How can this be?

[Santas and Duhram Reds]

I recently read a hereford ad that claimed the hereford breed provided more hybrid vigor on Bos Taurus cattle than any other breed in a crossbreeding system. I just don't see how this can be. How can a Bos Taurus animal provide the most hybrid vigor on other Bos Taurus cattle. I understand that the Hereford maybe one of the more "untainted" breeds, but the degree of relation would still have to be greater than that of a Bos Indicus derived animal in my opinion.

 

[greenwillowhereford II]

I haven't seen it recently, but I think that the point is supposed to be that there is more hybrid vigor than any other Bos Taurus breed offers. I know that a couple of years ago, I saw a study that showed that the Hereford complemented Gelbveih more than any other breed across the board.

 

[Santas and Duhram Reds]

Where I read the ad was actually in the Oklahoma Cowman's August 2008 issue. If you should happen to have it, look it up.

 

[3waycross]

I haven't seen it recently, but I think that the point is supposed to be that there is more hybrid vigor than any other Bos Taurus breed offers. I know that a couple of years ago, I saw a study that showed that the Hereford complemented Gelbveih more than any other breed across the board.

Can you remember where you read that? I would like to see how they arrived at that conclusion. I have been thinking about crossing some of my Gelbvieh cows and that sounds interesting.

 

[novatech]

I recently read a hereford ad that claimed the hereford breed provided more hybrid vigor on Bos Taurus cattle than any other breed in a crossbreeding system. I just don't see how this can be. How can a Bos Taurus animal provide the most hybrid vigor on other Bos Taurus cattle. I understand that the Hereford maybe one of the more "untainted" breeds, but the degree of relation would still have to be greater than that of a Bos Indicus derived animal in my opinion.

Advertising has gone the way of claiming anything they want knowing it would take millions on someones part to prove they are wrong. They may have even done a study of randomly selected groups to get the results. Of course they had do do the study 50 times before they got the results they wanted. People assume if it is written then it has to be true. Same reason people are buying into black hide.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

i think that's the thing "complementing" the other breeds... and they do pretty good at it

 

[cfpinz]

Can you remember where you read that? I would like to see how they arrived at that conclusion. I have been thinking about crossing some of my Gelbvieh cows and that sounds interesting.

We bred some of our straight herf cows and some baldies to a red gelbvieh bull the past couple years. I'm sold.

 

[HerefordSire]

Advertising has gone the way of claiming anything they want knowing it would take millions on someones part to prove they are wrong. They may have even done a study of randomly selected groups to get the results. Of course they had do do the study 50 times before they got the results they wanted. People assume if it is written then it has to be true. Same reason people are buying into black hide.


I agree. Not only advertising...the media....research reports...books ...etc.

If you give me a gob of data, I can pretty well figure out how to be ethical AND make a specific portion of the data strong as death. You can call me "Moo Moo Skew". :mrgreen:

 

[Elder Statesman]

I believe that MARC had done a study on this and came up with that conclusion.

 

[3waycross]

I may be way off base here but wouldn't it make sense on some level that Herefords would cross better on Gelbvieh than on Angus since the Gelbvieh is a continental breed and the heterosis would be stronger than crossing them to another Brisish breed. From that perspective it does kinda make sense to me.

It also makes sense to me at least that Hereford should cross on Gelbvieh at least as well as Angus crossed to Gelbvieh. I for sure have seen how well the Gelbvieh cross on Shorthorn for the last 3 years and it is a great cross.

 

[Gelbvieh 5]

I recently read a hereford ad that claimed the hereford breed provided more hybrid vigor on Bos Taurus cattle than any other breed in a crossbreeding system. I just don't see how this can be. How can a Bos Taurus animal provide the most hybrid vigor on other Bos Taurus cattle. I understand that the Hereford maybe one of the more "untainted" breeds, but the degree of relation would still have to be greater than that of a Bos Indicus derived animal in my opinion.

There is no way this would be possible. Them herf folks are blowin smoke up ya butt.

