Bull vs Steer

[KANSAS]

I read in here everynow and then about how a producer from a country outside of the U.S. does not castrate the bulls. What is the purpose of this? and what effect does it have on the flavor and bottom line?

Thanks in advance.

 

[BC]

It will cause a lowering of the grade when hanging. The bottom line is that if you let your calves weigh more than 350 lbs when you sell them, there will be a price discount.

 

[3MR]

It will cause a lowering of the grade when hanging. The bottom line is that if you let your calves weigh more than 350 lbs when you sell them, there will be a price discount.

I think discount is the wrong word to use. You will get less money per pound, but have more pounds to sell. You have to pay attention to the market to see what the margins on those extra pounds will be.

600+ # calves are normal around here.

 

[dun]

The few feeders I've talked with tha buy bulls claim the first thing they do is cut or band them. This sets them back some for overall gain and profitability. The reason they dehorn andcastrate is for managability in the feed lot environment. Horns equal bruised carcass, nuts equal riding and fighting.

dun

 

[andybob]

Production of bull beef is popular in Italy, Germany and Eastern Europe. Advantages are;bulls grow 12% faster,convert feed 8% better,and produce a 10% heavier carcase than steers of the same type. They are commonly slaughtered at 18 months before the meat quality is affected by hormones. Countries where bull beef is commonly produced pay appropriate prices for the lean beef which is popular.
A number of on-farm trials were conducted in 1977-1980 in which bulls were raised to slaughter under different feeding regimes and sold through the standard system with top grading equal to the grades achieved by steers under the same feeding regime. The bulls were 'short scrotum' bulls to prevent the possibility of them breeding. This was done by pushing the testicles up against the body and putting the band below.
I have the article from the 'Cattle Today' magazine April 1980
which makes interesting reading.

 

[P.A.L]

In Finland (and i think in most of northern Europe) here we dont grow steers at all. I have never seen or tasted steer... could some body send me some ;-) . Most of beef we produce comes from dairy cattle and marbling in beef makes some people feel sick...fat. That is also why hereford and angus are losing favor here. But i really like the taste of our hereford heifers, is it similar to taste of hereford steers?

 

[3MR]

My limited experience is that dairy cattle have very good marbeling, they just have less of a ribeye area.

 

[la4angus]

My limited experience is that dairy cattle have very good marbeling, they just have less of a ribeye area.

With my limited experience with dairy beef, is that if fed a real good fattening ration they will have excellent marbling, some Jerseys will even out marble an Angus but they won't produce as much beef. If fed right you may have the best beef that you have ever ate. It could even be as good or better than Longhorn beef. If you need to fill up your freezer you just need to feed two instead of just one. Not only will the rib-eye will be smaller but most other cuts will also be smaller. Dairy beef animals will not feed as efficently as your major beef breeds but the females will milk better after after she has a calf. They will produce more milk and Jerseys and Guernseys will produce a better quality milk with more butter-fat content. By feeding out young Jersey cows you can produce your own milk, butter, cheese to eat when drinking wine if you have a Vineyard and Winery, plus cream for your coffee, Ice Cream and Egg Nog. To do this you will need to feed a Jersey bull for the second animal that you are feeding. Chrissy could even use the Cream in the afternoons when she is having Tea. Then get a Mule and a few chickens and there's no telling how far you can go in the farming business. I remember a few yerars ago when there was a Chicken Ranch in the Texas Hill Country. If I remember right it was quiet a profitable operation which was owned and operated by the city.
For this kind of segregated operation you will need to hire a farm manager with several herdsman to keep track of things. For this I would suggest you to contact Mr. Caustic Bruno
I would Personally be interested in the position of Chicken Ranch Manager

Best of luck to you.
If you would raise some corn you would be able to produce most of your own livestock feed. This would also give you an in for Moonshine Production. This could be very profitable if you can keep the revenoo'ers off your back.
A Big Best of LUCK to YOU

 

[MikeC]

My limited experience is that dairy cattle have very good marbeling, they just have less of a ribeye area.

