Johnsongrass or Johnson grass?

[Sir Loin]

Johnsongrass or Johnson grass?
Are these two grasses one and the same?
SL

Sorghum halepense (L.) Pers.
Johnsongrass

http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=SOHA

General poisoning notes:
Johnson grass (Sorghum halepense) is a naturalized herb found as a weed in only a few counties of southwestern Ontario. This plant can produce toxic quantities of HCN if it is damaged through frost, mastication, or water stress. Johnson grass can also accumulate toxic amounts of nitrate under certain circumstances. Cattle and a horse were poisoned after ingesting Johnson grass. Plants are spread from rhizomes but susceptibility to severe frost has limited the plants to a few counties in southwestern Ontario. The grass is found in fields and field edges. Toxicity is not likely, but ingesting large quantities of Johnson grass can cause problems (Gray et al. 1968, Clay et al. 1976, Warwick and Black 1983).

http://www.cookiebabyinc.com/poisonousp ... grass.html

 

[Caustic Burno]

I don't know the official name of Johnson Grass but it is in the sorghum family.

 

[Sir Loin]

Now admit it, you had to look this one up too, didn’t you? :lol:

FYI:
HCN
Hydrocyanic
Etymology: International Scientific Vocabulary
: an aqueous solution of hydrogen cyanide HCN that is a poisonous weak acid and is used chiefly in fumigating and in organic synthesis

 

[Wewild]

Now admit it, you had to look this one up too, didn’t you? :lol:

FYI:
HCN
Hydrocyanic
Etymology: International Scientific Vocabulary
: an aqueous solution of hydrogen cyanide HCN that is a poisonous weak acid and is used chiefly in fumigating and in organic synthesis

I thought it was a display of dry humor. I am still confused.

We love Johnson grass how ever it's spelled.

I thought it was prussic acid. I didn't look it up.

 

[Sir Loin]

We,
Re:

I am still confused.

When I read the article on SW Canada they used “HCN”, so I didn’t know what “HCD” stood for, so I had to look it up in my dictionary, which looks like an sh outhouse Sears catalog. Did you know what it meant, or did you have to look it up? (Rhetorical question) more DH!
And the TN article and the Canada one spelled it differently which brought up the question of “are they both talking of the same plant?”

Re:

We love Johnson grass how ever it's spelled.

I have since determined that they are in fact talking of the same grass, but are just spelling it differently.


It was this that has me concerned as I feed it to both my cattle and sometimes my horses as hay.

. Cattle and a horse were poisoned after ingesting Johnson grass. &
Toxicity is not likely, but ingesting large quantities of Johnson grass can cause problems (Gray et al. 1968, Clay et al. 1976, Warwick and Black 1983).

I have two horses that are now foaming at the mouth to the point they look like they are regurgitating foam and saliva. Thought it was from clover but they are still doing it and I took them out of the pasture and on different hay.
Plus, I remember several cows doing the same thing, but not as bad as my horses, last winter and never did figure out why.
Tomorrow I will check to see if the hay there were eating has any Johnsongrass or Johnson grass in it.
SL

 

[Proverbs 12:10]

I have two horses that are now foaming at the mouth to the point they look like they are regurgitating foam and saliva. Thought it was from clover but they are still doing it and I took them out of the pasture and on different hay.
Plus, I remember several cows doing the same thing, but not as bad as my horses, last winter and never did figure out why.
Tomorrow I will check to see if the hay there were eating has any Johnsongrass or Johnson grass in it.
SL

Are you currently in a drought stage?

 

[Limomike]

Yes, Johnson grass. Its a favorite of my cattle. Its the one grass they will stick their necks out for. (thru the fence I mean)

 

[backhoeboogie]

I thought it was prussic acid. I didn't look it up.

I have always heard the same. Johnson Grass will develop it when it is in stress. It will kill cattle. Been there.

 

[Dusty Britches]

It was in some hay we bought last year and for the first time in many years we have Johnson Grass on our place.

While it is only in small patches, how do I get rid of it?

 

[Cabo]

It was in some hay we bought last year and for the first time in many years we have Johnson Grass on our place.

While it is only in small patches, how do I get rid of it?

Hogs will take care of it nicely. Of course there are other less smelly ways.

 

[Frankie]

It was in some hay we bought last year and for the first time in many years we have Johnson Grass on our place.

While it is only in small patches, how do I get rid of it?

Johnsongrass doesn't stand up to being grazed. That's why you don't find much of it in the pasture. Most of it grows along the roadway here. If you can get cows to graze it before it's stressed, they'll kill it.

 

[Sir Loin]

Proverbs,
Re:

Are you currently in a drought stage?

Yes. But the hay I am feeding them was baled last year and may have been Johnson grass.
SL

 

[Tod Dague]

Prussic acid forms with stress typically from drought or frost. Stressed Johnson grass will develop red spots. When cut for hay if it is allowed to dry thoroughly the prussic acid will dissipate. Just like with other sorghums if it is heavily fertilized and doesn't have enough rain it can have high levels of nitrates which is extremely fatal since the nitrogen bonds to the red blood cells where the oxygen should. That's about all I know about that.

 

[Lammie]

I posted something similar last summer. I was told that if it dries then it isn't poisonous and that it will become poisonous if it is stressed by drought.

 

[Limomike]

Prussic acid forms with stress typically from drought or frost. Stressed Johnson grass will develop red spots. When cut for hay if it is allowed to dry thoroughly the prussic acid will dissipate. Just like with other sorghums if it is heavily fertilized and doesn't have enough rain it can have high levels of nitrates which is extremely fatal since the nitrogen bonds to the red blood cells where the oxygen should. That's about all I know about that.

now thats some good info right there! I never knew that. We have baled it in the past, but I guess we never had a problem with the prussic acid in it. Either that or we let it dry out good enough. My cows like it like a kid likes candy.

 

[milesvb]

Prussic acid forms with stress typically from drought or frost. Stressed Johnson grass will develop red spots. When cut for hay if it is allowed to dry thoroughly the prussic acid will dissipate. Just like with other sorghums if it is heavily fertilized and doesn't have enough rain it can have high levels of nitrates which is extremely fatal since the nitrogen bonds to the red blood cells where the oxygen should. That's about all I know about that.

now thats some good info right there! I never knew that. We have baled it in the past, but I guess we never had a problem with the prussic acid in it. Either that or we let it dry out good enough. My cows like it like a kid likes candy.

Also, nitrates do not dissipate from cut forage so they will remain a problem in hay.

 

[john250]

I spent the early years of my career raising corn and beans.
Johnsongrass was uncontrollable until Roundup came along. And then Roundup-ready corn and beans. Now it isn't much of a problem.

It is the devils bargain. Great, nutritious forage--but you can't control it.

I'll never be able to plant the stuff.