Ideal Grass Cattle Size

[Stocker Steve]

I usually put light (averaging about 400 pound) steers onto grass in the spring. Most do well... I have noticed that while almost all of the heavier (400 to 450 pounds) steers do well, a few of the lighest (300 to 350 pounds) steers do not. Is there an optimal size for grass cattle or is it a it depends by breed thing?

 

[MikeC]

I usually put light (averaging about 400 pound) steers onto grass in the spring. Most do well... I have noticed that while almost all of the heavier (400 to 450 pounds) steers do well, a few of the lighest (300 to 350 pounds) steers do not. Is there an optimal size for grass cattle or is it a it depends by breed thing?

Steve, I have noticed stockers buying smaller calves (300-400) because they are usually cheaper. Most cow-calf operators wean at 6-7 months. If their calves don't reach 500-600 lbs. in that period of time something is bad wrong. What I'm saying is the majority of calves at market will be 500 and up. If they are not it's because they are either genetically inferior or didn't have a good mother or conditions were below the norm.
But then again, some cow-calf folks sell calves early because the $'s per pound is higher, and they can brag in the coffee shop that their calves brought X dollars per pound.
Drought and/or other conditions will force some to sell earlier but then you would probably know it.
Stay away from the lighter calves, they take longer, thus leaving more time for a train wreck. JMHO

 

[bigbull338]

the 300 to 350lb calves takelonger to get on grass. i know you have them on a heath program as well. try pre conditioning them before you turn them out. that may help alot .do you check weigh them . like at 30 an 60 days after you bring them in . scott

 

[frenchie]

You will have a lot less problems with 500-600 lb grass calves than the lighter ones

 

[Stocker Steve]

I am planning to buy an electronic scale for the chute. I do background them for about 45 days before turnout. I have spot checked a few in the past - - they range all the way from 0.5 to 2.9 ADG.

I was wondering if the real light calves have do not have the rumen to do as well on grass as the 5 wt. size?

 

[bigbull338]

right light calves dont have rumon going to good. b/c they are mostly on milk along with eating some grass feed an hay . so you have to get theor rumon started. the 5 weight calves are ready for grass an feed . so most times when you turn them out they hit ground running. gaining weight fast. scott

 

[Bama]

Buying the lighter weight is a challenge. I do it regularly. The trick is to be able to figure out which ones are the easykeepers. In this weight class you will have several conditions of calves. Some are there because they were "dumped" To allow someone else to take the risk. Some are there for other reasons. Picking the right ones is the risky part. I look at them as their present condition and cost now verses the condition and cost to get to their potentional. All of them will not finish in the top of their class, its the return on investment I look at. If one finishes in less than top and it only took me very little in investment to get him there I still make more than one that I paid to much for and spent megabucks to finish top.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Thanks for the tips. I understand some of the challenges. I know how to keep them alive but they are certainly not all easy keepers.

Steered blacks go very high here. I have been buying a lot of red, smoke, or white bulls. Last year my best deal was a bunch of belted Galloways that no one wanted. I try to avoid the light framed dairy crosses, the freaks, and the feathernecks. They do not sell well when it their time to go.

How light will you go when buying calves?

 

[frenchie]

How light will you go when buying calves?

I buy nothing under 300 lbs , unless I am going to graft it on a cow.

 

[Tod Dague]

When I was running some stockers I tended to stay away from anything under 500 lbs. They just don't pay much for the 100 lbs. of gain from 400 to 500 around here.

 

[Tod Dague]

I looked up the Weighted Average Summary for 21 Texas Auctions - 06/26/05 thru 07/02/05 at the Feeder Steers Medium and Large #2
Ave wt. . Ave $ CWT. . Ave pay out. . Ave pay out for cwt gain
226. . . . . . 162.02. . . . 366.17. . Adjusted to 100 lbs. of gain
325 . . . . . . 141.56 . . . .460.07 . . . . . . . 94.85
421 . . . . . . 125.64 . . . .528.94 . . . . . . . 71.74
522 . . . . . . 115.24 . . . .601.55 . . . . . . . 71.89
620 . . . . . . 108.00 . . . .669.60 . . . . . . . 69.44
724 . . . . . . 100.59 . . . .728.27 . . . . . . . 56.42
779 . . . . . . 100.02 . . . .779.16 . . . . . . . 46.26 for 50 lbs. of gain
887 . . . . . . 87.00 . . . . .771.69 . . . . . . . -6.91
So it looks like the 620 to 724 will be the least pay with the 325 to 421 and the 724 to 779 will be the most pay and the 400 to 500 will be fine. I still prefer the 500 lbs. calves over the 400. They just performed better. I used to use this for determining when and what to buy and sell. Excel is great for this. I liked to do both on the same market. During the cycle up profit and tax burden will be up and cash flow will be down and just the opposite during the cycle down.

The last thing you want to be doing is putting on wt. @ $.35/ lb. and get paid for $.33/lb. There doesn’t look to be much risk of that with the current market but things change.

Of note the 887 ave wt group only had 5 steers in the group.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Great data Todd! I like the avgerage pay out for cwt. gain of the lightest calves - - but I may not backgrounding them long enough before turnout.

I took grass steers from an average 420# buy wt. to 810# sell wt. last summer, but when they sorted off the heaviest ones I got less than $0.40/# for that last 50#.

I am concerned about the marketing and handling costs with shorter term deals. Have you had any success with buying 600 to 650# and selling the 750# that the order buyers seem to like?

 

[Tod Dague]

I liked to put 200# or more on them. 100# is just too quick of a turn around. The majority of your labor and cost is on the front end; worming, cutting, vaccinations, and sick calves. By the time you get them gaining good you would be sending them off and starting all over again. A friend of mine would buy 300# calves and keep them for 9 months and sell them. Waite three months and start over. His labor was very low and he only kept them when he had grass with out planting.

 

[Tod Dague]

Don't know if you know about this or not but it is where I go to look at local markets. http://www.ams.usda.gov/lsmnpubs/Live.htm

 

[Stocker Steve]

My nutrition guy said that light calves need less fiber and more energy. Any experience out there with light calves on cereal rye grass?

 

[frenchie]

My nutrition guy said that light calves need less fiber and more energy. Any experience out there with light calves on cereal rye grass?

I keep a straw bale out in ours in case they need it.

 

[Central Fl Cracker]

Todd
Being in Florida we have good grazing almost all year I think. I am waiting on Flaboy to confirm this but With that said could you buy in the fall when prices are down and then sell in the spring or are you better to buy spring sell in the fall.
Also what is the downside with stockers? I have just recently started watching prices and are they as volatile as the stock market or do the go up or down slower than stock market can.

Good site for stocker info

http://www.oznet.ksu.edu/library/LVSTK2 ... 20stocker'

 

[Central Fl Cracker]

bump

 

[Emgen]

What is backgrounding?

 

[dun]

What is backgrounding?

Backgrounding is the feeding and conditioning process that prepares cattle to go the feedlot.Typically 4-5 weight, occasioanlly 6s are fed in a confiement or semiconfinement program to accuston them to a higher grain ration that will be used in the feedlot.

dun