Developing Young Bull

[TMR]

We are a small cow/calf producer with registered Hereford cows breeding back to registered Angus bulls. I want to expand our herd of Herefords and had an opportunity to buy a herd sire bull calf from the seedstock producer where our brood cows originated from. Since we always purchase 2 year old bulls, I am not sure how to feed this 750 - 8 month old bull calf to maturity. He will be fed high quality square baled hay ( orchard grass - timothy - clover mix ). Should we supplement with 3-5 pounds of cracked corn per day and maybe a molasses tub as well? Your help is much appreciated.

 

[Running Arrow Bill]

How old is the bull calf you bought?

Don't want to get the bull FAT...just good body condition. Keep him with adequate supply of minimum 12-14% protein hay and quality minerals. Don't feed any cottonseed or cottonseed hull products since I think these will affect his fertility.

He should be ready to breed at 14-16 months old with limited number of females. My sources tell me that quality semen is produced about 2 months in advance. His first service/ejaculation will probably be a "clean-out" of his reproductive tracts.

To be on safe side, I'd have him semen tested (will clean him out too) before putting with females so you'll know what quality of semen he has...at least on the first jump.

Also, make sure he is current on all vaccinations and de-worming before putting with any females. If you don't have a vaccination record from seller, quaranteen him when you get him and give him a vaccination series. Check with your Vet for needed items in your area.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

TMR-

The adviced from Running Arrow Bill is as concise and correct as you could want! Good Advice!

Log onto "Dogpile" and Type in the 'box' - Yearling Beef Bull Management. The results will keep you busy for three or four weeks!

DOC HARRIS

 

[Frankie]

Here's a link to an OK State University article on "Nutritional Considerations of Weaned or Purchased Bulls"

http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/exten/cc-co ... lsale.html

It's not a cheap thing to get a young bull grown out to be able to use him by the time he's a yearling....if that's what you want to do.

 

[KMacGinley]

In this scenario, what you are talking about feeding, when raising him for you guys sounds about right, if you can keep the 12-14% protein level in place. You don't want him too fat. Around here, where I sell bulls, people want them hog fat, mostly due to the university eating contests, (bull tests). I have had to educate a few customers on why that might just be a bad thing to turn out a pig fat yearling bull. Most of them almost starve to death on pasture trying to breed cows. There also is some data that suggests lower fertility on bulls fed a hot ration. good luck.

 

[MikeC]

In this scenario, what you are talking about feeding, when raising him for you guys sounds about right, if you can keep the 12-14% protein level in place. You don't want him too fat. Around here, where I sell bulls, people want them hog fat, mostly due to the university eating contests, (bull tests). I have had to educate a few customers on why that might just be a bad thing to turn out a pig fat yearling bull. Most of them almost starve to death on pasture trying to breed cows. There also is some data that suggests lower fertility on bulls fed a hot ration. good luck.

I have just the opposite view. Most of the guys here want fat bulls because it will give the bulls some reserve after turnout and they can be assured that the bulls had enough food to develop them to their genetic potential.

When properly developing a bull, the muscle goes on first and the fat goes on last.

ALL yearling bulls (and two year olds too) will lose weight when turned in with cows the first time, just depends on the length of time, how many cows, as to how much they lose.

They had rather chase cows and breed them numerous times than eat.

Bulls never forget how to graze even when they are grainfed. It's a normal instinct that cannot be bred out of them.

 

[KMacGinley]

Really?? All do? I turned out an Ohlde yearling June 10th weighing 1250 lbs and weighed him September 1st at 1435 lbs. On pasture, breeding 19 head, he was raised on forage, never had corn in his life. I stand by what I said before.

 

[MikeC]

Really?? All do? I turned out an Ohlde yearling June 10th weighing 1250 lbs and weighed him September 1st at 1435 lbs. On pasture, breeding 19 head, he was raised on forage, never had corn in his life. I stand by what I said before.

Too many variables. Type of pasture. Libido of bull. Health of cows. Sufficient rain. etc. and etc .

In no way can you attribute that bulls performance to being forage fed and not grain fed. That's a myth.

If I turned out a bull that only had to breed 19 in that long period of time, he would be mad at me! :lol:

 

[Chris H]

......He should be ready to breed at 14-16 months old with limited number of females. My sources tell me that quality semen is produced about 2 months in advance. His first service/ejaculation will probably be a "clean-out" of his reproductive tracts.

To be on safe side, I'd have him semen tested (will clean him out too) before putting with females so you'll know what quality of semen he has...at least on the first jump.
....

I'm not picking on just you, R A B, but comments about 'cleaning out his pipes' always strike me as odd. Am I the only one that has virgin(and older) bulls that 'clean out the pipes' on his own? Maybe it's all the Hereford World magazines we leave laying around? :lol: Had one at a fair do that in front of a family, the parents asked what he was doing umm, explain that in front of the kids!
We had a 12 month old bull with excellent results on his BSE this spring, but it's not unusual for a 12-14 month old bull to fail the first test and mature by the time he's 15 months old.

 

[KNERSIE]

Am I the only one that has virgin(and older) bulls that 'clean out the pipes' on his own? Maybe it's all the Hereford World magazines we leave laying around?

No you are not alone, mine can also help themselves, they must use imagination because there is no cattle magazines with pictures of heifers lying around in my pasture ;-)

 

[KNERSIE]

Really?? All do? I turned out an Ohlde yearling June 10th weighing 1250 lbs and weighed him September 1st at 1435 lbs. On pasture, breeding 19 head, he was raised on forage, never had corn in his life. I stand by what I said before.

Too many variables. Type of pasture. Libido of bull. Health of cows. Sufficient rain. etc. and etc .

In no way can you attribute that bulls performance to being forage fed and not grain fed. That's a myth.

If I turned out a bull that only had to breed 19 in that long period of time, he would be mad at me! :lol:

Mike,

I agree they won't forget how to graze and I am not qualified to discuss rumen developement without risking giving fallacies as facts, but there is merit in applying selection pressure for the ability to convert lower quality forage efficiently.

If all bulls are developed under optimum conditions where would selection pressure come form in terms of constitution, easy doing ability, rustling ability, etc?

 

[DOC HARRIS]

"Had one at a fair do that in front of a family, the parents asked what he was doing umm, explain that in front of the kids!"

I think if I were there at the time a "parent" asked a question as unique as that, I would have taken them aside and explained the "Facts of Life" to them, and then said "Do you want to instruct your children, or do you want ME to explain it to them??"

"Say What??"

DOC HARRIS

 

[MikeC]

If all bulls are developed under optimum conditions where would selection pressure come form in terms of constitution, easy doing ability, rustling ability, etc?

From the heifers.

I don't advocate developing bulls under TOTALLY optimum conditions, but when forage is short, (like here now in the past 3 years) a little grain supplementation in no way decreases his ability to cover cows efficiently.

My opinion might be to develop bulls like their calves will be "developed" in the feedlot, and develop heifers like their replacement daughters will be in the pasture. If they both work, it's the best of two worlds.

It's the best of both worlds that we all must include ourselves in.

I've seen grassfed bulls fall apart just as I've seen grainfed bulls fall apart. Like I said........it's a myth.........

 

[KMacGinley]

I believe that the recommended number of cows for a yearling bull to breed would be 15 according to most universities. A myth is something that never happens... This happened.