Newbie with a lot of questions - posted on general forum

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Hello everyone,

I did post htis on the general forum, but I think I should of gone straight to the Cattle experts.... :?:
I am so very grateful that I found this website... We just got two calves about 3 months ago and unfortunately I think one is dying. Our neighbor got 3 also from the same ranch in Okeechobee, FL and this evening we found one of his calved dead...

I have been giving our calves Gatorade for about three days, and hand feeding him as much as I think is appropiate.

But the poor little thing is almost like he is paralized from the neck down, I am calling my vet first thing monday for a cattle vet referral.

This may be something genetic since they came from the same ranch, and my first thought is that it could be Lyme Disease, our dog had this 2 years ago after Hurricane Wilma as the winds knocked down a lot of Australian Pines that my vet said the ticks tend to lay their eggs in them.

So, here are a few of my questions:
Please keep in Mind - that I am Brand new, we did get into this without becoming very educated about anything. We started with two and want to work our way up to more, but before we can do that.... I need to find out what the heck I am doing, I cannot have them dying and or sick....
I am going to start from the beginning becuase who knows if we did everything right - another neighbor sorta helped us get this all started.... but I am unsure of his advice as we have a sick baby now....

At what age is a cow weaned from the Mil Replacement? We were told at 45 days old, then they eat hay and grass and to give them a product called metcalf...

Other than the milk replacement and metcalf what other stuff should they be getting for nutrients? And for how long?
Then when they are weaned from metcalf, what do they need other than grass and hay? I read something about a Molasses something what is that? I want to have well nourished cattle, and I am afraid that I do not know enough.

At what time do you worm the calves? I have read a lot on the forums and other websites and it seems that there are certain times of the year you do this and I also read that it is unnecessary????

Vaccinations? When are they due, I think I read at or around 3 months of age.
Do I have to have a vet do all of this or can I usually buy this at a feed store? It sounds like a lot of people are administrating things themselves... ( boy you all are so knowledgable)

Other medications for common things? Can I buy and give myself other than having a vet come out.

Casteration (spelling) at what age is it appropiate to do this?

Does anyone know of a good website that explains the difference between the breed of cows? We didn't know there are so many different types and didn't ask when we got them - just know they are males.

By chance does nay one reccomend a cattle vetrinarian in the Palm Beach County Florida are??? I think I need one! (duh, had a pediatrician before the babies were born LOL)
If anyone has the time to type out step by step instructions, or if you can point me in the right direction.... I would deeply appreciate your help. Please help a newbie....Thanks a million, Lisa [/img]
 
Look in the yellow pages under veterinarian. Find one that says he/she/they treat large animals/livestock and make emergency calls. Call today!

The vet can answer all of your questions. You don't need a referral.

Also, search this site for all of your questions. You'll find all of your questions answered there. But right now, today, get hold of a large animal vet that makes emergency calls.

Alice :)
 
Well Fed Ranch":24bhuckl said:
Hello everyone,

I did post htis on the general forum, but I think I should of gone straight to the Cattle experts.... :?: good choice
I am so very grateful that I found this website... We just got two calves about 3 months ago and unfortunately I think one is dying. :( Our neighbor got 3 also from the same ranch in Okeechobee, FL and this evening we found one of his calved dead... :? that dont sound good
I have been giving our calves Gatorade for about three days, and hand feeding him as much as I think is appropiate. sounds good
But the poor little thing is almost like he is paralized from the neck down, I am calling my vet first thing monday for a cattle vet referral. that poor thing needs help...TODAY just call a vet and have it make an emergancy visit. you shouldnt need a referl.
This may be something genetic since they came from the same ranch, and my first thought is that it could be Lyme Disease, our dog had this 2 years ago after Hurricane Wilma as the winds knocked down a lot of Australian Pines that my vet said the ticks tend to lay their eggs in them. dont much know about lyme disease, but to me it dont sound like it.

So, here are a few of my questions:
Please keep in Mind - that I am Brand new, we did get into this without becoming very educated about anything. We started with two and want to work our way up to more, but before we can do that.... I need to find out what the heck I am doing, I cannot have them dying and or sick.... understandable
I am going to start from the beginning becuase who knows if we did everything right - another neighbor sorta helped us get this all started.... but I am unsure of his advice as we have a sick baby now.... dont be too unsure until you find out whats wrong. ya'll could have been doin everything right and the baby still coulda got sick.

