NAFTA & Canadian Cattle

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Anonymous

Could someone please help me with this?
What role has NAFTA played in the cattle trade with Canada?

I continue to see reports of BSE in Canadian cattle and I wonder how much of that is making its way across to the US.
For the record I do not think that NAFTA has or will benefit anyone in the long run.
 
Sugarman":kxxzp24e said:
Could someone please help me with this?
What role has NAFTA played in the cattle trade with Canada?

I continue to see reports of BSE in Canadian cattle and I wonder how much of that is making its way across to the US.
For the record I do not think that NAFTA has or will benefit anyone in the long run.

NAFTA pretty well is what opened up the beef trade with Canada...Allowed not only the trading of live cattle, but also beef....It was supposed to be so cattle could move freely both directions- but immediately after its implementation the Canadian cattle and sheep producers got restrictions put on US cattle going north- calling "ALL US CATTLE DISEASED"- because some US cattle ( in certain regions) had Anaplas and Blue Tongue- thereby limiting the US cattlemans ability to trade into Canada...Then many Canadian farmer/ranchers switched from grain production to cattle greatly enlarging the Canadian herd and dumping large numbers of slaughter cattle/beef into the US....

Then the US owned multinational Packers (Tyson/Cargil) bought out many of the Canadian Packers-- bought up and built huge feedlots in Canada-thereby getting around the US Packers and Stockyards Act rules-- and used these cattle as a "captive supply" to manipulate cattle prices and markets... They found a loophole (and used their ties with USDA) in the USDA rules- which allowed them to label the Canadian beef with the USDA inspected stamp- and pass it off to US consumers or consumers around the world as US BEEF...(Hopefully this will soon be changed by Congress, and that beef/meat will have to be honestly labeled as to country of origin)

The US cattleman won a "dumping" suit against Canadian cattle- but no award as they couldn't prove the damage the Canadian cattle did to the US market...But then when Canada got BSE and the border closed- we saw the true negative effect those cattle have- when the Packers didn't have availability of those "captive supply" and all the Canadian cattle--- US cattle producers saw record high prices....

My fear now- that USDA has weakened our safeguards against BSE (mainly because of their corrupt ties to the Mulitnational Packers)- and allowed in higher risk cattle/beef from Canada, is that it could now spread more amongst the US herd- not only endangering US consumers- but also the long term viability of the US cattle industry...This latest BSE cow- and most of the 14 they've found- would have been eligible for import to the US under the USDA's current rule- and could have easily ended up in our food chain :shock: :( :mad:

Incidentally I see where 2 of the folks campaigning for President are saying they will repeal NAFTA if elected.....
 
Thanks for the information Old Timer.
Sounds like the Canadians have learned a thing or two from the Mexicans.
 
Heres a good article from the Canadian press that shows some of the issues that have raised differences between US and Canadian cattlemen...

As one Canadian I like to argue with said- we're too much to being alike in the western US and western Canada- geographically, weather, resources, populations, and even to quite an extent beliefs....We're like family arguing ( and with much of the cross border marriages actually are :roll: )..

When NAFTA came about- and Canada got access to many US markets it did not previously have- and with differing laws and rules giving advantages, it was Montana that took a big hit in their cattle , mining, oil, and timber industries....Between NAFTA and CRP it almost decimated some areas of the state....

Meatpackers, USDA come under fire at R-CALF convention



By Sheri Monk

Maple Creek News – Canada

February 26, 2008



R-CALF USA carries a certain mystique north of the border. Access to the activist group has been difficult for Canadian journalists who are told outright that R-CALF will speak only with their domestic American media.



Their annual convention was held Feb. 20-23 at Omaha and members attended from all over America to convene on the state of their cattle industry. R-CALF unapologetically seeks to stop Canadian cattle from moving south into America. Mad cow disease (BSE) hit Canada for the first time in 2003 and the landscape of the cattle industry in both countries was changed forever.



"We heard the news, it was auction day and the sale still went on, but the prices were dropping and there wasn't a smile on anyone's face," said a Montana rancher at the conference.



The American border slammed shut in May of 2003 and flaws in the Canadian cattle industry that had been neglected for years were finally illuminated, but without any avenue of escape for producers caught in the crisis.



Canada, as with many other industry segments, had built an export economy tailored upon the low value of the Canadian dollar and the mass market of the U.S. situated just a couple hours south of most major Canadian cities. When the border closed, cattle producers were raising more cows than Canadians could eat and there were too few packinghouses to kill them all.



The Canadian government worked feverishly to reopen the border and in 2005, the United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) announced cattle under the age of 30 months (UTM) could cross the line.

