El_Putzo
Well-known member
cypressfarms":2gfm7tn8 said:
My sentiments exactly. Selling quality rather than quantity will make more money (and friends) in the long run IMO.
Buying Bulls
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My sentiments exactly. Selling quality rather than quantity will make more money (and friends) in the long run IMO.
cypressfarms
Well-known member
Dun,
Maybe I hit bingo there, but It'll take me a year to shake off all of the doubters in 'ol cypress since I posted that string about Fred.
Maybe I hit bingo there, but It'll take me a year to shake off all of the doubters in 'ol cypress since I posted that string about Fred.
cypressfarms":em5fpprj said:
At least you came to the realization that he's better off as a steer. Too many people keep a bull that should be a steer, and that includes seedstock producers. Just because they can sell it as a bull doesn;t mean that they should!
dun
cypressfarms
Well-known member
dun":297526lk said:
O.k. so that's why your a "guru". You mentioned on another posts about babbling. There are a bunch of people on this post that I would love to listen to, babbling or not, to learn from their experiences. I would definitely buy the beer, or drink of choice, just to sit in.
I think we'll start calling him poor fred. Weird how you can have 70 cows and one calf gets all of your attention.
purecountry
Well-known member
I never buy a bull unless I've seen his mother, father and some siblings. When you go to someone's spread and see how they take care of their place and stock, it gives you alot better feel for what you're spending your money on. And I usually don't pay more than $2500 Cdn.
Wether private treaty or through a full blown sale, it is nice to find a breeder that will work for you, and I don't mean by standing behind their bull. I naturally expcect that, and you should also. I mean one that will pick up the phone and make calls on their own dime when you are selling calves. It might not matter a bit while prices are good, but it might matter quite a bit when prices are down. This to me is the most important thing they can do for me next to selling me a bull.
Set up what you are looking for in a breeder and their cattle, and when you find it, stick to it. It is probably just as important that the breeder knows you, as that you know them. You would be suprised how far someone would go for a loyal customer. Echoing what cypress said.
Duns talk of how many bulls a breeder keeps back is great advice, especially in private treaty sales when you aren't seeing their whole offering. Make a point to find that out. I would think it should be less than 50% at minimum.
One thing about a sale, or auction. At a sale you see all the bulls they are offering and you have other bidders establishing prices on them for that day, as opposed to someone telling you how much they are suppose to be worth, after some of the top bulls have already been sold. If you go private treaty, go early. Good Luck.
Set up what you are looking for in a breeder and their cattle, and when you find it, stick to it. It is probably just as important that the breeder knows you, as that you know them. You would be suprised how far someone would go for a loyal customer. Echoing what cypress said.
Duns talk of how many bulls a breeder keeps back is great advice, especially in private treaty sales when you aren't seeing their whole offering. Make a point to find that out. I would think it should be less than 50% at minimum.
One thing about a sale, or auction. At a sale you see all the bulls they are offering and you have other bidders establishing prices on them for that day, as opposed to someone telling you how much they are suppose to be worth, after some of the top bulls have already been sold. If you go private treaty, go early. Good Luck.
Cowboymom
Well-known member
We do not have a fixed number of bulls that we keep as bulls. When we wean our calves, we take each bull, individually, in an alley. Three of us look at him and either he goes in the keeper pen or the cull pen. We have very high standards, it doesn't make any difference who he is out of or by, he has to be phenotypically correct, period. We are ruthless, been told by many that we cull too deep but if we sell a bull, it is our reputation on the line. Funny you should mention that the number is too high because we cull heavier than any other herd in the state. Nothing goes off this ranch with testicles unless they are good bulls, period. Cull bulls that are not cut go to the slaughter house and are sold on the rail. That is the way it has been for over 65 years and will continue to be that way.
We do not sell yearlings, period. We start selling our fall calves on May 15th, first come, first served. This year we were completely sold out by July 1st. We have two guys who want to come on May 15th and buy 20 bulls, these are new customers. One is an old time Hereford breeder that has gone out of the bull business, high compliment.