At what age is a cow weaned from the Mil Replacement? We were told at 45 days old, then they eat hay and grass and to give them a product called metcalf... sorry big pet peeve. its not a cow so dont call it a cow. its a calf, bull or heifer. im not bein mean or nothing. we weaned at about six weeks. you cand go more or less, but i wouldnt go too much less.it depends where you have them. if you got them in a place that has grass then yes, they can eat it, and if theres enough you wont need hay. but if you do give grass and hay, give like grass hay or oat, with the grass, something like alfalfa could be too much. theres zillions of different brands of starter and growers. we used purina. theres diferent stages for it. worked really good for us. how old are they? that makes a diference too.
Other than the milk replacement and metcalf what other stuff should they be getting for nutrients? well the starter will give them alot of nutrients and you can put maybe a 3 in 1 block and a salt block. they'll always lick on it.And for how long? til its gone. and then you put a new one in
Then when they are weaned from metcalf, what do they need other than grass and hay? we gave them oats and cracked corn. light on the corn and heavy on the oats. well not too heavy. I read something about a Molasses something what is that? if you give them a 3 in 1 block its in there but if you dont, i wouldnt worry to much about it. but if you want, you can buy granulars to put in their feed. I want to have well nourished cattle, and I am afraid that I do not know enough. dont worry, you'll learn alot on here

At what time do you worm the calves? I have read a lot on the forums and other websites and it seems that there are certain times of the year you do this and I also read that it is unnecessary???? spring and fall. but for your bucket calves you can wait til they're alittle big older and healthier before you do it.
Vaccinations? When are they due, I think I read at or around 3 months of age. yeah, 3 months is good. i would worm at this time. theres like, blackleg, 7-way and prolly a few more, somebody else should be able to list a few more.Do I have to have a vet do all of this or can I usually buy this at a feed store? It sounds like a lot of people are administrating things themselves... ( boy you all are so knowledgable) you get the meds at the vet. if its something simple, like in the muscle in the neck or even underneith the skin, it not that hard. i hope you have something you can restrain them with. even though a bucket calf is calm, they still get pretty wild when you go to give a shot. if you dont trust yourself, just go to the vet, it not worth it.
Other medications for common things? Can I buy and give myself other than having a vet come out. well, your wormer could be admistrated yourself. hhmm i dont know, kinda depends what it is.
Casteration (spelling) at what age is it appropiate to do this?
well sinse they are bucket calves and arnt so healthy, i would weight til they are about 175-250 pounds. some people like to cut, others use a band. personally i would go with the band. its alot more convienet i think.
Does anyone know of a good website that explains the difference between the breed of cows? We didn't know there are so many different types and didn't ask when we got them - just know they are males. http://www.cattle-today.com/ on the side, it has all the breeds.

By chance does nay one reccomend a cattle vetrinarian in the Palm Beach County Florida are??? I think I need one! (duh, had a pediatrician before the babies were born LOL) no, cant help ya on that one. but your yellow pages should list some. or ask your neighbor.If anyone has the time to type out step by step instructions, or if you can point me in the right direction.... I would deeply appreciate your help. Please help a newbie....Thanks a million, Lisa [/img]

thats what everyone on here is for. dont be afraid to ask a question. theres no such thing as a dumb or stupid question.
and we also love pictures. ;-)
 
Thanks for taking the time with this, cattleluvr. Ya' done good, darlin'... ;-)...a whole lot better than me... :(

Alice
 
Lisa, you are doing the right thing by starting small and learning as you go.
As to your sick calf, there are so many things it could be, a veterinarian would be your best bet to get a good diagnosis, treatment, and nutrition.
As to your calf's nutrition, does the bag have directions as to how to feed and for how long? A good source of information may be the feed store you buy from.
You are going to need grass, pasture, for your animals. This is a whole another subject in itself.

You could also talk to the vet about a vaccination, worming, etc. program. As you learn more there are more and more thiings you can do for yourself. But starting out you need help and you need to watch someone do a lot of things like giving injections, castrating, etc. Some of the jobs are not hard to do, but you need someone to show you startiing out. Some things you will probably need physical help with.

A lot of your questions do not have a single right answer. For example, castration. Some castrate at birth or as soon as they can, others at maybe 3 months, others later still. Some use a knife or scapel, others band.
I am not trying to confuse you, but I am trying to show you why there is not just one answer to a lot of things.

