Rule 2

[Oldtimer]

At least this gives the US cattleman a chance to sell his culls before the negative impact of these cattle hit the US market too bad....Doesn't do anything tho for the US consumer that has to bear the risk of 26 times higher BSE risk beef (according to the US Center for Disease Control) ....

This doesn't surprise me- as has been shown with the Chinese tainted products issue- our current administration/USDA/FDA put foreign imports and foreign trade ahead of consumer safety...
We definitely need an M-COOL implemented.....



----------------------------------------------------------
U.S. to outline rule for Canadian cattle imports
Updated Thu. Sep. 13 2007 4:47 PM ET

The Canadian Press

WASHINGTON -- The U.S. government will announce Friday the rule for resuming imports of older cattle and beef products from Canada.

The Agriculture Department's chief veterinarian, John Clifford, is scheduled to discuss the rule with journalists.


But it will be at least two months before trade resumes.


The rule must first be published in the U.S. Federal Register and cannot go into effect until 60 days after that.


After the mad cow scare in 2003, U.S. officials shut the border to Canadian cattle.


Trade later resumed in younger cows, thought to be at less risk for contracting the disease.

 

[rockridgecattle]

Lumping us with the Chinese...thanks :shock:

RR

 

[Oldtimer]

Lumping us with the Chinese...thanks :shock:

RR

I'll agree rockinridge, I was a little harsh--but the China fiasco and the current US Administrations/FDA/USDA's failure to respond to the outcry of the public or Congress does show how radically sold out to the multinational Corporate interests our government is and how they put access to cheap imported products- no matter how questionably tainted, or how dangerous- ahead of US consumers safety and health...
It certainly takes away from the credibility that any of these so called "food safety" government oversight departments have....

I hope when M-COOL gets put in place and implemented, the border completely opened and a fair trade in "both directions" opened up--that our two countries can come closer toward working against the true enemy to cattlemen of both countries-- these multinational corporations that are using their monetary power to control the governments against us in both nations....

This following segment from a current R-CALF article about a visit to Australia kind of sums up the biggest problem we face if we are going to keep family farming/ranching and the rural community alive....

It was uncanny how our two sagas meshed so well. While each of our groups seem to face issues at home, it became glaringly clear that it was actually rampant free trade agreements and the international corporations' desires for the lowest-cost products that are our mutual foes.

 

[vs_cattle]

Yes! This makes my YEAR :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Oldtimer]

USDA HARMONIZES CATTLE TRADE WITH CANADA IN LINE WITH INTERNATIONAL ANIMAL HEALTH STANDARDS


WASHINGTON, Sept. 14, 2007—The U.S. Department of Agriculture's Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS) today announced that it will expand the list of allowable imports from countries recognized as presenting a minimal risk of introducing bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE) into the United States. Currently, Canada is the only minimal-risk country designated by the United States.

"This rule is firmly based in science and ensures that we continue to protect the U.S. against BSE," said Bruce Knight, under secretary for marketing and regulatory programs. "It also is consistent with our commitment to promote fair trade practices and further normalizes trade with countries that institute the appropriate safeguards to prevent the spread of BSE."

This rule makes final a proposed rule published in the Jan. 9, 2007 Federal Register.

It also builds upon and expands the rule published by APHIS in January 2005 that allowed the importation of certain live ruminants and ruminant products, including cattle under 30 months of age for slaughter from countries recognized as minimal risk. The final rule announced today allows for the importation from Canada of:

Live cattle and other bovines (i.e., bison) for any use (including breeding) born on or after, March 1, 1999, which APHIS has determined to be the date of effective enforcement of Canada's ruminant-to-ruminant feed ban;

Blood and blood products derived from bovines, collected under certain conditions; and

Casings and part of the small intestine derived from bovines.

The January 2005 final rule, the first MRR rule, allowed the importation of Canadian bovine meat and meat products of any age. Subsequent to the publication of the final rule in January 2005, USDA delayed the applicability of those provisions of that final rule that dealt with meat and meat products from animals 30 months of age or older. With this final rule published today, that temporary delay in applicability is lifted and importation of these meat and meat products now can occur.

