Handling Facilities

[Scroote]

I would like to hear some opinions on what yall think is better. A crowding tub style or a "Bud Box"?

Seen some interesting youtubes on the Bud Box and want to know if anyone uses this style.

What about running very docile animals through any of this stuff?

Your bestest friend,

Scrootareeno

 

[backhoeboogie]

Neither would work for me.

I bring the whole herd down the alley and into the pens. There are calves anywhere from a day old on up. You have to have cut gates and medina gates to isolate and seperate. It is a whole lot easier now that the herd is cut in half.

The "bud box" works pretty much like the ring at most sale barns. Even the protection gated alley - looks identical to the one used at the Dublin, TX sale barn.

I'd rather run a medina gate thru the chute. I can pull the bulls out of the herd, get them worked, and get them out of the pens. The rest can go down through the sweeps and into the alleys.

Hence, it wouldn't work for me and my operation. By the time I have everything sorted, I don't have a need for it.

 

[Dave]

The sweep tub works real well for me. I can work a bunch of cows by myself in a relatively short time. It is safe for me and safe for the cows.

 

[xxbrand]

The sweep tub works good for me too. I have some docile cows and I work them by myself. They are easy to get in and out with this system.

 

[SRBeef]

The sweep tub works real well for me. I can work a bunch of cows by myself in a relatively short time. It is safe for me and safe for the cows.

+1

A sheeted sweep tub and corral that you can gradually sort them into smaller groups before the tub works well, even working alone. I have no experience with a Bud box. It does help to have fairly docile cattle that are used to coming into the corral and thru the system and see the tub/alley/chute as a way out.

I loaded the steer shown in another thread by myself this morning. I had the trailer parked at the loading ramp for a few days so they got used to it being there. Then just called him this morning and he followed me and a bucket of sweet feed into the corral for a treat while I closed the gates. When done he went into the tub and alley by himself without using the sweep since he remembered that is a way out. Except I had swung and latched a swinging gate so the exit was up the ramp and into the trailer rather than back to the field as he was used to. He went right thru the chute and on the trailer after a brief stop on the alley scale. much to my relief. I was not looking forward to a rodeo in the ice and mud this am.

Can one person run a Bud box system?

Good luck.

Jim

 

[KNERSIE]

what is a bud box?

 

[backhoeboogie]

what is a bud box?

Bud Williams out of Bowie, TX coined that name. It is a corral similar to what you see at most all sale barns. There is an escape panel for working personnel with rogue bovines. It is now being marketed as a "Bud Box" for about $6K. You can order all kinds of other options.

There are folks out there who don't know how to weld, have too many nickels in their pockets, and some have never worked cattle in their lives. Videos of this bud box sell it to such people.

You can't blame marketing. Shucks, this might save some rookie's life.

New names for things. You've seen 'em Knersie. Probably seen much better.

 

[Scroote]

what is a bud box?

Here ya go mate, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aniUeugrm8Y

I don't use one, but lets not go all conventional becaese one does not own one or have used one. It seems very simple to build without buying someones plans. It is based on cattle's natural desire to return to where they came from. Just watch the video.

I asked because a lot of wranglers have sworn their tubs off and says this is the cat's a$$. Don't know myself jsut throwin it out there.

 

[backhoeboogie]

I don't know about the "natural desire" thing. Mine go down the alley every time they change pastures. They are looking to move to some place different and not return to where they came from.

Box in a cow or a group of cows, they are looking for daylight. A hole. Give them an opening and their gonna take it. If they are high strung and you don't give it to them fast enough, they may try to go over the top. In my opinion this far outweighs any desire to get back to where they came from.

 

[Scroote]

I don't know about the "natural desire" thing. Mine go down the alley every time they change pastures. They are looking to move to some place different and not return to where they came from.

Box in a cow or a group of cows, they are looking for daylight. A hole. Give them an opening and their gonna take it. If they are high strung and you don't give it to them fast enough, they may try to go over the top. In my opinion this far outweighs any desire to get back to where they came from.

I believe that Bud Williams teaches stockmanship and this goes along with that. Playing with devil cows and newcomers might make this a bit more difficult I agree. I won't build one until I get Doc's approval. Need that university stamp first.

 

[IluvABbeef]

I'd love to see how this system would work for animals that have literally no flight zone.