R-CALF won a temporary injunction to keep the border closed, but the injunction was lifted in appeals court.

On Nov. 19, 2007, the USDA fully opened the border and Canadian cattle older than 30 months (OTM) could be imported. The highest number of Canadian cattle ever shipped to the U.S. was around two million head annually–seemingly small potatoes to a country with 100 million head of cattle. R-CALF members, however, maintain it was the timing of the imports that hurt them.



"I'll tell you what, the packers you have up north, they're American and they wanted the border open worse than anyone else," said a rancher from Montana. "We'd see our prices start to get a little high and all of a sudden, the packers stopped buying. Three weeks they went once and never bought a cow and the feedlots are all of a sudden full of Canadian cattle. They showed up with a price they wanted to pay, we said it was too low and that's how they'd fix it."


While Canada and BSE were addressed at the convention, topics ranged from animal health management, international trade agreements, animal identification and movement tracking, the shrinking middle and working classes, agricultural law, income taxes, country of origin labeling, property rights, check-off and global market analysis.



R-CALF CEO Bill Bullard addressed the crowd and chastised the meatpackers he feels are exploiting producers while warning that without action, the beef industry will change forever. "You will become producers only at the invitation of the handful of packers," said Bullard.



R-CALF is affiliated with another influential producer group. John Carter with the Australian Beef Association crossed the ocean to address the crowd and spoke of their producers' national animal identification system.



"Don't let anyone take you down this suicidal path. This is a ploy to give jobs to bureaucrats and create money for multi-national tag manufacturers," said Carter.



The Aussie claimed that the RFID (radio frequency identification) system was a wreck from the start and was never subject to a cost-benefit analysis. Before flying to America, he checked what their system had recorded about his herd. "I had 22 head on the ranch this system claimed were dead that never died. I had 60 head reported as sold that I never owned. We hot brand, we run a careful operation, I know what we have."



Australian producers were told McDonalds had requested the program. Carter called McDonalds and the fast food chain denied having anything to do with the program. "So I say this to you–fight this to the last cowboy," Carter urged to a standing ovation.



If there was one entity that received the wrath of R-CALF at the convention, it was the USDA. Over and over, there were messages of how the agency has failed not only to protect American livestock producers, but the American public. "We have a tough battle, but it is an important one," said Russ Frye, who provides legal counsel for R-CALF. "Even the pets in Canada have better protection from BSE than our public in America," said Frye.



R-CALF has applauded Canada's recent improvements to the feed ban, which far exceed that of the United States by removing the parts of cattle that are known to host the infectious agents of BSE. Called "specified risk material" (SRM), Canada removes the tissues, renders and disposes of them to prevent the material from entering any part of the animal feed chain. It is widely believed the cause of the massive mad cow outbreak in the U.K. resulted from feeding cow tissues to cattle.



America prohibits ruminant to ruminant feeding, but still permits SRM to be used in other feeds such as dog food and chicken feed. Litter from chicken cages can be used in cattle feed. The chances of accidental contamination and feeding errors are greatly reduced by removing SRM from the food chain entirely and R-CALF strongly criticizes the USDA for their failure to ensure the same safety standards that Canada has.



The price of removing SRM is estimated to cost between $15 and $30 per head at the packinghouse level.

SRM cannot be sold and it's expensive to have it picked up and hauled to the single disposal site in western Canada. "With this border wide-open now and our dollar being the same, it'll be cheaper for Tyson and Cargill to buy your cattle and bring them into America for slaughter because here, they'll still make their money on SRM," said a South Dakota rancher.



R-CALF will continue to try to block Canadian beef imports. The organization strongly feels that BSE in Canada poses a health risk to their national herd, to their markets and to their beef consumers. The convention featured Professor Jason Bartz, an expert in BSE research from Creighton University who spoke about classical BSE and two other strains of BSE that little is known about. America has had three cases of BSE, the first was in an imported Canadian cow and was of the classic variety, the same strain of mad cow from the U.K. outbreak and the same strain in all of Canada's 11 BSE cases. The other two American incidents of BSE were of a strain called "atypical H type." R-CALF sees this difference in the strain as another reason to segregate Canadian and American cattle until more can be learned of the disease.



Information was available to members at the R-CALF convention on the history of BSE in Canada. These visual aids were presented to the judge at a court case on Feb. 19 to block older Canadian cattle from entering the U.S.



maplecreeknews.com
 
Sugarman":368lcsbl said:
Thanks for the information Old Timer.
Sounds like the Canadians have learned a thing or two from the Mexicans.

Those darn Mexicans and those darn Canadians!

When we steal your export markets and own your domestic markets, wiil you wake up??

Or die in you sleep?

Well , whats your answer punk???!!
 