As part of its BSE rulemaking process, APHIS conducted a thorough risk assessment following guidelines put forth by the World Organization for Animal Health, or OIE, that evaluated the entire risk pathway, including mitigations in place both in Canada and the United States. The assessment also included evaluating the likelihood of BSE introduction via imports, the likelihood of animal exposure in the U.S. if this were to occur and the subsequent consequences. The assessment found that the risk of BSE establishment in the United States as a result of the imports announced today and those announced in January 2005 is negligible. APHIS considered new information related to the risk assessment, including Canada's identification of animals born after the date of the feed ban to evaluate the potential impact and determined that the original assessment was sufficiently robust that new data did not change the conclusions of the assessment. The risk assessment underwent a thorough, independent peer review in which all of the reviewers concurred with APHIS' risk assessment. The reviewers agreed that APHIS followed OIE guidelines and standards and acknowledged the scientific rigor of the assessment.

Additionally, APHIS encouraged the public to participate in the decision-making process by providing feedback through the submission of public comments. The public comment period on the proposed rule opened Jan. 9, 2007 and closed on March 12, 2007.

There are a series of interlocking safeguards in place to protect animal health from BSE transmission. These longstanding safeguards include the U.S. Food and Drug Administration's ruminant-to-ruminant feed ban, import controls, aggressive disease surveillance and U.S. slaughter practices.

Moreover, human health in the United States also is protected by another system of interlocking safeguards that ensure the safety of U.S. beef. The most important of these safeguards is the ban on specified risk materials from the food supply. Canada has similar safeguards in place.

The final rule is scheduled for publication in the Sept. 18, 2007 Federal Register and becomes effective Nov. 19, 2007. Additional information is available at http://www.aphis.usda.gov.

The final rule is scheduled for publication in the Sept. 18, 2007 Federal Register and becomes effective Nov. 19, 2007.

I had a chance to go to town and talk to some of the locals--- most agree that they estimate that after Nov 19th (maybe starting before that)- the US price of cull cows and bulls will drop around $25cwt....With most in this area not gathering and shipping/weaning until the first week of November- then pregging and culling- everyone is trying to figure out how they can get everything done before the market takes the big hit....

As one the locals that posts on another site said--Could be a CRUEL December....

 

[PeaceCountryCowboy]

I had a chance to go to town and talk to some of the locals--- most agree that they estimate that after Nov 19th (maybe starting before that)- the US price of cull cows and bulls will drop around $25cwt....With most in this area not gathering and shipping/weaning until the first week of November- then pregging and culling- everyone is trying to figure out how they can get everything done before the market takes the big hit....

As one the locals that posts on another site said--Could be a CRUEL December....

 

[hillsdown]

As one the locals that posts on another site said--Could be a CRUEL December....

:lol:
Everyone ship their culls at once and see how fast the prices plummet.
Don't worry OT I'm sure you guys will find an other suspect case of BSE that originated from Canada before the changes take effect. :roll:

 

[PeaceCountryCowboy]

risk of 26 times higher BSE risk beef (according to the US Center for Disease Control)

R-CALF: CDC Says Prevalence Of Canadian BSE 26 Times That Of U.S.

No, according to R-calf saying they're quoting CDC. Oldtimer maybe you should try and find that actually from the CDC in a CDC document.[/quote]

 

[PeaceCountryCowboy]

As one the locals that posts on another site said--Could be a CRUEL December....

:lol:
Everyone ship their culls at once and see how fast the prices plummet.
Don't worry OT I'm sure you guys will find an other suspect case of BSE that originated from Canada before the changes take effect. :roll:

Or R-calf will chain themselves to some Canadian cattle liners like tree huggers to a tree :lol: . I'd love that, I'd tell em to hang on tight it's going to be a windy ride non-stop to Pasco, WA :cboy: .

