Is it just me...? Vaccination Q’s.

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ksmit454

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Is it just me or do your cattle get a lump the day after vaccination, at the injection site? I just vaccinated with Cavalry 9 about 3 days ago, and my cattle always have a little lump after. Is there any was to avoid this or is it normal? I am new to Sub-Q vaccines. I have always done our horses vaccines which are IM (and a lot easier in my opinion). Is it ok to give cattle vaccines IM? Or follow label for Sub-Q?
Also, is it possible to overdose when vaccinating? Let me give some back story. Went to vaccinate a 6 month old calf, and she jumped pretty good when vaccinating, and I knew I didn’t get the whole dose in her. I gave another CC just to be sure she got a full dose. She’s totally fine and acting normal but I’ve heard of people accidentally dosing more of the vaccine than directed by the bottle and had no issues.
Thanks!
 
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wbvs58

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I take it that your Cavalry 9 is mostly the clostridial diseases in which case a lump is pretty much the norm in many of them when given IV. Definitely don't give them IM as you will still get the lump but it will be hidden in the muscle and all cattle will end up being eaten and lumps/ scarring in the muscle is a big no no. You can try giving it in a less obvious place like the back of the ear or the tail fold beside the anus.
Giving a bigger dose of vaccine will not be a problem, the recommended dose is really the minimum recommended that will will produce an immune response in most animals, more is fine, just wastefull.

Ken
 
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ksmit454

ksmit454

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I take it that your Cavalry 9 is mostly the clostridial diseases in which case a lump is pretty much the norm in many of them when given IV. Definitely don't give them IM as you will still get the lump but it will be hidden in the muscle and all cattle will end up being eaten and lumps/ scarring in the muscle is a big no no. You can try giving it in a less obvious place like the back of the ear or the tail fold beside the anus.
Giving a bigger dose of vaccine will not be a problem, the recommended dose is really the minimum recommended that will will produce an immune response in most animals, more is fine, just wastefull.

Ken
Great, thank you Ken.
Is there a specific reason as to why the colstridial vaccines cause this sort of lump?
Kassi
 
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ksmit454

ksmit454

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Pretty much always a lump with Calvery 9 or Covexin 8. I generally rub the injection site after administering. Doesn't really make a difference with clostridial vacs but I do it anyway, out of habit.
Thank you. Always thought I could try to avoid it. I’ll try rubbing the area well after vaccinating.
Kassi
 

FungusProudKY31

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Great, thank you Ken.
Is there a specific reason as to why the colstridial vaccines cause this sort of lump?
Kassi
I was told by a vet that the lump is because the vaccine deposited in the cutaneous muscle (thin muscle that wiggles the skin). He said to try tenting better and/or using a shorter needle.
 

simme

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My understanding. Some vaccines have an adjuvant added. Adjuvants help increase the immune response and effectiveness. Vaccines with adjuvants form tissue deposits at the injection site beneath the skin that are seen and felt as knots.
The stronger the adjuvant, the more likely, the bigger and longer lasting the knot. Example is Alpha-7 vaccine. It is a one shot blackleg vaccine - no second shot required in a few weeks. I think that is due to the stronger oil adjuvant. It seems to always result in a big knot.
Human vaccines have adjuvants as well. I assume we have lesions in muscle from those vaccines as well.
 
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ksmit454

ksmit454

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My understanding. Some vaccines have an adjuvant added. Adjuvants help increase the immune response and effectiveness. Vaccines with adjuvants form tissue deposits at the injection site beneath the skin that are seen and felt as knots.
The stronger the adjuvant, the more likely, the bigger and longer lasting the knot. Example is Alpha-7 vaccine. It is a one shot blackleg vaccine - no second shot required in a few weeks. I think that is due to the stronger oil adjuvant. It seems to always result in a big knot.
Human vaccines have adjuvants as well. I assume we have lesions in muscle from those vaccines as well.
Interesting, thank you for adding this info.
 

WFfarm

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Me too. I have given LA-200 with a lump after also.
La-200 is notorious for leaving welts with SQ injections. I think some cows are more sensitive/allergic than others. Biomycin 200 is supposed to be comparable to LA-200 and "sting free"
 

FungusProudKY31

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My understanding. Some vaccines have an adjuvant added. Adjuvants help increase the immune response and effectiveness. Vaccines with adjuvants form tissue deposits at the injection site beneath the skin that are seen and felt as knots.
The stronger the adjuvant, the more likely, the bigger and longer lasting the knot. Example is Alpha-7 vaccine. It is a one shot blackleg vaccine - no second shot required in a few weeks. I think that is due to the stronger oil adjuvant. It seems to always result in a big knot.
Human vaccines have adjuvants as well. I assume we have lesions in muscle from those vaccines as well.
Human vaccines have adjuvants as well. I assume we have lesions in muscle from those vaccines as well.

I'll remember that line if I am ever captured by cannibals!:giggle:
 

Dusty Britches

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I just used Covexin 8 on my whole herd last winter and I did not have a single lump.

I've always been told the lump from clostridia vaccines is because a muscle was nicked. The lump is an infection and to assume the calf is essentially not vaccinated. I try to follow the protocols for the Vac 45 program. The lumps tell the buyers that perhaps the calf went through the process to be vaccinated but he really wasn't vaccinated. A lot of time the lump will not show for a week, which is frustrating.
 
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