Cave in

[Dave]

There is a big pasture over in the Baker Valley. My yearling steers are there. B's replacement heifers are there. And a bunch of yearlings belonging to another man are in that psture. In the middle of this place there is a pivot with alfalfa raised there. Of course the pivot is fenced to keep the cattle out. There is a separate stack yard where the hay is stored. Apparantly the cows broke into the stack yard and there is nobody living close by to notice that. They dined on the alfalfa hay to the point that they under mined to stack causing it to cave in on them. 1,400 pound big squares stacked 6 high is a lot of weight coming down in a big hurry. Killed 3 of B's heifers.
Another neighbor says if you think you are having a bad day just call B and ask how his day is going. You will realize things aren't that bad.

 

[Brute 23]

That stinks.

It's amazing what can happen some times. That's why when people say go buy cattle on debt... flip them... it will be easy and post some generic math I never really buy in. Things like this are part of the business and you always have to have a risk column with a number in it also.

Can they have other issues gorging on alphalfa like that?

 

[Dave]

That stinks.

Can they have other issues gorging on alphalfa like that?

Probably no issues from eating the alfalfa. Difficult to get too much out of a hard packed bale especially one with other bales sitting on top of it. Probably more like ate a few pounds and went back to the pasture. But there has got to be 300 + head of cattle in the pasture so a few pounds each adds up pretty quick.
Yep, if you are going to have livestock sooner or later you will have dead stock. It is best to figure a 5% death lose. Hopefully it wont be that high but there will be a year that it is.

 

[Brute 23]

A guy in wtx told us he stacked some alfalfa right behind his house. He went to get some bales for his sheep and the deer had eaten about 1/3 off the back of each bale. That hurts.

 

[Dsth]

that really sucks. Around here, the landowner is responsible for sh*t that happens like that. Do you by chance carry insurance to help B recoup some of his loss?

 

[Dave]

that really sucks. Around here, the landowner is responsible for sh*t that happens like that. Do you by chance carry insurance to help B recoup some of his loss?

It is B's deal. Him and the other guy lease the pasture land. I am thinking that the land owner leases the ground under the pivot to another party. I am just along for the ride. Being B's unhired hired man has a few benefits. Like running my yearlings for free on his pasture. The entire story of our relationship would take a lot of time to try an explain. But it works for the two of us.

 

[TCRanch]

Can they have other issues gorging on alphalfa like that?

Even baled alfalfa should be introduced slowly; we start with 1 bale of alfalfa, 2 bales of brome & a junk bale of prairie.

Years ago, a neighbors bull busted out & traveled 4 miles to our place. Not only had he grazed the alfalfa field (potential for bloat), he gorged on the bales AND ripped the plastic top off a 30% protein tub stored in an outside shed. He was easy to track, just by following the trail of spew he left behind. I ended up catching him in our corral - and kinda regretted it because of the mess. He didn't have any long-term residual effects because they hauled him straight to the sale barn when they picked him up.

 

[wbvs58]

Lucky that you didn't have a loss there Dave. Maybe heifers are greedier.

Ken

 

[Mark Reynolds]

There is a big pasture over in the Baker Valley. My yearling steers are there. B's replacement heifers are there. And a bunch of yearlings belonging to another man are in that psture. In the middle of this place there is a pivot with alfalfa raised there. Of course the pivot is fenced to keep the cattle out. There is a separate stack yard where the hay is stored. Apparantly the cows broke into the stack yard and there is nobody living close by to notice that. They dined on the alfalfa hay to the point that they under mined to stack causing it to cave in on them. 1,400 pound big squares stacked 6 high is a lot of weight coming down in a big hurry. Killed 3 of B's heifers.
Another neighbor says if you think you are having a bad day just call B and ask how his day is going. You will realize things aren't that bad.

OH NO! I heard a similar story several years ago. It wasn't stacked but was a single bale and intended to be eaten at the time. That didn't stop the calves from undermining the bale and it collapsed and killed the offender.

 

[Katpau]

We came close to a similar incident this week. We had a load of hay unloaded and stacked in the barn. We store small square bales in this barn because of access and ease of feeding in the feeders that are attached to three sides of the building. The barn is over 100 years old and has a steep roof that raises to about 20 feet high in the center, but it is quite low on the edges. The stack consisted of bundles of ten bales stacked 10 high, over 6 ton setting on two 7 foot by 8 foot bases, and over 12 feet high. The cows were across the creek and five gates away, plus another gate into the pole shed. We never expected the cows to break through the first gate, nor that they would then proceed through three pastures to find the hay barn, so every gate but the one to their pasture was open. We were wrong. We returned with a second load of hay to find 80 animals in and around the barn. Fortunately we had put down one row of ten bales on the ground next to the stack and had another small stack of older bales sitting there. The cows went after them first and only grazed a little on the bottom of the bigger stack. There was a horrible mess to clean up, but it could have been much worse. If they had been there overnight, I have no doubt we would have found crushed calves under the stack in the morning.