 

[Oldtimer]

risk of 26 times higher BSE risk beef (according to the US Center for Disease Control)

R-CALF: CDC Says Prevalence Of Canadian BSE 26 Times That Of U.S.

No, according to R-calf saying they're quoting CDC. Oldtimer maybe you should try and find that actually from the CDC in a CDC document.

http://www.r-calfusa.com/BSE/071307cour ... hority.pdf

There is the link showing the CDC paperwork that was filed in Federal District court... Go to page 3--(page 2 of the CDC report) and read below the graph....

Also the Canadian ranchers group attorney posted the below on the Canadian site Agriville--Posted by Mr. Pallett- the Canadian ranchers attorney on Agriville
Quote:
cpallett posted Jul 10, 2007 10:48
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dr. Neil Cashman told me that the modelling studies they have done indicate that there may be as many as 50 BSE positive cattle in Canada.

Dr. Cashman is the leading BSE, TSE, vCJD expert in Canada and chairs some of the government BSE study/advisory committees......

 

[Oldtimer]

To just give you an idea of market difference right now... I just don't see, when the OLD Canadian cow boxed beef starts coming south, the Packers doing big backflips to raise the Canadian prices to our level---instead they will just kill more in Canada, ship them down and lower the prices the US producer gets...
These two markets are approximately 125 miles apart for comparison....

Most locals figure the border opening will lower US cull cow/bull prices by $25 cwt--based on past experience- which might be more if the mixing of US-Canadian beef drops US demand because of the fact we don't yet have M-COOL so they can make an informed choice..... :roll:

1.00 Mexican pesos = 0.09 US dollars
1.00 Australian dollars = 0.83 US dollars
1.00 Canadian dollars = 0.95 US dollars

Nearest Canadian Market-- Assiniboia SK
D1 & D2 Cows Avg. 0.36 And Sold Up To 0.40
D3 Cows Avg. 0.30 And Sold Up To 0.36
Slaughter Bulls Avg. 0.38 And Sold Up To 0.42

http://www.assiniboiaauction.com/

Local (Glasgow Mt.) Market
Utility & Commercial Cows $50.00-$57.25
Cutter & Canner Cows $40.00-$50.00
Bulls $58.00-$68.75
http://www.glasgowstockyards.com/php/marketreport.php


Dick Britzman Glasgow 1650 lbs. Cow $57.00 = $940.50
Canuck cow 1650 lbs Cow $40.00 (CDN) $38 (US) =$627

$313 difference....

To me -$313 per head is an effect...... :roll:

 

[HAY MAKER]

As one the locals that posts on another site said--Could be a CRUEL December....

:lol:
Everyone ship their culls at once and see how fast the prices plummet.
Don't worry OT I'm sure you guys will find an other suspect case of BSE that originated from Canada before the changes take effect. :roll:

You better get em shipped before Sep 08 rolls around,no more riding the USA's coat tail.
It would be embarrassing to me to be a willing player in deceiving the consumer..........I guess some will do anything for a buck eh ?
good luck

 

[flounder]

Subject: TRANSCRIPT OF REMARKS REGARDING HARMONIZATION OF CATTLE TRADE WITH
CANADA Washington D.C. - September 14, 2007
Date: September 14, 2007 at 7:19 pm PST

http://ranchers.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20994


TSS

 

[PeaceCountryCowboy]

http://www.r-calfusa.com/BSE/071307cour ... hority.pdf

There is the link showing the CDC paperwork that was filed in Federal District court... Go to page 3--(page 2 of the CDC report) and read below the graph....

Ah, but they (CDC) don't say "26 times higher risk beef". They say there's a 26 fold higher percentage of cases found.

10 cases among approximately 160,000 animals tested) is presently statistically significantly higher (26 fold higher) than the proportion of U.S.-born BSE cases

That could also mean the Canadian system is better at catching suspect BSE cases before they enter the food chain. A Canadian group could twist that and say we're 26 times better at catching a suspect BSE animal before it enters the food chain and quote that same article. The Canadian system doesn't test animals at random to boost it's numbers. CFIA probably could test a few hundred thousand cattle that they know don't have BSE to lower that.

