Rigger37
New member
Hey, I'm looking into starting a cattle operation. I would like to hear you guys opions on some breeds and which ones you think are best at calving without problems and surviving in a cold climate.
Thanks
Thanks
Best Saskatchewan Breed
- Thread starter Rigger37
- Start date
DiamondSCattleCo
Well-known member
Oh boy, I get the first sales shot 
Seriously, my families been running livestock in Saskatchewan, both southern and northern, since the mid 1800s. We've mostly run Red Poll and Shorthorns, however I've played around extensively with Angus over the last 10 years. I've also taken little dips into Simmental (mostly crossing to the Angus), Maine (again crossing the Angus) and some double muscle stuff (which just didn't work for me, but could easily have been my fault).
The best breed? I haven't really found one. I didn't care for the larger framed Simms and Maine cows, but I see they've brought their frame sizes down a fair bit, even over the last 5 years. There are a couple on-going threads about frame sizes and cows that you may want to read. The long and short of it is that I feel you need a smaller to average framed animal, but lots of volume for easy keeping and fat deposition. You can find these in almost any breed, but its easier to find in a British animal such as an Angus, Shorthorn, or Red Poll.
If you're working on a commercial herd, find yourself a good bunch of Angus/Shorthorn cross cows, then cross these over to good Simm bulls. You'll get easy calving (provided you selected the bull properly), easy keeping cows (again, make sure you have enough volume) with excellent calf performance and above average grading on the finished product. We're also starting to see some premiums being paid out on Shortie cross calves, so its something to keep in mind.
If you want purebreds, I don't think you can beat a Shorthorn. During storms, my fullblood Angus cows are all huddled up against the trees, staying out of harms way, while my Shorties are all out rooting through the snow drifts trying to find that last blade of grass they'd saved for a rainy day. As a general rule of thumb, I find the Shorthorn animal easier keeping, growthier, and easier calving than Angus, and Shorthorn breeders in Western Canada have tried to stay with a little more old-fashioned animal. They're not perfect, as Shorthorn cows also tend to be a little more high strung, so if you're worried about getting run over during calving season, you may want to look elsewhere, or else be VERY picky, as there are very quiet Shorties out there.
The Shorthorn breed is also on the rise within Saskatchewan, and since there are far fewer breeders, the opportunity to be at least a medium-sized fish in a pretty small pond exists. With the Angus breed, we already have some well-entrenched breeders, so you'd have a very uphill battle with a breed thats seeing less use.
Theres a gent kicking around the board here of somewhat questionable psychiatric stability, who is likely going to try and talk your ear off about Welsh Blacks. :lol: If you can handle the constant twitching, you may want to listen to what he has to say. Its certainly a breed that shows great promise for harsher climates, and when my pocketbook allows for it, I have every intention of trying a few out in a commercial cross.
Rod
Seriously, my families been running livestock in Saskatchewan, both southern and northern, since the mid 1800s. We've mostly run Red Poll and Shorthorns, however I've played around extensively with Angus over the last 10 years. I've also taken little dips into Simmental (mostly crossing to the Angus), Maine (again crossing the Angus) and some double muscle stuff (which just didn't work for me, but could easily have been my fault).
The best breed? I haven't really found one. I didn't care for the larger framed Simms and Maine cows, but I see they've brought their frame sizes down a fair bit, even over the last 5 years. There are a couple on-going threads about frame sizes and cows that you may want to read. The long and short of it is that I feel you need a smaller to average framed animal, but lots of volume for easy keeping and fat deposition. You can find these in almost any breed, but its easier to find in a British animal such as an Angus, Shorthorn, or Red Poll.
If you're working on a commercial herd, find yourself a good bunch of Angus/Shorthorn cross cows, then cross these over to good Simm bulls. You'll get easy calving (provided you selected the bull properly), easy keeping cows (again, make sure you have enough volume) with excellent calf performance and above average grading on the finished product. We're also starting to see some premiums being paid out on Shortie cross calves, so its something to keep in mind.
If you want purebreds, I don't think you can beat a Shorthorn. During storms, my fullblood Angus cows are all huddled up against the trees, staying out of harms way, while my Shorties are all out rooting through the snow drifts trying to find that last blade of grass they'd saved for a rainy day. As a general rule of thumb, I find the Shorthorn animal easier keeping, growthier, and easier calving than Angus, and Shorthorn breeders in Western Canada have tried to stay with a little more old-fashioned animal. They're not perfect, as Shorthorn cows also tend to be a little more high strung, so if you're worried about getting run over during calving season, you may want to look elsewhere, or else be VERY picky, as there are very quiet Shorties out there.
The Shorthorn breed is also on the rise within Saskatchewan, and since there are far fewer breeders, the opportunity to be at least a medium-sized fish in a pretty small pond exists. With the Angus breed, we already have some well-entrenched breeders, so you'd have a very uphill battle with a breed thats seeing less use.
Theres a gent kicking around the board here of somewhat questionable psychiatric stability, who is likely going to try and talk your ear off about Welsh Blacks. :lol: If you can handle the constant twitching, you may want to listen to what he has to say. Its certainly a breed that shows great promise for harsher climates, and when my pocketbook allows for it, I have every intention of trying a few out in a commercial cross.