You can use the search function on these boards to read discussions, and arguments, on a lot of subjects. Again, a good example is castration.

On the homepage of this website you will see a green index on the left. On it you will see where to click for breeds of cattle.
Also, I believe Oklahoma State Univ. has a site with good information on breeds.

Contact your ag. extension office about information on raising cattle. They will have a lot of helpful material.
On the index on this site there is a section for books. You will see listed a book by Thomas, A Storey book on a guide to raising beef cattle. The book is easy to understand and has a lot of information. I suggest you get it.

After you have done some reading, you need to do some thinking about what direction you want to go in. What kind of cattle, cow/calf, bottle calves, stockers, dairy replacements ??
Then you will be able to ask questions which are more specific to your situation.

I hope my comments will help you get pointed in the right direction.
 
Hello Well fed ranch,
i hope you were able to get to a vet today. something to keep in mind, check his poo. runny...scours, hard...constipated, hydration..check to see if the skin tents when lightly pinched...if it does, dehydrated, check to see if the gums have receded...dehydrated. Temperature, a thermometer to put up the but. Over 38.5C is a fever and should be started on LA 200 ASAP(this is a starting point for treatment) and contact a vet for any additional help ASAP. (Keep on hand a bottle of LA 200.) It might need something stronger but a vet can help you with diagnosis and then help solve the problem. As you get beetter you will be able to diagnos and treat them yourself.
The ranch you got the animals from, were they vaccinated? Did the mothers have their shots pre breeding (black leg, ibr/bvd type 1 and type 2)? did they get scour vacciantion shots? these are things that you should check into because you want the healthiest animal to start with. Especially if you are bringing animals from other farms together. each farm has it's own brand of bateria. Mixing animals can be disasterous if they are not vaccinated.
another question, to ask the seller when you buy more, did the calf get colostrum, in the first few hours of life? Did it get mother's colostrum or powder mixed in water? The powder, how much immiglobulins did it have, how many doses. There is cheap stuff and there is good quality. 100 immuglobuloins is good...one dose if there is mo mamma's milk. Any thing less should have been 2 doses or more.
Colostrum is such an important thing (it provides the necessary anti-bodies to fight infection in the first months until they can produce their own). Make sure you ask about it. Same as about the cow and bull vaccinations from the herd of origin.

It is real good that you started with only a couple of animals to develope the learning curve. It would have been a much harder thing to swallow if you bought a lot to start with and lost many. A learning curve is real good. We did the same thing when we got into honey bees. 2 hive to learn and then grew from there.
Good luck and keep us posted, and a pic or two.
 
I coulnd't get a vet out to the house, talked to a couple of neighbors and they said the vets round here re funny like that if you have never used them and call them the first time for an emergency...
Well, unfortunatlely we lost him last night, he was convulsing and there was nothing we could do.
I am saddened, but I still have one healthy one left. My neighbor is oging to let us adopt his so I am on a mission to make sure these two survive.
I would like to thank you for your help on all my questions, a great relief to have some answers, and the link to the florida website is great.

I have printed this all out and am highlightin some things and heading to the feed store with all of my questions. I am sure I can find someone to get me set up properly. I am sure they know of a lot more vets also that I can touch base with.

I REALLY appreciate the help!!!
Big Hugs, From, FLA - Lisa
 
Been in the biz for many years and generally fairly successful with keeping them alive.

Suggest you do a search on these boards under the following:

newbie
starting out
buying cattle
new to cattle
help
need help
need help fast
advice
need advice

.... and any other combination you can think of. This site is overrun with folks buying a couple of animals figuring they are a snap to raise and then running into trouble.

You will read for many days and glean a great deal of info. Do this before you replace anything you lose.

Have your infrastructure set up first.

Find a veterinarian now.

You own livestock, therefore you will have deadstock.

I do not believe in weaning in short time frames - they stay on mom for up to 8 months depending on the operation - there is a reason for this despite the milk replacer info.

I do not care how much "stuff" a calf eats at a young age - they still need milk. The other is mostly filler and they are not able to gain as much nutrition as they need from grass and hay at a young age. Many will disagree with me on this but that is their right.

In my personal opinion calves / bred heifers are the most difficult things for a newbie to be involved with unless there is a strong mentor near by.

Lots more - but you need to do your home work. No different from being a parent - you knew tons before your kids were born - same process needs to be applied to animals.

Farming - despite the common thought by many - is not easy and it is not simple.

Good luck.

Bez>
 
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