With my limited experience with dairy beef, is that if fed a real good fattening ration they will have excellent marbling, some Jerseys will even out marble an Angus but they won't produce as much beef. If fed right you may have the best beef that you have ever ate. It could even be as good or better than Longhorn beef. If you need to fill up your freezer you just need to feed two instead of just one. Not only will the rib-eye will be smaller but most other cuts will also be smaller. Dairy beef animals will not feed as efficently as your major beef breeds but the females will milk better after after she has a calf. They will produce more milk and Jerseys and Guernseys will produce a better quality milk with more butter-fat content. By feeding out young Jersey cows you can produce your own milk, butter, cheese to eat when drinking wine if you have a Vineyard and Winery, plus cream for your coffee, Ice Cream and Egg Nog. To do this you will need to feed a Jersey bull for the second animal that you are feeding. Chrissy could even use the Cream in the afternoons when she is having Tea. Then get a Mule and a few chickens and there's no telling how far you can go in the farming business. I remember a few yerars ago when there was a Chicken Ranch in the Texas Hill Country. If I remember right it was quiet a profitable operation.
For this kind of segregated operation you will need to hire a farm manager with several herdsman to keep track of things. For this I would suggest you to contact Mr. Caustic Bruno
I would Personally be interested in the position of Chicken Ranch Manager

Best of luck to you.
If you would raise some corn you would be able to produce most of your own livestock feed. This would also give you an in for Moonshine Production. This could be very profitable if you can keep the revenoo'ers off your back.
A Big Best of LUCK to YOU

Dang Lloyd. You have all the bases covered here. :lol:

They can grow a little garden and never have to buy any food.

Except for the truffles.

 

[dun]

In the early 70's we ate a lot of older freemartin Holstein beef. Some of these girls approached 3 years old. Meat was tender, well marbled (probably about a middle choice), ribeyes were about average but rounds were the size of trasch can lids.
The had been fed grain every day of their life. When it was finally determined they weren;t going to calve they went on a high grain diet for 30 days.

dun

 

[Cowdirt]

My limited experience is that dairy cattle have very good marbeling, they just have less of a ribeye area.

With my limited experience with dairy beef, is that if fed a real good fattening ration they will have excellent marbling, some Jerseys will even out marble an Angus but they won't produce as much beef. If fed right you may have the best beef that you have ever ate. It could even be as good or better than Longhorn beef. If you need to fill up your freezer you just need to feed two instead of just one. Not only will the rib-eye will be smaller but most other cuts will also be smaller. Dairy beef animals will not feed as efficently as your major beef breeds but the females will milk better after after she has a calf. They will produce more milk and Jerseys and Guernseys will produce a better quality milk with more butter-fat content. By feeding out young Jersey cows you can produce your own milk, butter, cheese to eat when drinking wine if you have a Vineyard and Winery, plus cream for your coffee, Ice Cream and Egg Nog. To do this you will need to feed a Jersey bull for the second animal that you are feeding. Chrissy could even use the Cream in the afternoons when she is having Tea. Then get a Mule and a few chickens and there's no telling how far you can go in the farming business. I remember a few yerars ago when there was a Chicken Ranch in the Texas Hill Country. If I remember right it was quiet a profitable operation.
For this kind of segregated operation you will need to hire a farm manager with several herdsman to keep track of things. For this I would suggest you to contact Mr. Caustic Bruno
I would Personally be interested in the position of Chicken Ranch Manager

Best of luck to you.
If you would raise some corn you would be able to produce most of your own livestock feed. This would also give you an in for Moonshine Production. This could be very profitable if you can keep the revenoo'ers off your back.
A Big Best of LUCK to YOU

LA4,
Believe you've gotten an early start on holiday celebration!! :lol:

 

[IluvABbeef]

I'd hate to break things up about the weight factor and all, but I thought that some countries don't castrate partly because of animal welfare issues, like causing more "unneccessary" pain to the animal by taking his nuts off.

Just a thought. You can go back to what you were talkin about now.

 

[Shorthornguy]

la4angus, you are right about the Jersey. The Gurensey will also make good beef but the yield will only be about 45%.
Raised a couple Jersey steers for a city slicker friend. Pure corn silage was all he wanted them fed. Slaughtered at 900 lbs.
Yield was 62% Couldn't believe it.

 

[andybob]

I'd hate to break things up about the weight factor and all, but I thought that some countries don't castrate partly because of animal welfare issues, like causing more "unneccessary" pain to the animal by taking his nuts off.

Just a thought. You can go back to what you were talkin about now.