ALX-
You are dilusional- that's my answer ....Punk!!
NAFTA is just another form of welfare provided by the good ole' USA.

I just hope NAFTA is not becoming another conduit for our neighbors to the North & South to send inferior products across the border.
 
ALX-
You are dilusional- that's my answer ....Punk!!
NAFTA is just another form of welfare provided by the good ole' USA.

I just hope NAFTA is not becoming another conduit for our neighbors to the North & South to send inferior products across the border.
 
notable R-calf statements

Oldtimer":zf5ibjqo said:
R-CALF USA carries a certain mystique north of the border.

Mystique? :lol: :lol:

Oldtimer":zf5ibjqo said:
Litter from chicken cages can be used in cattle feed.

Yummy .. gives new meaning to the phrase you can taste the difference Yuck :lol: :lol:

Oldtimer":zf5ibjqo said:
R-CALF strongly criticizes the USDA for their failure to ensure the same safety standards that Canada has.

:shock:
:lol: :lol:
 
ALX.":si2sg6s9 said:
Sugarman":si2sg6s9 said:
Thanks for the information Old Timer.
Sounds like the Canadians have learned a thing or two from the Mexicans.

Those darn Mexicans and those darn Canadians!

When we steal your export markets and own your domestic markets, wiil you wake up??

Or die in you sleep?

Well , whats your answer punk???!!

ALX - Steal our markets???? Give me a break... Do me a favor and go back to reading the newspaper.
 
Frenchie-where you been hiding? If you paid attention- that article is written by a Canadian reporter (who happens to frequent this website), Sheri Monk, who was invited to and attended the "clandestine" R-CALF Convention. Note how she was treated by the "Evil" R-CALF members- and how she became privy to their secret agenda of taking over all Canadian ranchs. :roll: ;-)





Made in Canada
Thursday, 28 February 2008
By: Sheri Monk
Apologies to Rick Toney and Mark Elford whose names appeared incorrectly in the paper last week–my fault entirely. I'm still processing everything that transpired at the R-CALF convention and I still can't figure out why there are so many distinct accents in one country that all speak the same language.
Iowa and Ohio could hardly understand one another yet this Canadian accent of mine was pointed out at least 50 times while I was there, eh?
At lunch one day, the rancher to my right asked if I would pass the balsamic vinegar. Of course, he was from Wisconsin and I wasn't sure what he'd just said, but he pointed so I passed. "Is this Islamic vinegar?" I asked innocently. "I sure hope not," he said, eyeing his salad with suspicion.
The first day of the conference, they announced we'd be taking a pledge. I panicked, envisioning a Wal-Mart cult-like cheer, hundreds of American ranchers throwing up their hats and committing their souls to the U.S. cattle industry. Fight or flee, I was ready for both.
With just one hand on the camera to keep the other fist free and my eyes on the door, relief washed over me when I heard the opening words, "I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America..."
Texas took a while to warm up to having a Canadian at the heart of their convention and I did see one journalist thrown out by security–an American journalist.
On Feb. 19, I attended the court case in South Dakota to block older Canadian cattle from crossing the line. When I arrived, I unknowingly sat in the very middle of the R-CALF group. I realized this quickly when I heard, "She's from Canada!" being whispered down the row in front of me.
After the four-hour ordeal, I realized that Brad Wildeman of the CCA was in attendance. I cornered him then proudly and loudly introduced myself as Canadian and said I would love to hear what he thought of the case.
But Brad didn't have time for me right then. He asked me if I could wait a while and then Brad turned on his heel right back into the court room and posed for some pictures. I stood in the doorway, simultaneously shocked and embarrassed.
But those R-CALF boys who whispered about me when I first walked in witnessed what had just happened and asked if I'd like to join them for lunch.
My nickname quickly became "Canada" and when I'd pass some of these ranchers in the hallways of the hotel, they'd start singing our national anthem. Not in jest, but in a gesture of friendship.
Never once at the formal presentations or in whiskey-drinking sessions did R-CALF slam the Canadian producer. While we hear about court cases to keep out our cattle, they speak of their USDA who they do not trust and of Cargill and Tyson who they feel have used producers in both countries to drive down live prices.
The topics were not limited to BSE or Canadian beef. Property rights and mandatory identification and movement tracking were high on the list.
I was asked about our brand inspection program and I handed out every Cowtown Livestock Exchange pen I had with me. The bar was plumb full of Canadian whiskey and I helped those boys make good use of it.
Shooters were a new concept to them and I'll be damned if they didn't go and get the ingredients for the next night's session.
Blanket BSE testing is something they're fighting for. In fact, there's one small independent packer who has sued the USDA for not allowing them to BSE test every animal they kill.
There was talk of how Canadian and American producers could work together to stop the big packers from using live supplies to depreciate prices, thereby improving the industry for all. See, they don't want to end up eating Chinese cows either.
To see a table of loyal R-CALF members even discussing that concept was a proud moment, as it was to see copies of the Maple Creek News-Times tucked under the arms of ranchers from all over America.
Not because it represents me–but because it represents YOU. Those papers contain a bit of Maple Creek, the Southwest, our history, our cattle, our roots, our country and what we're made of.
And I'm pretty damn proud of that.
 