R-calf chooses to twist it the other way to say BSE cattle are 26 times more prevelent in all of Canada by using a group of 160,000 head that were singled out of the entire Canadian herd that were suspected of having BSE. What it really means is BSE is 26 times more prevelent in suspected cattle with BSE. Woup-di-do :lol:

And that ladies and gentlemen is how R-calf warps your mind :lol:

 

[Oldtimer]

I guess you can spin any excuse on it you want but that ain't facts..The evidence has shown that the US found 2 origin BSE cattle- neither were of the type that is running epidemic in Canada- and both of which were born PRE feedban...Canada has found 12 cases in a herd 1/7th the size- and half of those which have been POST feedban- with one as young as 4 years old (born after the date that USDA is allowing imports in).....

The independent study the USDA had done came back with the prospective that there were only 2 or 3 BSE cattle now in the US from the statistics compiled--Your Canadian lead BSE expert, Dr. Cashman has said that from his studies on any day there could be 50 BSE cattle in Canada -in a herd 1/7th the size...

To me that is definitely higher risk and the reason CDC says Canadian cattle/beef is statistically higher risk....To me that is the reason we need M-COOL before they begin shipping in OTM beef/cattle- so consumers can make their own decision on the risk and an informed choice on what they want to eat...

 

[PeaceCountryCowboy]

Your Canadian lead BSE expert, Dr. Cashman has said that from his studies on any day there could be 50 BSE cattle in Canada

:roll: There could be none, there could be 300, there could be 3000, there could be 300,000. What kinda arguement is it to use quotes that say "could". I could say the U.S could have as many as 500 cases of BSE at any given time and no one could prove me wrong because they could. No one knows unless you kill them all and test them all at once. :lol: Honestly OT read R-calf's stuff a little more carefully.

The truth is the U.S and Canada had very similar feeding and cattle keeping traditions up until BSE was found. An American ranch ran very similar to a Canadian one. Feed products flowed back and forth. Feed laws were very similar. Cattle flowed back and forth.

Now here we are with 12 cases of BSE found in Canada and 2 found in the U.S that has a herd 7 times the size. Can you honestly tell me this doesn't sound just a little suspicious to you?

Got any more R-calf stats for me?

 

[hillsdown]

Thank God Bull Sh*t runs down hill. ;-) :roll: :roll:

 

[Oldtimer]

Your Canadian lead BSE expert, Dr. Cashman has said that from his studies on any day there could be 50 BSE cattle in Canada

:roll: There could be none, there could be 300, there could be 3000, there could be 300,000. What kinda arguement is it to use quotes that say "could". I could say the U.S could have as many as 500 cases of BSE at any given time and no one could prove me wrong because they could. No one knows unless you kill them all and test them all at once. :lol: Honestly OT read R-calf's stuff a little more carefully.

Well I can't see the leading Canadian scientist admitting to that unless their is something to it-- nor the Canadian ranchers lead attorney...

One of the major problems with the BSE issue is all the unknowns-all theory - which means a lot of coulds, mays, believes, since there is no sound science... Which is the reason my years of public safety service say that the USDA should err in the direction of consumer/herd health safety--instead of for the economical gains of their buddies, the Multinational Packers....

The truth is the U.S and Canada had very similar feeding and cattle keeping traditions up until BSE was found. An American ranch ran very similar to a Canadian one. Feed products flowed back and forth. Feed laws were very similar. Cattle flowed back and forth.

Actually in 30+ years of inspecting cattle- I saw very little cross border trade excepting those meant for slaughter...One of the things Canadians forget is that the US instituted voluntary feedban, mandatory cattle import bans, and a BSE testing program starting all the way back in the 80's while Canada was still importing from Europe...

Now here we are with 12 cases of BSE found in Canada and 2 found in the U.S that has a herd 7 times the size. Can you honestly tell me this doesn't sound just a little suspicious to you?