Rod
yeah avoid welsh blacksDiamondSCattleCo":14bmrbn5 said:Oh boy, I get the first sales shot
Seriously, my families been running livestock in Saskatchewan, both southern and northern, since the mid 1800s. We've mostly run Red Poll and Shorthorns, however I've played around extensively with Angus over the last 10 years. I've also taken little dips into Simmental (mostly crossing to the Angus), Maine (again crossing the Angus) and some double muscle stuff (which just didn't work for me, but could easily have been my fault).
The best breed? I haven't really found one. I didn't care for the larger framed Simms and Maine cows, but I see they've brought their frame sizes down a fair bit, even over the last 5 years. There are a couple on-going threads about frame sizes and cows that you may want to read. The long and short of it is that I feel you need a smaller to average framed animal, but lots of volume for easy keeping and fat deposition. You can find these in almost any breed, but its easier to find in a British animal such as an Angus, Shorthorn, or Red Poll.
If you're working on a commercial herd, find yourself a good bunch of Angus/Shorthorn cross cows, then cross these over to good Simm bulls. You'll get easy calving (provided you selected the bull properly), easy keeping cows (again, make sure you have enough volume) with excellent calf performance and above average grading on the finished product. We're also starting to see some premiums being paid out on Shortie cross calves, so its something to keep in mind.
If you want purebreds, I don't think you can beat a Shorthorn. During storms, my fullblood Angus cows are all huddled up against the trees, staying out of harms way, while my Shorties are all out rooting through the snow drifts trying to find that last blade of grass they'd saved for a rainy day. As a general rule of thumb, I find the Shorthorn animal easier keeping, growthier, and easier calving than Angus, and Shorthorn breeders in Western Canada have tried to stay with a little more old-fashioned animal. They're not perfect, as Shorthorn cows also tend to be a little more high strung, so if you're worried about getting run over during calving season, you may want to look elsewhere, or else be VERY picky, as there are very quiet Shorties out there.
The Shorthorn breed is also on the rise within Saskatchewan, and since there are far fewer breeders, the opportunity to be at least a medium-sized fish in a pretty small pond exists. With the Angus breed, we already have some well-entrenched breeders, so you'd have a very uphill battle with a breed thats seeing less use.
Theres a gent kicking around the board here of somewhat questionable psychiatric stability, who is likely going to try and talk your ear off about Welsh Blacks. :lol: If you can handle the constant twitching, you may want to listen to what he has to say. Its certainly a breed that shows great promise for harsher climates, and when my pocketbook allows for it, I have every intention of trying a few out in a commercial cross.
Rod
rkaiser
Well-known member
Okeedokee topsquare, you're up to bat ---- Why not Welsh Blacks?
DiamondSCattleCo
Well-known member
Yeah, I'm a little curious to the reasons myself. Or is this another Welsh Black breeder with a twisted sense of humor? :lol:
Rod
Rod
VanC
Well-known member
Rigger37":215iz8c0 said:
Whatever advice you get, I would definitely pay closer attention to your fellow Canadiens. They would have a much better idea of what works in your area.
![Pampers Sensitive Baby Wipes, Clinically Proven, Fragrance Free, Unscented, Water Based, Hypoallergenic, Multi-Use, Hand Wipes 336 Wipes Total (6X Flip-Top Packs) [Packaging May Vary]](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41KLBHu9CAL._SL500_.jpg)
George
Well-known member
My preference is,black simmental,hereford cross simmental,hereford cross black angus.
cowsense
Well-known member
George about nailled it; If you have a Hereford base to your herd you can crossbreed with just about anything!
SPRINGER FARMS MURRAY GRE
Well-known member
Murray Grey would be an excellent choice for you in your area.There are several breeders in Canada. (Shorthorn/Angus cross, started in Australia).PM me for more info, and some breeders names. ;-) :cboy:
rkaiser
Well-known member
Well I won't go into too much detail unless you ask but---- The other British based cowherds mentioned above including the kinda British Murray greys will all work well, and will work well with a continental terminal bull as mentioned by the previous posters. However, what you need to look for is type rather than breed, as each of the breeds mentioned, as well as my Welsh Black and Galloway cattle, will do the trick if you find the right type.
Find yourself some broody but feminine females with moderate size and all the obvious things like good feet, legs, udder structure, hair and hide
etc. etc. Then choose your sire dependent on your marketing. If you choose to simply sell calves through the Auction barn, gamble a bit an select a continental sire with some good weaning weight potential. This will likely challenge your birth weights - thus the gamble, but works well in the situation mentioned. Don't select females from this sire as you will find yourself in the situation that the conventional Canadian industry has found itself in for the last 30 years. Larger cows, and larger carcasses.
Maybe good for the factory line at Cargill, but not so good for your bottom line.
If you are looking beyond the "selling at the auction barn with calves situation", you will need to do some more homework. Lots of opportunities out there these days. Watch this board or ask around to find some options. Ours is one - not perfect, but definately more profitable than the mainstream - "pad the packers pocket one" that most fall back on.
