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<blockquote data-quote="Frankie" data-source="post: 60980" data-attributes="member: 13"><p>Do you understand how this message board works? I don't, but I know that it does. Are you a computer guru? Are you actually looking for the computer code? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Oh, from your posts here complaining that EPDs won't tell you what something weighs, it's obvious that you don't know much about EPDs. You wanted to know what calves from a bull with an 80 lb YW EPD will weigh. That's proof you don't understand EPDs.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I haven't said I know all about EPDs, but I for sure know more than you do. I did give you the foundation figures for Angus EPDs. Why are you ignoring it? <strong>The Angus Association averaged all the BW, WW and YWs reported in 1976 (or '77) and set that as 0. </strong>So what? That average is available to you in your sire summary. But those numbers mean very little, since adjustments have been made and the computer programs improved since the inception of EPDs. No, I don't know what the program consists of any more than I understand the computer program that runs this message board. But I know they both work.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I guess you failed kindergarden then because you don't seem to understand the basic use of EPDs: that they don't tell you what something will weigh.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Ah, you're so much smarter than the average bear. You are working very hard not to understand EPDs. There's no secret about EPDs. They are just what I've posted, nothing more, nothing less. If you can get someone to explain how the program works, you won't know any secret that is useful to you, as a breeder, than you know now. A bull with a BW EPD of 5 will be expected to produce calves weighing five more pounds at birth than a bull of the same breed with a BW EPD of 0. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Interesting that you would use something you have no faith in to promote your cattle. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Gee, you choose to use a minor breed that most cattle people don't use and complain because MARC doesn't include them in their computations. Poor you. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Base of what? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>We're talking to different producers for sure. because I see more and more people turning to EPDs. I can see people that you explain EPDs to being disappointed in the results they get in using them.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Who says there needs to be a total across breed EPD? Just because you choose to use a minor breed doesn't mean the rest of the world should cater to your requirements. I'm very satisfied with the situation.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>LOL! You are for sure a hoot! Tell me what knowing how the program for EPD works will help you use EPDs? You will still use them the same way.</p><p>A bull with a BW EPD of 5 will be expected to produce calves weighing five more pounds at birth than a bull of the same breed with a BW EPD of 0. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>DUH is right. It's pretty simple; you just don't like EPDs and have latched on to the fact that you can't find the program that you likely wouldn't understand anyway to "prove" they don't work. Sorry, but they do work.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Or you might get the worst traits of each breed by crossing them. You're ranting again, BTW.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You didn't hear the phrase "no bad animal" from me. You heard no bad EPD from me. And it's the truth. You have elected to use a minor breed and now are out here ranting because the rest of the world doesn't cater to your requests.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I guess "small breeder" depends on where you live. I'd call a small breeder 15-25 cows. As I said, the producers around here that actually depend on cattle for their living are the ones who seem most interested in EPDs. I don't have any rich cattle producers in my area, I'm afraid. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You have not defined what "higher EPD" cattle are. Obviously you don't understand how EPDs work, so you can't really say if they work or not. EPDs are based on data in the Angus database. As more information comes available, EPDs may change. I've seen bulls EPDs go up as well as down. But then I'm pretty picky about the bulls I use.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I explained this once, but I'll put it in bold since you have such a problem: <strong>EPDs are based on contemporary groupings.</strong> A contemporary group (you would know this if you had bothered to read EPD literature) is a group of at least two calves, born within 90 days of each other and raised under similar conditions. Thus, your claim that calves raised in lush pasture conditions or desert conditions would skew EPDs is inaccurate. Want to try again?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think you're proving my point here, though your ranting is a bit hard to understand sometimes. Both breeders had similar EPDs, so what makes one breeder's cattle "inferior?" Did they have bad hair?