Could just possibly be that earlier voluntary and then mandatory feedban in the US worked-- while Canadians apparently continued to violate it- and it didn't work...If you look at the evidence that is available- that is the only answer you can come up with....

And don't even throw out the Canuck conspiracy theory-- I've worked long enough in government to know that it would be impossible to get 1000's of inspectors/technicians/Doctors/Bureaucrats from all over the US to go along with a cover up......
If the US had as high a risk/rate as Canada, they would have found over 80 positives with over 40 of them being POST feed ban :roll: :lol: :lol:

Got any more R-calf stats for me?

 

[vs_cattle]

Your Canadian lead BSE expert, Dr. Cashman has said that from his studies on any day there could be 50 BSE cattle in Canada

:roll: There could be none, there could be 300, there could be 3000, there could be 300,000. What kinda arguement is it to use quotes that say "could". I could say the U.S could have as many as 500 cases of BSE at any given time and no one could prove me wrong because they could. No one knows unless you kill them all and test them all at once. :lol: Honestly OT read R-calf's stuff a little more carefully.

The truth is the U.S and Canada had very similar feeding and cattle keeping traditions up until BSE was found. An American ranch ran very similar to a Canadian one. Feed products flowed back and forth. Feed laws were very similar. Cattle flowed back and forth.

Now here we are with 12 cases of BSE found in Canada and 2 found in the U.S that has a herd 7 times the size. Can you honestly tell me this doesn't sound just a little suspicious to you?

Got any more R-calf stats for me?

;-) Well wrote this is what I understand as well I get my information from ranchers that have been around years

 

[PeaceCountryCowboy]

One of the major problems with the BSE issue is all the unknowns-all theory - which means a lot of coulds, mays, believes, since there is no sound science... Which is the reason my years of public safety service say that the USDA should err in the direction of consumer/herd health safety--instead of for the economical gains of their buddies, the Multinational Packers....

True, there's lots of could's and maybe's. But that doesn't mean people and groups should jump to their own conclusions and use that to dictate trade policy. The science we do have says it's minimum risk and that trade is not going to pose any risk. I've heard the odds of actually contracting the disease are about the same as getting hit by a meteorite while out walking your dog. That sounds like minimum risk to me, I think I'll keep walking my dog rather then err on the side of safety and stay in in fear of getting hit by a meteorite :lol: . But hey, to each his own.

Come on OT, we both know what this is about. This all started by you complaining that prices are going to drop. It's all about protectionism and getting the highest price for American cattle by keeping Canadian cattle out using BSE as a cover and excuse.

Actually in 30+ years of inspecting cattle- I saw very little cross border trade excepting those meant for slaughter...One of the things Canadians forget is that the US instituted voluntary feedban, mandatory cattle import bans, and a BSE testing program starting all the way back in the 80's while Canada was still importing from Europe.

:roll: Lot's of purebred cattle crossed the border for breeding. Holstein's especially. Obviously the one found in Washington state ;-) . I'm sure she wasn't the only one :lol: . Plus feed, Cargil and every other multinational feed manufacturer sent whatever they had back and forth. And we know feed seems to be the usual cause.

Could just possibly be that earlier voluntary and then mandatory feedban in the US worked-- while Canadians apparently continued to violate it- and it didn't work...If you look at the evidence that is available- that is the only answer you can come up with.

Well if that's the only answer you can come up with you've gotta think a little harder because it could easily be Canada just simply found more positive cases through better surveillance programs. Even you have to admit this is possible.

And don't even throw out the Canuck conspiracy theory-- I've worked long enough in government to know that it would be impossible to get 1000's of inspectors/technicians/Doctors/Bureaucrats from all over the US to go along with a cover up......
If the US had as high a risk/rate as Canada, they would have found over 80 positives with over 40 of them being POST feed ban.

It's not a conspiracy theory, I agree with you there's no way to cover that up. I'm just saying maybe a smaller net catch's more fish ;-) .