British Sailors
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Caustic Burno
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peg4x4":2c5fkllg said:Hooray!!!!!!!!!!
With a big stick to back it up and them knowing they would use it.
Caustic Burno":3rptvqxc said:peg4x4":3rptvqxc said:Hooray!!!!!!!!!!
With a big stick to back it up and them knowing they would use it.
And, aren't you glad it wasn't necessary...I surely am.
Alice
Caustic Burno
Well-known member
Alice":3q52xev3 said:Caustic Burno":3q52xev3 said:peg4x4":3q52xev3 said:Hooray!!!!!!!!!!
With a big stick to back it up and them knowing they would use it.
And, aren't you glad it wasn't necessary...I surely am.
Alice
We are going to fight that nut sooner or later. This guy might be the third anti-Christ. He is looking for a fight and keeps poking the stick through the fence. He is going to start it with us or one of our Allies and we don't have many and the ones we have all flew under the Union Jack at one time or still do with the exception of Isreal.
peg4x4":1ncczzz9 said:
Those 14 men and 1 woman did what it took to live and fight another day, Peg. It would have utter foolishness to do otherwise. I would think that would be obvious to the most casual observer...
Alice
England lost a lot of face in the arabic world. They promised it wouldnt' happen again and the crazy Iranian scolded them for having a mother of a child fighting their battles . He said something to the effect of why doesn't England honor women or families or something like that instead of putting mothers in battle. He made England look foolish in my book and they weren't even in Iranian waters....good grief. Chalk one down for Iran and zero for England. These Arabic , third world countries sure feel emboldened when they spank a bigger , western country. I'm glad the soldiers are going home though.
Ryder
Well-known member
Seems like I remember a smilar incident where talking did no good until Ray Gun Reagan was about to take office. They thought Ray Gun was a "wildman" and they were afraid of him and his big stick.Caustic Burno":37kq9se2 said:peg4x4":37kq9se2 said:Hooray!!!!!!!!!!
With a big stick to back it up and them knowing they would use it.
If it were not for the force and might of the Brits and the US, them sailors would be dead now.
And what about the congress setting a date to remove troops? Now that is sure smart. Yep, tell the enemy when you plan to quit. It sounds like something started by then dope smoking Clintons.
We should tell out commanders what we want to accomplish and let them have at it. We don't need politicians fighting wars. After all we pay them generals, let them earn their pay.
Well I am getting mad so I will stop.
And what about the congress setting a date to remove troops? Now that is sure smart. Yep, tell the enemy when you plan to quit. It sounds like something started by then dope smoking Clintons.
We should tell out commanders what we want to accomplish and let them have at it. We don't need politicians fighting wars. After all we pay them generals, let them earn their pay.
Well I am getting mad so I will stop.
VanC
Well-known member
ollie?":xrvpcou6 said:
We will probably find out eventually. My guess is that the captain of the British ship was told by a higher up not to fire any shots so as not to start an "international incident".
Bez>
Well-known member
I will open this by stating I do not know what the Rules of Engagement were. But the naval forces operating in the area would have been constrained by serious ROE.
ROE is the name of the game - and there will be military guys and gals here who have lived under really bad ROE -but you do live with it.
Anyone says they would break ROE in this situation - while being out gunned and out manned might be blowing smoke.
The supporting ships were too far away to help and the supporting helicopter had just left the area.
Iranian ships swarmed the little Brit inflatable - and Iran uses Boghammers I believe - the Brits would have been outgunned big time.
To answer ollies? question above - someone screwed up - big time. Period.
You can be sure this type of thing will not happen again - I would bet the ROE has been changed big time.
U.S. Forces are usually under similar constraints. The last U.S. battle group I sat in on had a head table with three guys at it. The Admiral, the CAG (Commander Air Group) and the JAG (Navy lawyer). Even in war the lawyers have immense power - they make the final decision as to the international legality of the plan.
Us poor attack folks sat at the feet of the Gods and after presenting our plans and strategy, did as we were told.
Bez>
ROE is the name of the game - and there will be military guys and gals here who have lived under really bad ROE -but you do live with it.
Anyone says they would break ROE in this situation - while being out gunned and out manned might be blowing smoke.
The supporting ships were too far away to help and the supporting helicopter had just left the area.
Iranian ships swarmed the little Brit inflatable - and Iran uses Boghammers I believe - the Brits would have been outgunned big time.
To answer ollies? question above - someone screwed up - big time. Period.
You can be sure this type of thing will not happen again - I would bet the ROE has been changed big time.
U.S. Forces are usually under similar constraints. The last U.S. battle group I sat in on had a head table with three guys at it. The Admiral, the CAG (Commander Air Group) and the JAG (Navy lawyer). Even in war the lawyers have immense power - they make the final decision as to the international legality of the plan.
Us poor attack folks sat at the feet of the Gods and after presenting our plans and strategy, did as we were told.
Bez>
ollie?":2wac49ol said:
They weren't on a ship. They had left their ship on RIBs (inflatable boats) to board a merchant ship during a smuggling investigation. The region is disputed waters that Iranians claim. The Iranian boats had mounted machine guns; the British sailors had side arms. I think they made a sensible decision not to put up a fight.
Bez>
Well-known member
Frankie":1b2nm48g said:
ollie? simply made an error in what he called the "vehicle" those folks were floating around on.
Bez>
From what I understand, and no doubt I'll be corrected if I'm wrong, these sailors were in 2 small inflatable boats and were surrounded by 6 Iranian gunboats. :shock:
To those asking the question why the sailors didn't fire a shot...to do so would have been suicide!
Again, in my opinion, these sailors did what it took to live and fight another day.
Alice
To those asking the question why the sailors didn't fire a shot...to do so would have been suicide!
Again, in my opinion, these sailors did what it took to live and fight another day.
Alice
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