Come on Bubba tell the truth: Substitute the word Saler for the word Hereford and you would be preachin it like the word of God. Not pickin a fight but you are hardly an unbiased observer.

 

[hillsdown]

I haven't seen it recently, but I think that the point is supposed to be that there is more hybrid vigor than any other Bos Taurus breed offers. I know that a couple of years ago, I saw a study that showed that the Hereford complemented Gelbveih more than any other breed across the board.

Can you remember where you read that? I would like to see how they arrived at that conclusion. I have been thinking about crossing some of my Gelbvieh cows and that sounds interesting.

3way I have some herefs in my commercial herd and their calves are the best looking out of the group ,Gelbvieh sired, I always get at least 5-10 cents a pound more for the steers than the char or simmi crosses. I am keeping all the heifers (herefs x gelbvieh) this year, by far the best calf crop I have had since going into beef.

 

[alexfarms]

I recently read a hereford ad that claimed the hereford breed provided more hybrid vigor on Bos Taurus cattle than any other breed in a crossbreeding system. I just don't see how this can be. How can a Bos Taurus animal provide the most hybrid vigor on other Bos Taurus cattle. I understand that the Hereford maybe one of the more "untainted" breeds, but the degree of relation would still have to be greater than that of a Bos Indicus derived animal in my opinion.

Advertising has gone the way of claiming anything they want knowing it would take millions on someones part to prove they are wrong. They may have even done a study of randomly selected groups to get the results. Of course they had do do the study 50 times before they got the results they wanted. People assume if it is written then it has to be true. Same reason people are buying into black hide.

It's just common sense that Herefords will provide more hybrid vigor in a Bos Taurus crossbreeding system on the nations cowherd since Angus has been used so heavily in the nations commercial cow herds and most of the nations purebred breeds besides Herefords. MARC data has indicated Hereford/Angus cross cows are the most efficient and more efficient than straight bred cows in a commercial operation. Why we (AHA) haven't trumpeted this information more loudly is a subject of much debate within the Hereford breed....the scuttle butt is "nobody at the AHA wants to tick off the Angus breeders". So, go ahead and cry foul....they will probably pull the ads. Most of them probably have job applications on file with the AAA anyhow.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Now you guys no that ain't right, and won't never work because them herfords ain't black.. :lol:

 

[Santas and Duhram Reds]

It's just common sense that Herefords will provide more hybrid vigor in a Bos Taurus crossbreeding system on the nations cowherd since Angus has been used so heavily in the nations commercial cow herds and most of the nations purebred breeds besides Herefords. MARC data has indicated Hereford/Angus cross cows are the most efficient and more efficient than straight bred cows in a commercial operation. Why we (AHA) haven't trumpeted this information more loudly is a subject of much debate within the Hereford breed....the scuttle butt is "nobody at the AHA wants to tick off the Angus breeders". So, go ahead and cry foul....they will probably pull the ads. Most of them probably have job applications on file with the AAA anyhow.

Did you even read my post? I mentioned that many breeds were tainted but Bos Indicus cattle are still going to provide the most heterosis on Bos Taurus cattle. Also, I would think that since most cattle are Angus influenced, an individual animal of continental decent and no angus influence would provide more heterosis than a hereford.

 

[alexfarms]

I am sorry. I thought the ads were referring exclusively to Bos Taurus crossbreeding programs. I would have to see the actual ad that you are referring to to see how it is worded. No Bos Taurus breed should provide more hybrid vigor to the average commercial cow herd than Hereford, simply because Angus has been so heavily used in most commercial herds across the country. Angus has also been introduced into many of the continental purebreeds as well. I am gonna try to post a link to a summary of MARC research projects. I haven't read it all, clearly it says that Bos Taurus/Bos Indicus provides more hybrid vigor than any Bos Taurus/Bos Taurus crosses, so if the ad you are referring to says that Herefords will provide more hybrid vigor than Bos Taurus/Bos Indicus it is an error. Do you have a copy of the ad?
http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:yY ... cd=7&gl=us