banghead-1.gif


I so had to try it
 
gerardplauche":3klwxles said:
ALX.":3klwxles said:
Sugarman":3klwxles said:
Thanks for the information Old Timer.
Sounds like the Canadians have learned a thing or two from the Mexicans.

Those darn Mexicans and those darn Canadians!

When we steal your export markets and own your domestic markets, wiil you wake up??

Or die in you sleep?

Well , whats your answer punk???!!

ALX - Steal our markets???? Give me a break... Do me a favor and go back to reading the newspaper.

U.S. marketing experts already advising meat retailers/packers that identity verified Canadian product will have more appeal to U.S. consumers. Safer. Cleaner. Quality. Honest. Canada.
 
ALX - This is just a trend. I thought you were smarter than that. Do you honestly think that Canada (or Mexico) has the infastructure to keep up with US demands??? Get real. Pawn off your ideas to someone who doesn't know better.
 
Oldtimer":1la37owc said:
Frenchie-where you been hiding?


Not much time to post since I expanded the cowherd :lol:





Oldtimer":1la37owc said:
If you paid attention- that article is written by a Canadian reporter (who happens to frequent this website), Sheri Monk,

It does not really matter to me who wrote this article OT, i have posted several articles by Americans does that obligate you OT to agree with their views.You were the distributer of said info.



Oldtimer":1la37owc said:
Never once at the formal presentations or in whiskey-drinking sessions did R-CALF slam the Canadian producer. ,

They did not need to they already did it in court OT .. a scorpion is a scorpion they all bite given the right time and opportunity


Oldtimer":1la37owc said:
There was talk of how Canadian and American producers could work together to stop the big packers from using live supplies to depreciate prices, thereby improving the industry for all.


.Sort of a scorpion &toad affair deal ..right Ot the scorpion convinces the toad to swim across the river because he can,t do it alone.The toad is unsure..But the Scorpion assures him everything is fine. They both swim the river together, until they just about get to the other side.where the scorpion stings the Toad.. the toads asks why ..The scorpion replies Its just my nature

`
 
gerardplauche":3mvevgzu said:
ALX - This is just a trend. I thought you were smarter than that. Do you honestly think that Canada (or Mexico) has the infastructure to keep up with US demands??? Get real. Pawn off your ideas to someone who doesn't know better.

Obviously Canada's production isn't even a drop in the bucket, 2% of U.S. production was a number i've heard before. Some states produce more beef than all of Canada. I am just saying we won't have any problem selling a lot of quality beef in the U.S. as long as there are no trade disruptions.

I just resent it whenever someone starts waving a flag and putting other folks down.
I could submit pages of links to U.S. product faults, quality problems etc..Some people like to finger point and blame others for their woes because it is easy. What is harder is getting your own house in order.

U.S. is a huge EXPORTER. I don't have the time right now, but I believe Canada is your #1 customer for your agricultural EXPORTS.

I don't think the U.S. economy would benefit from peeing off a bunch of buyers at this point. You folks wanna make trade difficult for us, well I think it is not going to be as easy to bully the fools we elected this time. Trade barriers will result in trade barriers.
 
ALX-
I realize that goods flow both ways in the NAFTA. My point is -I never hear about inferior American products being exported in the NAFTA region- but I always read hear about second-rate products being imported into the US. Why is that?
 
Sugarman":2n7y3nz1 said:
ALX-
I realize that goods flow both ways in the NAFTA. My point is -I never hear about inferior American products being exported in the NAFTA region- but I always read hear about second-rate products being imported into the US. Why is that?

There was a shipment of carrots or spinach ( don't make me go look ) last year, killed 3 and left a bunch paralyzed, came from California.

Some still believe the BSE feed was imported from US :lol:

Like I said, it could fill pages.

Like I said earlier, much more popular to blame others than face facts. No matter how hard hate groups like R-Cult try, the U.S. consumer apparently has caught on to their deception.

Maybe it isn't considered news unless it gives you reason to hate or fear. News that shames you wouldn't be popular. Oops, I forgot how y'all handle those downers and punch em on through to school kids!! :lol: :lol:
 

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