How Soon Can I Breed Back by AI?

[boondocks]

Howdy all,
We did our first round of timed AI late last year, to 4 cows and three heifers. All 4 cows and 1 heifer took on the first try. One of the heifers (who had bad pinkeye at the time of AI) we observed to be in heat and she took 3 wks later on the second AI. (The third heifer is open despite 2 AI's).

The upshot is that we have 4 cows and one heifer due July 15, and the other heifer due 3 weeks later. Since we were behind schedule getting our chute and all ready last fall, they are due about 3 months later than we'd like. We'd like to move up our calving date over the next few years to mid-April.

Would it be a good idea to plan on a Sept. 15 date to AI? That would give the July 15 calvers 2 months, and the early August calver a bit less. (I'd rather try to AI them all at once; if we need a second try, we can do any stragglers together and still keep a tight calving window). If they take on Sept. 15, that would give us a June 24 due date for 2015. We'd then try to keep rolling it back a few weeks each year.

Is this too aggressive? Conversely, could we move it up a week and try to get a mid-June calving next year?

The cows are all in good condition; all 4 mamas gave birth last year to their first calves with no assistance. 3 of the 4 cows and both the heifers are Angus; the other cow is a Hereford.

Mostly I don't want to push the 2 first-timers too fast and hose them up...The other issue further down the road will be trying to fit any new retained heifers into this schedule (they'd effectively be a month "behind" at birth), but we don't plan to add too many more the next year or two, so that is an issue we can kick down the road a bit.

Suggestions/comments welcome, thanks!

 

[dun]

You can move it up a month or so each year. I would be more prone to delay breeding them and just breed them when I wanted them bred originally. Not all of them will move up so you will end up with calving scattered all over the place.

 

[WalnutCrest]

If semen cost isn't a big deal to you, you can try to AI about a month after birth as that's about when a typical cow will come back into season ... but you should expect them to all take ... thereby spreading out your calving season... but in the cases where it works, you'd get where you wanted to go (April calving) a bit faster.

Alternatively, you could delay a couple of months and calve in the fall.

 

[Lucky_P]

I usually want 'em to be at least 45 days out from calving before I'll try to synch 'em; 60 days is more typical. But, if I see 'em in heat earlier - and it's during the prescribed breeding season, I'll breed 'em.

 

[boondocks]

Thanks for the advice, all. Sounds like it's not a terrible idea to try for a Sept. 15 AI, just be ready to accept that not all might take (especially the early Aug. calver).
We aren't really gung-ho on fall calving here; the environment in winter is pretty harsh so we'd rather get the calves a bit further along.
Conversely, I hate to delay AI 9 months and carry them open through winter and miss a calving year; although that would get us back on schedule, it would still essentially take 2 years to do so. Two of them already missed (got a pass on) what should have been their first calving season, so I hate to have them miss another.
Anything special I could do for the early-Aug. calver to give her a better shot at a Sept. 15 AI? She is growing well on hay but maybe when she calves I should do something additional?

 

[WalnutCrest]

If you are going to bring them back to your desired timeframe relatively quickly, and you want to keep your window tight, be prepared to cull your opens. While you might sacrifice your numbers in the short term, your herd fertility in ten years will reward you.

 

[boondocks]

If you are going to bring them back to your desired timeframe relatively quickly, and you want to keep your window tight, be prepared to cull your opens. While you might sacrifice your numbers in the short term, your herd fertility in ten years will reward you.

Thanks, WalnutCrest. I'm prepared to give them a try on Sept. 15, then watch very closely for heats and re-AI just a few weeks later if any are in heat. Any that come open after the second try, I will seriously consider culling. They've all been pretty fertile so far (knock wood!) so I really hope we don't need cross that bridge quite yet. (The one heifer that didn't take after 2 AI's belongs to a friend and will probably be culled).

Of our own cows, we were 2 for 2 calving last year with about 4-5 weeks' exposure to the (neighbor's) bull. We decided to then go AI. On AI, 3 of 4 (the same two cows plus two heifers) took on the first try and the 4th took on the second try (she was pretty blind w/ pinkeye at the first AI). So they seem to be pretty fertile; the farm they are from had 100% pregnant last year, even the several who are over 15, including at least one that's 18. Although we have made many mistakes the past 3 years, we were lucky to source our starter cows from some very sturdy stock, who seem to do quite well on grass and not need much pampering or fussing--which is great for us newbies!

Thanks again for the good advice!

 

[BC]

You might try this on the early August calving cow - at about 3 weeks after calving, let the calf nurse just once a day. Give it a calf starter. Shouldn't affect weaning weight too much and could help the cow move up. What is your synch program? I have used the co-synch program with pretty good success. I remove calves from the time I pull CIDR's until I breed.