Now we have shut every gate between the cows and the barn. They must have been able to smell that hay from a half mile away. They know it is there now and they all start calling and gathering at the gate every time they hear an ATV. It is deafening.

 

[Named'em Tamed'em]

It is B's deal. Him and the other guy lease the pasture land. I am thinking that the land owner leases the ground under the pivot to another party. I am just along for the ride. Being B's unhired hired man has a few benefits. Like running my yearlings for free on his pasture. The entire story of our relationship would take a lot of time to try an explain. But it works for the two of us.

When neighbors are neighborly things are nice!!

 

[Mark Reynolds]

There is a big pasture over in the Baker Valley. My yearling steers are there. B's replacement heifers are there. And a bunch of yearlings belonging to another man are in that psture. In the middle of this place there is a pivot with alfalfa raised there. Of course the pivot is fenced to keep the cattle out. There is a separate stack yard where the hay is stored. Apparantly the cows broke into the stack yard and there is nobody living close by to notice that. They dined on the alfalfa hay to the point that they under mined to stack causing it to cave in on them. 1,400 pound big squares stacked 6 high is a lot of weight coming down in a big hurry. Killed 3 of B's heifers.
Another neighbor says if you think you are having a bad day just call B and ask how his day is going. You will realize things aren't that bad.

This whole thing is really kind of a freak accident. Things like this happen. I think there could be any number of players in this incident, but I don't want to nor am I implying any one person or persons is responsible or should make any kind of restitution. Things like this is what insurance is for. The question is, whose insurance? Potential players include B, they are his cows. The individual who grew and stacked the alfalfa (stacked wrong? shouldn't have been stored there?), landowner of where the heifers were (fence not maintained? whose responsibility) landowner of where the alfalfa was growing (again, fence not maintained?). Again, I'm not laying blame. It may behoove the players involved to discuss the situation among themselves in a gentlemanly manner not necessarily to determine who is at fault or who should provide restitution to who (what about the loss/damage to the alfalfa and fence [I know, minor in comparison to the loss of the heifers]) but to determine what, if any measures can be taken/done differently moving forward to prevent/decrease the chance of this happening again. Not that it would happen again.

Sorry for your loss B.

Baker Valley.....I've been there. I like all of Eastern Oregon. I know, a lot of area to like. Some people would say though that there isn't much there.

 

[kenny thomas]

Am i reading it wrong or does it say the cattle broke in to the stack. Nobody is responsible. Its a bad situation but nothing i would discuss who is going to pay for them . What if the hay owner wanted to discuss damage to his fence or loss of his hay. Be good neighbors.

 

[Mark Reynolds]

Am i reading it wrong or does it say the cattle broke in to the stack. Nobody is responsible. Its a bad situation but nothing i would discuss who is going to pay for them . What if the hay owner wanted to discuss damage to his fence or loss of his hay. Be good neighbors.

That was kinda my point as well. I was just suggesting assess the situation and figure out if anything can be done to prevent it from happening again.

 

[farmerjan]

I am not sure that @Dave even posted this for any reason other than this was just one of those "da#@ed" things that happen. If B has insurance on the cattle it is his deal. There would be no way the "owner of the alfalfa" or the landowner would be at fault here in VA. YOUR cattle... you make sure they do not get out where they shouldn't be... if they do, you are responsible. Even with our different counties having some with "fence in" laws, and other counties have "fence out" laws... the cattle BROKE INTO the yard where the stacked hay was...
It was simple a bad deal, tragic loss... and even if someone had seen it happen, they most likely would have been dead from the weight before someone could get the bales off them... unless they were seen soon enough to stop them from eating that much to undermine the bales in the first place.
SH!T happens and it sucks.... especially this year with the way prices are...

 

[farmerjan]

I am not sure that @Dave even posted this for any reason other than this was just one of those "da#@ed" things that happen. If B has insurance on the cattle it is his deal. There would be no way the "owner of the alfalfa" or the landowner would be at fault here in VA. YOUR cattle... you make sure they do not get out where they shouldn't be... if they do, you are responsible. Even with our different counties having some with "fence in" laws, and other counties have "fence out" laws... the cattle BROKE INTO the yard where the stacked hay was...
It was simple a bad deal, tragic loss... and even if someone had seen it happen, they most likely would have been dead from the weight before someone could get the bales off them... unless they were seen soon enough to stop them from eating that much to undermine the bales in the first place.
SH!T happens and it sucks.... especially this year with the way prices are...

 

[Dave]

I haven't been down to the part where the stack is since last spring. Even then there was no hay and I didn't really look at it. Would have been on
Thursday. B said he had to take a tractor over there Friday morning to restack the hay and haul off the dead heifers. He said two were still alive when he drug them out from under the hay but he wouldn't give you a nickle for either one. Which to me means he thought they weren't going to survive. He is as good of a cow doctor as a lot of vets so I am sure that he did anything he could. As for insurance I know he has fire insurance on the cows but I have no idea if his insurance will coveer this kind of deal. The elk did the same kind of deal to themselves at the stack yard here last winter.