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<blockquote data-quote="J and L" data-source="post: 211753" data-attributes="member: 3494"><p>When we first bought our herd in 1978 the RHA was 11,900#, which was below the state average for the time. We soon realized that this was in great part because Jerry's dad did not keep track of which heifers were from which cows. In the fall he would have heifer buyers in and let them pick 10 heifers and put the rest in the herd. Of course they always took the best looking ones-- and good looks often come from genetic improvement-- so he was selling the production improvement as well. We started keep records and by the time the first identified heifers were springing realized that the herd was almost split 50-50 with half averaging about 12,000-# of milk and the other half 16,000+# of milk. We started selecting keepers based almost entirely on records and raised our RHA by over 1500#/year each next three years with no other changes in management-- and not all the keepers were pretty and some of the sold were gorgeous. The $100 less from the dealer for not pretty was easily made up for by getting more milk out of the ones we kept.</p><p></p><p> We figured production would keep us in business-- and give us time to breed ugly out. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite8" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":D" /> </p><p></p><p>As for looking at what a buyer might want, I have a problem answering here because we have never bought heifers from herds without records. Typically if I decide the cattle are worth buying I cut a deal to buy everything-- no sorting. This is, in large part, because my experiences have shown that the outside is not nearly as important as the inside:ie genetics-- 20+ years of AI-- and biosecurity. There is an old supposedly Indian saying that goes like this "If you want beautiful children, marry not the only fair maiden of the tribe." In otherwords, even a terrible herd will occassionally produce an exceptional looking or production heifer, so I've always looked for consistency within the herd for both milk and looks in making decisions.</p><p></p><p>Jockeys will always take pretty over records for small number sales because farmers like to see pretty in a group of heifers they buy and records may or may not be accurate. If they are buying only two or three they will likely be grouping them with others. For an experienced dairy buyer, "pretty" usually means the dairy character most of us associate with years of AI-- fairly tall, deep ribbed, legs more posty than not, solid center supports and proper teat placement. I would call these, particularly the feet and udder traits, the functional parts of a cow. BST can make a poor milker give milk but nothing can change legs that cannot take concrete, size that lacks feed capacity, an udder that is easily stepped on, or mastitis that comes from unit slippage caused by poor teat placement.</p><p></p><p>As a side, one year we had 9 heifers to sell and had 3 buyers look at them. Each buyer found "real problems" with one animal in the group-- and each buyer picked a different "problem" heifer LOL . We split the group and ended up with 2 less that totally pleased buyers but top prices for all <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite8" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":D" /> . Dairy sales would be a great way to avoid having a jockey try to convince you that your animals are somehow lacking so you will accept less. </p><p></p><p>Years ago we did sell some flighty heifers with "mean" dams simply because we figured that someone with a conventional parlor could milk them with less risk than us in a stall barn. Once that couple of lines were gone we haven't had a problem. I do believe that a parlor of any type makes it clear to the cows that when they enter the area they will be touched, etc. In the stall barn the rest area was the same as the milk area and easily startled heifers were more likely to react to someone entering "their" space.</p><p></p><p>Sorry I can't be of more help-</p><p>Linda</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="J and L, post: 211753, member: 3494"] When we first bought our herd in 1978 the RHA was 11,900#, which was below the state average for the time. We soon realized that this was in great part because Jerry's dad did not keep track of which heifers were from which cows. In the fall he would have heifer buyers in and let them pick 10 heifers and put the rest in the herd. Of course they always took the best looking ones-- and good looks often come from genetic improvement-- so he was selling the production improvement as well. We started keep records and by the time the first identified heifers were springing realized that the herd was almost split 50-50 with half averaging about 12,000-# of milk and the other half 16,000+# of milk. We started selecting keepers based almost entirely on records and raised our RHA by over 1500#/year each next three years with no other changes in management-- and not all the keepers were pretty and some of the sold were gorgeous. The $100 less from the dealer for not pretty was easily made up for by getting more milk out of the ones we kept. We figured production would keep us in business-- and give us time to breed ugly out. :D As for looking at what a buyer might want, I have a problem answering here because we have never bought heifers from herds without records. Typically if I decide the cattle are worth buying I cut a deal to buy everything-- no sorting. This is, in large part, because my experiences have shown that the outside is not nearly as important as the inside:ie genetics-- 20+ years of AI-- and biosecurity. There is an old supposedly Indian saying that goes like this "If you want beautiful children, marry not the only fair maiden of the tribe." In otherwords, even a terrible herd will occassionally produce an exceptional looking or production heifer, so I've always looked for consistency within the herd for both milk and looks in making decisions. Jockeys will always take pretty over records for small number sales because farmers like to see pretty in a group of heifers they buy and records may or may not be accurate. If they are buying only two or three they will likely be grouping them with others. For an experienced dairy buyer, "pretty" usually means the dairy character most of us associate with years of AI-- fairly tall, deep ribbed, legs more posty than not, solid center supports and proper teat placement. I would call these, particularly the feet and udder traits, the functional parts of a cow. BST can make a poor milker give milk but nothing can change legs that cannot take concrete, size that lacks feed capacity, an udder that is easily stepped on, or mastitis that comes from unit slippage caused by poor teat placement. As a side, one year we had 9 heifers to sell and had 3 buyers look at them. Each buyer found "real problems" with one animal in the group-- and each buyer picked a different "problem" heifer LOL . We split the group and ended up with 2 less that totally pleased buyers but top prices for all :D . Dairy sales would be a great way to avoid having a jockey try to convince you that your animals are somehow lacking so you will accept less. Years ago we did sell some flighty heifers with "mean" dams simply because we figured that someone with a conventional parlor could milk them with less risk than us in a stall barn. Once that couple of lines were gone we haven't had a problem. I do believe that a parlor of any type makes it clear to the cows that when they enter the area they will be touched, etc. In the stall barn the rest area was the same as the milk area and easily startled heifers were more likely to react to someone entering "their" space. Sorry I can't be of more help- Linda [/QUOTE]
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