</p><p></p><p>I don't consider raising good Angus cattle a competition. I'm not trying to compete with the "big shots" in the Angus business. There's a good demand for good Angus bulls and cows. I'm not always pleased by what my animals bring at a sale, but I trust the buyers to recognize good genetics. If they don't like my cattle, it's generally my fault and I'll do better next time. I do appreciate the large breeders who are willing to step out and prove new genetics so I can comfortably use them.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Frankie, post: 60980, member: 13"] Do you understand how this message board works? I don’t, but I know that it does. Are you a computer guru? Are you actually looking for the computer code? Oh, from your posts here complaining that EPDs won’t tell you what something weighs, it’s obvious that you don’t know much about EPDs. You wanted to know what calves from a bull with an 80 lb YW EPD will weigh. That's proof you don't understand EPDs. I haven't said I know all about EPDs, but I for sure know more than you do. I did give you the foundation figures for Angus EPDs. Why are you ignoring it? [b]The Angus Association averaged all the BW, WW and YWs reported in 1976 (or ‘77) and set that as 0. [/b]So what? That average is available to you in your sire summary. But those numbers mean very little, since adjustments have been made and the computer programs improved since the inception of EPDs. No, I don’t know what the program consists of any more than I understand the computer program that runs this message board. But I know they both work. I guess you failed kindergarden then because you don’t seem to understand the basic use of EPDs: that they don’t tell you what something will weigh. Ah, you're so much smarter than the average bear. You are working very hard not to understand EPDs. There’s no secret about EPDs. They are just what I’ve posted, nothing more, nothing less. If you can get someone to explain how the program works, you won’t know any secret that is useful to you, as a breeder, than you know now. A bull with a BW EPD of 5 will be expected to produce calves weighing five more pounds at birth than a bull of the same breed with a BW EPD of 0. Interesting that you would use something you have no faith in to promote your cattle. Gee, you choose to use a minor breed that most cattle people don’t use and complain because MARC doesn’t include them in their computations. Poor you. Base of what? We’re talking to different producers for sure. because I see more and more people turning to EPDs. I can see people that you explain EPDs to being disappointed in the results they get in using them. Who says there needs to be a total across breed EPD? Just because you choose to use a minor breed doesn’t mean the rest of the world should cater to your requirements. I’m very satisfied with the situation. LOL! You are for sure a hoot! Tell me what knowing how the program for EPD works will help you use EPDs? You will still use them the same way. A bull with a BW EPD of 5 will be expected to produce calves weighing five more pounds at birth than a bull of the same breed with a BW EPD of 0. DUH is right. It’s pretty simple; you just don’t like EPDs and have latched on to the fact that you can’t find the program that you likely wouldn't understand anyway to “prove” they don’t work. Sorry, but they do work. Or you might get the worst traits of each breed by crossing them. You’re ranting again, BTW. You didn’t hear the phrase “no bad animal” from me. You heard no bad EPD from me. And it’s the truth. You have elected to use a minor breed and now are out here ranting because the rest of the world doesn’t cater to your requests. I guess "small breeder" depends on where you live. I’d call a small breeder 15-25 cows. As I said, the producers around here that actually depend on cattle for their living are the ones who seem most interested in EPDs. I don’t have any rich cattle producers in my area, I’m afraid. You have not defined what “higher EPD” cattle are. Obviously you don’t understand how EPDs work, so you can't really say if they work or not. EPDs are based on data in the Angus database. As more information comes available, EPDs may change. I’ve seen bulls EPDs go up as well as down. But then I’m pretty picky about the bulls I use. I explained this once, but I’ll put it in bold since you have such a problem: [b]EPDs are based on contemporary groupings.[/b] A contemporary group (you would know this if you had bothered to read EPD literature) is a group of at least two calves, born within 90 days of each other and raised under similar conditions. Thus, your claim that calves raised in lush pasture conditions or desert conditions would skew EPDs is inaccurate. Want to try again? I think you’re proving my point here, though your ranting is a bit hard to understand sometimes. Both breeders had similar EPDs, so what makes one breeder's cattle "inferior?" Did they have bad hair? I don’t consider raising good Angus cattle a competition. I’m not trying to compete with the “big shots” in the Angus business. There’s a good demand for good Angus bulls and cows. I’m not always pleased by what my animals bring at a sale, but I trust the buyers to recognize good genetics. If they don’t like my cattle, it’s generally my fault and I’ll do better next time. I do appreciate the large breeders who are willing to step out and prove new genetics so I can comfortably use them. [/QUOTE]
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