And IMO, unless I'm reading it wrong, boogie, $6K for just a few panels and gates to make a rectangular crowd pen into a race is a bit of a rip off.

 

[backhoeboogie]

I'd love to see how this system would work for animals that have literally no flight zone.

And IMO, unless I'm reading it wrong, boogie, $6K for just a few panels and gates to make a rectangular crowd pen into a race is a bit of a rip off.

Watch the video.

I feel you are right about flight zones.

My cows will follow me anywhere. Try to "herd" them, and you have problems. Some have mild flight zones but most don't. Some that used to be timid now know the routines of changing pastures and such. New cows can be timid but they fall in with the herd when they are moved.

If you are in Boston or in New York, the engineers there are going nuts about these "healthy" corn muffins Dunkin Donuts now offers. Its cornbread. Literally. It aint nothing but cornbread. Engineers there never ate cornbread before I guess. Market it a little different and you have something. Selling like crazy. This new system is not much different, in my opinion. You have to watch the video for yourself and form an opinion.

If you have not worked cows in all different kinds of systems through the years, you have a bunch of nickels to invest, this could be something to get you started. If I were starting out, I'd buy a welder and start learning how to burn rods. That's going to save you a fortune over your lifetime. You can fix or modify anything to your liking or needs.

 

[backhoeboogie]

And - if you really don't have a clue - this facility could save your life or save serious injury.

Think of all the people who have called you with a problem. You get there and they don't even have a facility. Then look at this thing. $6K aint all that bad if you have nothing.

 

[IluvABbeef]

I watched it, and didn't get the "shock and awe" factor from it, really. It's not much different than what we had done to herd cattle from the main front corral into the holding/working alley. Open up a gate, use the flight-zone, push-them-to-find-a-hole method and in they go. I can see how it's idiot-proof because you don't get the chance of a gate getting slammed back in your face if an animal kicks it back at you. But isn't that what the ratchet system on those crowding tubs is for in the first place, as a bit of a safety feature to prevent a gate getting swung back at you at 90 miles an hour?

I mean it's a plenty good system if you've got animals that do have a flight zone but aren't crazy enough to want to take you out (I'm not seeing how that system is safer than one with a crowd tub), but it's not going to work if there's animals that'll just stand there and do nothing no matter how crazy a windmill you try to make with your arms! A crowd tub, IMO is best for something like this. Or a medina system, but backhoe, I think you'll have to PM me a diagram of your system because I'm not good with picturing how your system goes with just words.

So really it's nothing special. Just a rectangle with an exit point at one of the corners to shoo cattle into.

 

[backhoeboogie]

I think you'll have to PM me a diagram of your system because I'm not good with picturing how your system goes with just words.

Two gates in an alley 44 inches apart on the hinge side. A 44 inch wide gate on that hinged end opening into a chute.

Use a cut gate on one end and push the bull apart and back down the alley. Close one medina gate behind him and then bring him back up to queeze him in. If his head is looking the wrong way, give him enough daylight to spin around and then sandwich him in. Release the chute gate entrance on the end and he's out of the pens and into the working chute or squeeze. If all I am doing is something like pour on, he's completely finished right there in the medina and is released all the way through the chute.

Make sense now?

 

[IluvABbeef]

Kinda, but I'd still like to see a diagram. If you don't mind, that is.

 

[backhoeboogie]

I'll try to get one.

If you can go to http://grangercattleco.com/medinahinge.html and look at TX Bobcat's medina hinge, imagine a one way gate on the end letting them out of the medina once they are trapped.

My medina gates are slightly longer than his. End is slightly wider but can be complete closed off on the opposite swinging end. Open that little gate between the medina hinges and down the chute they go. Works on docile cattle and it works on crazy witches too.

Edit: Since you saw the video, imagine an additional gate 4 foot the other side of the outlet chute gate. He's working 3 and 4 head. They're larger feeder calves.

 

[TexasBred]

Just don't forget that it's still a gate, one of the most dangerous things on a farm and you have to manually close it. A nut can always hit it, knock you and the gate open, and leave you on your back.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I guess I am the odd man out here, my working pen is a combination of both.
I can work them box or sweep.

 

[IluvABbeef]

Just don't forget that it's still a gate, one of the most dangerous things on a farm and you have to manually close it. A nut can always hit it, knock you and the gate open, and leave you on your back.

#1 reason why I loathe chains on gates. Too much time messing around with them!