We have worked for the last 15 years to get our bull numbers back up to 50 bulls. That meant ruthless culling and purchasing the best herd sire prospects we could find. No matter where we had to travel and came home empty handed more than once.
We are not a "bull factory" and resent the implication.
We do not sell yearlings, period. We start selling our fall calves on May 15th, first come, first served. This year we were completely sold out by July 1st. We have two guys who want to come on May 15th and buy 20 bulls, these are new customers. One is an old time Hereford breeder that has gone out of the bull business, high compliment.
We have worked for the last 15 years to get our bull numbers back up to 50 bulls. That meant ruthless culling and purchasing the best herd sire prospects we could find. No matter where we had to travel and came home empty handed more than once.
We are not a "bull factory" and resent the implication.
El_Putzo
Well-known member
No need to get in a tizzy. Your definition of heavy culling is obviously different than mine. To me, keeping 50 out of 85 is not heavy culling, unless you have some very outstanding stock. Which, for all I know may be the case. If it is, kudos to you and your operation, you are obviously doing something right.
Maybe I'm the only one who raised an eye when you threw those numbers out there, but to each his own.
Maybe I'm the only one who raised an eye when you threw those numbers out there, but to each his own.
Cowboymom
Well-known member
We picked up a bull today from a fellow breeder for one of our customers who didn't want to go himself. He had about fifty bulls, if I would have been sorting those bulls when they were calves, there would have been ten left, max. The bull we bought was no superstar but he was correct, had good bone, natural thickness and will do just fine on the few cows he went to.
I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder but I have looked at more crooked legged, unsound bulls on people's ranches to last a lifetime. One time we went to a rather well advertised ranch in Montana. They did not have one bull who stood sound on his feet and legs and there was very little bone. As we were driving out of the ranch, my husband told me that he had never understood why I was such a fanatic about feet and legs, now he understood.
I firmly believe that where people get in "trouble" is that they try and change their cattle for what is fashionable. We have basically been raising the same type of cattle forever. Middle framed, natural muscling, good feet and legs. We didn't go up to the giraffes and aren't going down to the shorties. What is fashionable always comes full circle but if you raise functional cattle for your environment, you don't have to worry about that. You also don't have to worry about going broke in the cattle business because if you produce a consistant, quality product, you will find that it is very easily marketable.
We have one market, we raise functional range bulls for commerical cattlemen. We raise the very best bulls we can and purchase the very best herd sire prospects we can. If we raised the next Denver Champion, he would end up in a commercial herd of one of our early buyers.
I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder but I have looked at more crooked legged, unsound bulls on people's ranches to last a lifetime. One time we went to a rather well advertised ranch in Montana. They did not have one bull who stood sound on his feet and legs and there was very little bone. As we were driving out of the ranch, my husband told me that he had never understood why I was such a fanatic about feet and legs, now he understood.
I firmly believe that where people get in "trouble" is that they try and change their cattle for what is fashionable. We have basically been raising the same type of cattle forever. Middle framed, natural muscling, good feet and legs. We didn't go up to the giraffes and aren't going down to the shorties. What is fashionable always comes full circle but if you raise functional cattle for your environment, you don't have to worry about that. You also don't have to worry about going broke in the cattle business because if you produce a consistant, quality product, you will find that it is very easily marketable.
We have one market, we raise functional range bulls for commerical cattlemen. We raise the very best bulls we can and purchase the very best herd sire prospects we can. If we raised the next Denver Champion, he would end up in a commercial herd of one of our early buyers.
Cowboymom
Well-known member
Our first calf heifers start calving the 1st part of October and our main cow herd starts calving the 1st part of November. We are on the coast and get an "Indian Summer" in the fall. We used to calve a month earlier but found out we miss out on calves being born while we are still having hot days and foggy, cold nights. Cut our sickness in baby calves to non-existant. We only get a couple of nights that it even freezes a year and the sun comes out and warms everything up. Also, the calves were calving on the dirt, we usually get a light rain or two and the dust is settled. We get enough of the coastal fog that we keep green grass until early to middle June. Every ranch is different and you have to find out what works best for your conditions.
