fat content of milk replacer

[Hippie Rancher]

OK it's been a few years since I had a dogie on the bottle and I decided to read milkmaid's excellent post to see if I needed to upgrade my knowledge.

She recommended a 20% protein, 20% fat formula. Mine is only 10% fat and I wonder what ya'll think about that. Should I try to supplement that or do you suppose that is ok for the rangy old beef critters I got?

I had to buy what they had at the feed store so I'm pretty much stuck with that, but I could add some salad oil or something, I suppose... :?:

 

[dun]

This time of year 10% is just barely acceptable. In the winter is when the 20% is the most crucial.
Is it all milk and milk by products or soy included.

 

[piedmontese]

man i aint never even seen 10% fat.i have had quite a few bottle calves n the past and it pays to get the good stuff.

 

[Hippie Rancher]

I had to buy what they had at the feed store so I'm pretty much stuck with that

I am 60 miles from the big city and not sure where I would even go if I could get there easily right now. This is pretty much what I am stuck with. Not sure what I have used in the past, it has been years since we had a bottle baby, but I know it was whatever they had at the feed store then too.

Nutrena (cargill) Snowflakes Milk II-Utiliz medicated (has a coccidiostat in it - lasalocide)

crude protein not less than 22%
crude fat not less than 10%
crude fiber not more than 1%
calcium not less than .75%
not more than 1.25%
blah blah blah

Dried whey, dried whey protein concentrate, dried whey product, dried skimmed milk, dried milk protein, soy flour, animal fat (preserved with ethoxyquin), lecithin, dicalcium phosphate, calcium carbonate...blah blah blah

note: can't find it on their website at all! :???:

 

[CottageFarm]

I've found several older references to that product. You might want to call the manuf & ask them how long since they produced it & how long is it's shelf life, especially with the medicated variety.
Which big city are you 60 miles from?

 

[larryshoat]

Low Fat, no doubt intended to be fed at a high rate. Slowly work the calf up to at least 3 quarts twice a day, 4 quarts wouldn't hurt if he will take it.

Larry

 

[Hippie Rancher]

I may call manufacturer and see what they say.

Larry, he's already at a quart and a half morning and evening and a quart at noon. Plus whatever he is stealing from the crippled cow he's with - and I think he may be getting something because when I'm late in the morning he acts full before completely draining the bottle.

As soon as he can do 2 quarts at one feeding he's going to twice a day. I had hoped to already be there by now (he will be two weeks old tomorrow morning), but his weird little joint thing set him back a few days.

He seems to be doing OK now, but I wondered about the fat content. It sure is NOT cold here - 90 today and in the mid to upper 60's at night.

 

[dun]

If you will be ever feeding another bottle calf, find some good milk replacer somewhere. You can store it in the freezer for along time and use it as needed. If there are any dairys around they may be willing to sell you a bag or you oculdfind out where they get theirs. For best results, 20:20 and NO soy.

 

[John SD]

With milk replacer, you definitely get what you pay for. The higher the protein and fat content, the better the product. Lamb milk replacer costs twice as much as the best calf milk replacer, and for a reason. IMO, Hubbard is one of the best and most consistent brands of milk replacer. LOL is good too. Some of the stuff from farm stores, not so much.

You can pretty much judge good milk replacer from less desirable products with your nose. If it smells good like something you might want to mix some for yourself, that is a good sign. :lol2: If it stinks when you open the bag, even the cats probably won't be thrilled over it.

I recently sold a twin calf that the cow rejected. I wasn't going to get in the bum calf business and have another chore to do.

 

[CottageFarm]

So it sounds as though Hippie doesn't have anything else available right now. Is there something he can add to the milk replacer he does have to increase the fat content?
Heavy cream? Buttermilk? egg yolk? Butter? Butter emulsified in egg yolk? It would seem to me that vegetable based fats wouldn't be as digestable, but is that an option, say olive oil?

 

[TexasBred]

I may call manufacturer and see what they say.

Larry, he's already at a quart and a half morning and evening and a quart at noon. Plus whatever he is stealing from the crippled cow he's with - and I think he may be getting something because when I'm late in the morning he acts full before completely draining the bottle.

As soon as he can do 2 quarts at one feeding he's going to twice a day. I had hoped to already be there by now (he will be two weeks old tomorrow morning), but his weird little joint thing set him back a few days.

He seems to be doing OK now, but I wondered about the fat content. It sure is NOT cold here - 90 today and in the mid to upper 60's at night.

Read the label. It should have feeding directions. Exceed that and you'll be treating for scours. The lack of fat will simply give you less energy per feeding adn slower growth but he'll probably survive.

Dun I know you prefer all milk milk replacers and folks that don't raise many calves probably should also look for it, but I've had good luck with some with soyflour as a protein source. No scouring whatsoever. Last bag I bought was a few months ago. A 22/20 manufactured by Land O' Lakes for NutraBlend, medicated with Bovatec...Worked great....didn't have any of the "cake mix" smell like....was really almost odorless but did a great job on the calf.

 

[dun]

I may call manufacturer and see what they say.

Larry, he's already at a quart and a half morning and evening and a quart at noon. Plus whatever he is stealing from the crippled cow he's with - and I think he may be getting something because when I'm late in the morning he acts full before completely draining the bottle.

As soon as he can do 2 quarts at one feeding he's going to twice a day. I had hoped to already be there by now (he will be two weeks old tomorrow morning), but his weird little joint thing set him back a few days.

