just wondering. They work great for us otherwise. Thanks.

 

[certherfbeef]

My repeats seem to work fine. Like I said, I only use them on cycleing cows. Might just be my dumb luck.

 

[franseen]

Could be my poor luck. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Dee]

I think Canada is allowed more of the hormone in their CIDR's so they can be used twice with no problem, but the US has a lower dosage. Just what I have heard.
This year on my replacement heifers I (trying to explain, I'll use my dates) inserted CIDR's and gave a shot of GnRH on April 5th. Removed CIDR's and injected PG on 4/11 AM, 4/13 PM AI everything and a shot of GnRH. I then reinserted the same CIDR's on April 25th, removed them on May 2nd, and heat detected and AI's 12 hrs after standing heat. Out of the 53 head that were bred on the 13th, I re-bred 11 more from the 4th till tonight. Hope this makes sense.

 

[polledbull]

We give the Lutalyse the day before we pull the cidr . It seems to speed the whole process up a little . It does require you to handle the cows an extra time but it seems to work for us . We do use cidrs 2 times except for donor cows . They always get a new one.

 

[Bret]

Where do you get your supplies--CIDR's, hormone shots, etc. Are prescriptions required or can these be purchased direct?

 

[El_Putzo]

I'm trying out a timed AI protocol where I feed MGA on days 1 thru 14 then on day 33 (at 9:00 A.M.) I give an injection of PG (lutalyse). Then on day 36 (at 9:00 A.M.) I give an injection of GnRH (cysterelin) and AI them. I'll let everyone know how it turns out. We are sync'ing 9 heifers. Today is day 25 and all 9 of them seemed to have cycled between days 15 and 18. I believe that is how it's supposed to work so I assume we've done everything right so far. It's going to end up costing me about $14 per calf to sync them. What do synchronization costs run using the CIDR's?

 

[certherfbeef]

Where do you get your supplies--CIDR's, hormone shots, etc. Are prescriptions required or can these be purchased direct?

You can get the CIDR's at most any semen dealer alnog with the estrus alert patches that I use. The drugs need to be bought from the vet.

 

[Dee]

This year ABS has the CIDR's for less than the vets.

 

[bulldealer]

El_Putzo,
Wasn't it hard just to stand by and watch the heifers cycle between day 15 and 18? Why not just go ahead and breed them and eliminate the rest of the protocol? Won't you get better conception from breeding off of a standing heat, rather than timed AI? :?:

 

[certherfbeef]

It's going to end up costing me about $14 per calf to sync them. What do synchronization costs run using the CIDR's?

Cidrs are running me $8 a piece. $15 for a 5 dose bottle of lute, GnRH about the same. $1 a piece for the esturs alert patches. Not including my time and AT sullpies... $15/ head
BUT, I get it done in 10 days not 36.

 

[El_Putzo]

El_Putzo,
Wasn't it hard just to stand by and watch the heifers cycle between day 15 and 18? Why not just go ahead and breed them and eliminate the rest of the protocol? Won't you get better conception from breeding off of a standing heat, rather than timed AI? :?:

In the class I took, we were told that the first heat after being taken off the MGA is a "False" heat. If you breed on this heat the conception rate would be very low as the heifers are less fertile on this heat.

As far as breeding timed AI as opposed to heat detecting, yes you are correct, in a study done by UMC, the average conception rate when using timed AI is about 63% and the heat detecting average is around 69%. I have to get my neighbor to do the AIing this year as I have not taken training yet, so I am trying to make it convenient for him. Plus, the 6% is neglegible in my book. I will gladly sacrifice that 6% for the convenience of AIing them all at once.

This sync thing is an experiment for me. Next year after I get training to AI, I may not even decide to sync them and just heat detect from the beginning. I just want to see if it's worth the time and money to sync them if I'm going to AI. I think someday I will buy a good enough bull and may not AI every year.

 

[El_Putzo]

It's going to end up costing me about $14 per calf to sync them. What do synchronization costs run using the CIDR's?

Cidrs are running me $8 a piece. $15 for a 5 dose bottle of lute, GnRH about the same. $1 a piece for the esturs alert patches. Not including my time and AT sullpies... $15/ head
BUT, I get it done in 10 days not 36.

Thanks for the info. I'm not really concerned with getting it done faster, as most of the 36 days is just waiting anyway. I can plan ahead that far and it's not really a problem. I guess it would cause less stress if you could just get it done as quick as possible.

thanks again.

 

[bwranch]

We have used MGA/Lute/Observed heat in the past. It worked really well on heifers, but we seemed to have a problem with our older cows in that the cycles seemed to string out over about 5-7 days. One potential problem is trying to feed the MGA so that all of the cows get the right amount of MGA/day. Boss cow may get 2X and bottom cow may get 1/2 X, etc. This year we went to CIDR using the timed AI protocol (same as CH with an extra GnRH shot at 66 hrs after we pulled the CIDR). We bred standing heat + 8 hours for all of the girls that we saw (they did not get the extra GnRH), everybody else got timed AI. Based on return heats, I'd say we got 70-80% first go round. We helped breed a larger group of cows (60+) with a friend north of us, he is seeing about the same, maybe a little better. He used strictly the CIDR with timed AI. CIDR $8, Lute $3/ds, GnRH $3.5/ds, CIDR gun $12?.

 

[Bez]

Round 'em all up - shoot 'em with 2 cc's of Estrumate.

Breed those that come into immediate or next day heat.

Round up those that have not been bred after 10 day wait - shoot 'em all with 2 cc's of estrumate.

Breed those that come into immediate heat.

Run the rest through the chute and breed all remaining ones at - if I remember correctly - 3 days after last shot.

Throw 'em out in the field.

Wait one month and put the bull in the pasture.

That is done so we can tell who is who in the zoo when the calves hit the ground.

Averaged about 65 or 70% catch last year and spent less than 150 bucks breeding 30 or so animals - not counting semen of course.

Spacing on the days between shots and final count to total breeding may be off - that is wife's responsibility.

I just do as I am told - when I am told - and am darned quick about it.

Ladies not allowed to handle Estrumate on this place - can really screw up their body if accidently injected into one of them. Can also be absorbed through the skin.

I have put Selenium into my jaw - so I know it can happen!

This year only 5 to AI - rest go natural.

Bez

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

El_Putzo,
Wasn't it hard just to stand by and watch the heifers cycle between day 15 and 18? Why not just go ahead and breed them and eliminate the rest of the protocol? Won't you get better conception from breeding off of a standing heat, rather than timed AI? :?:

The heifers cycle great & produce an egg - but the egg is subfertile. MGA makes their system go on hold. Whatever stage they are in, they stay there. So by the time that they are standing & release their egg, the egg is OLD. Be like a chicken egg sitting in the nest for weeks, than the hen sets on them & they don't hatch because they were dead or dieing.