Agreed this is very much the case in Europe today,but bull beef has been popular in parts of Europe as I mentioned, as a traditional production system. The figures I quoted were from a 1975 lecture by Dr H Thornton, the percentage of bull beef produced at this time will now be obsolete so I did not include them. The cattle today research was in Rhodesia to investigate the economics of bull beef production.

 

[la4angus]

My limited experience is that dairy cattle have very good marbeling, they just have less of a ribeye area.

With my limited experience with dairy beef, is that if fed a real good fattening ration they will have excellent marbling, some Jerseys will even out marble an Angus but they won't produce as much beef. If fed right you may have the best beef that you have ever ate. It could even be as good or better than Longhorn beef. If you need to fill up your freezer you just need to feed two instead of just one. Not only will the rib-eye will be smaller but most other cuts will also be smaller. Dairy beef animals will not feed as efficently as your major beef breeds but the females will milk better after after she has a calf. They will produce more milk and Jerseys and Guernseys will produce a better quality milk with more butter-fat content. By feeding out young Jersey cows you can produce your own milk, butter, cheese to eat when drinking wine if you have a Vineyard and Winery, plus cream for your coffee, Ice Cream and Egg Nog. To do this you will need to feed a Jersey bull for the second animal that you are feeding. Chrissy could even use the Cream in the afternoons when she is having Tea. Then get a Mule and a few chickens and there's no telling how far you can go in the farming business. I remember a few yerars ago when there was a Chicken Ranch in the Texas Hill Country. If I remember right it was quiet a profitable operation.
For this kind of segregated operation you will need to hire a farm manager with several herdsman to keep track of things. For this I would suggest you to contact Mr. Caustic Bruno
I would Personally be interested in the position of Chicken Ranch Manager

Best of luck to you.
If you would raise some corn you would be able to produce most of your own livestock feed. This would also give you an in for Moonshine Production. This could be very profitable if you can keep the revenoo'ers off your back.
A Big Best of LUCK to YOU

Dang Lloyd. You have all the bases covered here. :lol:

They can grow a little garden and never have to buy any food.

Except for the truffles.

scuse me Mike. I hadn't thought about the garden. They could have about 2 acre garden and get some rabbits to eat the carrots and lettuce. This would take xare of much of their fertilize needs along with the cattle, horse and mule waste. Actually could be pretty self sufficent on about 5 acres. Just don't forget the corn so's to have somethin
to drink at nite when the kids are drawing water for their baths. Be sure to keep at least one kid bathin alla time to keep from goin thirsty.

 

[preston39]

Dr. Tilak Dhiman , Utah State University

..........."Actually, it was the CLA level(milk study) that dropped off in only 4 days on grain diet. It took 21 days on pasture only to regain previous levels. CLA comes from ruminants consuming chlorophyll(that's green leaves for you animal science majors ).

Omega-6 is a component of starch. The natural(wild) ratio is 2-1 to 1 of Omega-6 to Omega-3 in meat. Same in 100% grassfed...feedlot beef is about 4 to 1. The average USA diet is about 20 to 1(all the hydrogenated vegetable oils and grain products). Watch for future research to link Omega-6 or this unbalanced ratio to many of our chronic health problems........"

 

[Wewild]

Dr. Tilak Dhiman , Utah State University

..........."Actually, it was the CLA level(milk study) that dropped off in only 4 days on grain diet. It took 21 days on pasture only to regain previous levels. CLA comes from ruminants consuming chlorophyll(that's green leaves for you animal science majors ).

Omega-6 is a component of starch. The natural(wild) ratio is 2-1 to 1 of Omega-6 to Omega-3 in meat. Same in 100% grassfed...feedlot beef is about 4 to 1. The average USA diet is about 20 to 1(all the hydrogenated vegetable oils and grain products). Watch for future research to link Omega-6 or this unbalanced ratio to many of our chronic health problems........"

Put it in laymans terms for me please.

Omega 6's and 3's good or bad?

 

[OK Jeanne]

for a discussion of health benefits of grass-fed beef and
omega 6&3---see:

http://www.eatwild.com

 

[Wewild]

for a discussion of health benefits of grass-fed beef and
omega 6&3---see:

http://www.eatwild.com

I was looking for a yes or no answer. I take omega 6&3 everyday in the pill form.

 

[OK Jeanne]

I think the general consensus is that the ratio
between the two is the important thing...and the average american's diet is greatly unbalanced.