He seems to be doing OK now, but I wondered about the fat content. It sure is NOT cold here - 90 today and in the mid to upper 60's at night.

Read the label. It should have feeding directions. Exceed that and you'll be treating for scours. The lack of fat will simply give you less energy per feeding adn slower growth but he'll probably survive.

Dun I know you prefer all milk milk replacers and folks that don't raise many calves probably should also look for it, but I've had good luck with some with soyflour as a protein source. No scouring whatsoever. Last bag I bought was a few months ago. A 22/20 manufactured by Land O' Lakes for NutraBlend, medicated with Bovatec...Worked great....didn't have any of the "cake mix" smell like....was really almost odorless but did a great job on the calf.

It;s not because of scours, it's because of the lower useable nutrition. Their guts just areen;t configured to utilize soy.

 

[djinwa]

I've been re-figuring things, also, after getting a couple bottle calves a few weeks ago. Started with what one feed store had, but it included soy flour. They scoured, and I switched to an all milk mix, and doing better. Of course, scours could be other things like change in diet, or me mixing it wrong, or whatever.

As TB suggested, I finally quit listening to advice and followed the directions, as in mixing it at 110-120 degrees.

Yes, Dun, I've read that calves don't have the enzyme to digest soy until age 3 weeks.

A couple good references:
http://pods.dasnr.okstate.edu/docushare ... 35_web.pdf
http://www.savacaf.com/html/PDF/articles/HTML/1-04.htm

Soy flour is the least digestible protein ingredient that is commonly used, and should not be fed to calves less than 3 weeks old. If you decide to start with a higher quality protein source, and then switch to a more economical formula when the calf is older, it will be very important to transition to the new milk replacer over several days time, gradually mixing in increasing amounts of the new with the old. This gradual change allows the calf time to adjust to the new formulation and develop the digestive enzymes needed to utilize the new proteins.

The amount of protein, fat, and fiber in the formula must be guaranteed on the tag or label and should be carefully considered. The most common nutrient profile for milk replacers is 20% protein and 20% fat, but the range in available products is wide (18% to 28% protein, and 10% to 24% fat). The standard “20/20” is still a good choice for most feeders, and the best place to start for comparing products. The benefits of higher nutrient levels must be balanced against the additional cost. Higher protein will generally support faster, leaner growth if your management is good. Higher fat might be considered if you live in a cold climate – the extra energy will be beneficial to the calf. Formulas containing less than 15% fat are not recommended for calves, because it may not supply enough energy to support health and growth.

During cold weather, the calf’s energy requirements increase because they use more calories to keep warm. Young calves (less than 3 weeks old) are most vulnerable to cold stress, mostly because they have very little body fat to burn for energy. In fact, a young calf starts to feel cold at 50°F, and can actually starve to death in really cold weather if not provided with extra energy in the diet. A good rule of thumb is to add a third feeding of milk replacer during the day for calves less than 3 weeks old if the daytime temperature is below freezing (32°F), and the calf is in cold housing (outdoor hutch or in an unheated barn). Start with a half bottle on the first day or two, and then increase gradually to a full bottle if needed. This will increase energy and nutrient intake to help keep the calf healthy and growing. The extra feeding will also have a “warm soup” effect, making the calf more comfortable with a warm belly full of milk.

 

[djinwa]

Here’s some more info relating to the original question about fat. Sounds like maybe in hot areas, more fat isn’t necessarily desired. If want to add, needs to be more saturated fat, which isn’t easy to do.

http://www.merricks.com/tech_milkreplacerguide.htm

Fats and oils provide a concentrated energy source for animal feeds. Fat levels in milk replacers typically range from 10 to 24 percent with 15 to 20 percent being the most common. Higher fat milk replacers are often selected for cold climates while low fat formulas are more often used in hot climates and in formulations designed for intensive milk replacer feeding programs.

Lard and choice white grease are of swine origin and are the animal fats used in Merrick's milk replacers. Excellent performing milk replacers can be made using vegetable oils exclusively such as soy, palm and coconut oil. However, they are substantially more expensive to use than animal fats.

http://www.cvmbs.colostate.edu/ilm/proi ... rJan98.pdf

For cold weather:

Add a commercial fat supplement to spike energy levels of your milk or milk replacer.
There are dried supplements made to mix specifically with liquids. Tallow or liquid
vegetable oil do not mix well with liquids. The fat should add to and not replace the
starter.

 

[dun]

Here’s some more info relating to the original question about fat. Sounds like maybe in hot areas, more fat isn’t necessarily desired. .

That was why I said that this time of year the 10% would probably be ok but in the winter 20% would be the minimum

 

[TexasBred]

Soy has never been nor will ever be as digestible as milk products however calves to well on milk replacers containing "some" soy products. No way to know exactly "how much" of it is in the formulation but in the product I was using it was well down the list of ingredients (which use to mean something but not necessarily anymore) Newer processing methods have made soy products more valuable over time tho calves less than 3 weeks continue to use less of the nutrients than those of an all milk, milk replacer. Soy protein isolate,animal plasma, egg protein as also used. Seems the newest additon to milk replacer ingredients is modified wheat protein which is showing some promise. Talked with a friend that works for Dairy manufacturers a milk replacer company and they've been using some of the modified wheat protein for a couple of years now. Good management will usually make either work for you.