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<blockquote data-quote="dbird33" data-source="post: 1559785" data-attributes="member: 30465"><p>And what you are telling me is that you have a real world and end market perspective, experience and wisdom. The problems come down to commercial producers when cattle that were bred for price, fame, pride or promotion, were created for the show ring or were freak enough to gain notoriety get blended into the seed stock side to create less useful offspring for use as commercial breeders or sires. For example: the black buzzard discussions on another thread: commercial producers need mama cows that have smarts and can deal with buzzards during the calving process and they need a calf that can be up and traveling in 20 minutes or less. That is not gained by many of the current fads and promotions. And to round it out, we create some buzzard issues by feeding cows to calve in the daytime. So it is not just purebred fads and other side venues that impact commercial folks.</p></blockquote><p></p><p>I think you have some really good points here. I definitely think folks are getting a little too wild on growth outliers and sacrificing a lot of things to keep that train moving in one direction. Feet, overall structural soundness, and fertility come to mind as some of the sacrifices being made in the push for more growth.</p><p></p><p>With regard to the black buzzard discussion. I had never heard about feeding times affecting calving times. Just researched it and may start feeding the calvers on my way to work instead of on my way home in the afternoon. Really good information. </p><p> The first study I saw, with about 1300 cows in the experiment, shows you can make a 25% swing by feeding in the am vs the pm. The calf I lost to buzzards this year was a 55lb calf that we think came breech on a heifer. May have been dead to start with, but I know the buzzards didn't do the cow or calf any favors.</p><p>[/QUOTE]</p>
[QUOTE="dbird33, post: 1559785, member: 30465"] And what you are telling me is that you have a real world and end market perspective, experience and wisdom. The problems come down to commercial producers when cattle that were bred for price, fame, pride or promotion, were created for the show ring or were freak enough to gain notoriety get blended into the seed stock side to create less useful offspring for use as commercial breeders or sires. For example: the black buzzard discussions on another thread: commercial producers need mama cows that have smarts and can deal with buzzards during the calving process and they need a calf that can be up and traveling in 20 minutes or less. That is not gained by many of the current fads and promotions. And to round it out, we create some buzzard issues by feeding cows to calve in the daytime. So it is not just purebred fads and other side venues that impact commercial folks. [/quote] I think you have some really good points here. I definitely think folks are getting a little too wild on growth outliers and sacrificing a lot of things to keep that train moving in one direction. Feet, overall structural soundness, and fertility come to mind as some of the sacrifices being made in the push for more growth. With regard to the black buzzard discussion. I had never heard about feeding times affecting calving times. Just researched it and may start feeding the calvers on my way to work instead of on my way home in the afternoon. Really good information. The first study I saw, with about 1300 cows in the experiment, shows you can make a 25% swing by feeding in the am vs the pm. The calf I lost to buzzards this year was a 55lb calf that we think came breech on a heifer. May have been dead to start with, but I know the buzzards didn't do the cow or calf any favors. [/QUOTE]
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