Good luck to you Rigger 37- sounds like you have some Oil money to get rid of hey?
Still waiting for our Aussie freind to back up his bark about the Welsh Black cattle.
Find yourself some broody but feminine females with moderate size and all the obvious things like good feet, legs, udder structure, hair and hide
etc. etc. Then choose your sire dependent on your marketing. If you choose to simply sell calves through the Auction barn, gamble a bit an select a continental sire with some good weaning weight potential. This will likely challenge your birth weights - thus the gamble, but works well in the situation mentioned. Don't select females from this sire as you will find yourself in the situation that the conventional Canadian industry has found itself in for the last 30 years. Larger cows, and larger carcasses. Maybe good for the factory line at Cargill, but not so good for your bottom line.
If you are looking beyond the "selling at the auction barn with calves situation", you will need to do some more homework. Lots of opportunities out there these days. Watch this board or ask around to find some options. Ours is one - not perfect, but definately more profitable than the mainstream - "pad the packers pocket one" that most fall back on.
Good luck to you Rigger 37- sounds like you have some Oil money to get rid of hey?
Still waiting for our Aussie freind to back up his bark about the Welsh Black cattle.
I have never seen Welsh Black cattle in yard sales and I have never seen them crossed with other cattle, from what I know they are in australia and are becoming very rare, for them to become almost none existent in australia beef industrie must be something wrong with the breed, as black cattle in Australia are very popular, they must be to soft for Australian conditions?or poor disposition?. If fellow Australian cattlemen can enlighten me on the welsh Black cattle in australia ,please do but im sure the breed is near none existent in australia. 8)
DiamondSCattleCo
Well-known member
rkaiser":1l9kgt5a said:hair and hide
:lol: And there's the pitch :lol: :lol: Randy, yer a sneaky old devil, ain't ya? :lol:
Topsquare, I can't speak for your area, but I can think of several breeds that died down for no real good reason other than the popularity of Black Angus. Red Polls are rarely seen anymore, at least in my area, yet they are ideally suited for this climate. Shorthorns almost completely died out, even though I think they're also ideally suited for crossing and this environment (unlike a Hereford, you REALLY can cross a Shortie to anything :lol: :lol: j/k guys). So for all you know, the Welsh animals in Australia may be dieing out because of bad marketing. Thats sure not a good reason to stay away from 'em, especially since our environment is so radically different than yours.
Rod
The area I live in northeastern NSW Australia 1100 meters above sea level, all the cattle are Shorthorn, Angus , Charolaise, Murreygreys, Gelbviehs, Limousins and 2 santa Gertrudis studs with in 30 kms, shorthorns are very popular in my area as most breeders cross them with Angus to put some frame into the calves, and black Limousins and Gelbviehs are becoming a regular at sales, oh and South Devons 4 studs in my area. But no Welsh Blacks 
rkaiser
Well-known member
Fair enough topsquare --- numbers is your only response. I am happy that you have no experience that was problematic.
We only have a handful of Welsh Black breeders in Canada as well, but the situation that has risen due to tighter margins for the primary producer has done nothing but good for those numbers. Maybe things are just too darn good in Australia these days, and people are going with - the if it ain't broke why fit it attitude.
There were no exotic cattle in Canada in the 40's. Does that mean that they were no good? Registration numbers have been dropping for a lot of the continentals in Canada these days. Does that mean they are no good?
No it does not. All cattle breeds have use and as I have pointed out a number of times, this "number of different breeds thing" is what sets our industry apart from the factory lines of pork and chicken (much to Cargill and Tysons chagrin). Lots more on that topic if you like. Environment is likely the biggest arguement for sustaining genetic diversity, however the beef industry has a major advantage over Pork and Chicken in the variety of proroducts we are able to produce from one species.
Hope you find a good Welsh Black stud someday topsquare, and give the CATTLE a good hard look.
We only have a handful of Welsh Black breeders in Canada as well, but the situation that has risen due to tighter margins for the primary producer has done nothing but good for those numbers. Maybe things are just too darn good in Australia these days, and people are going with - the if it ain't broke why fit it attitude.
There were no exotic cattle in Canada in the 40's. Does that mean that they were no good? Registration numbers have been dropping for a lot of the continentals in Canada these days. Does that mean they are no good?
No it does not. All cattle breeds have use and as I have pointed out a number of times, this "number of different breeds thing" is what sets our industry apart from the factory lines of pork and chicken (much to Cargill and Tysons chagrin). Lots more on that topic if you like. Environment is likely the biggest arguement for sustaining genetic diversity, however the beef industry has a major advantage over Pork and Chicken in the variety of proroducts we are able to produce from one species.
Hope you find a good Welsh Black stud someday topsquare, and give the CATTLE a good hard look.
rkaiser
Well-known member
topsquar hey? You must be a German boy like this Kaiser fellow. 8)
tracy
Well-known member
try romagnola they may be white to grey in color but they have a grey hide so the wont get snow burnt and they calve very easily
randiliana
Well-known member
I would suggest staying with a British based cow. Either straight or crossed with European works quite well. The British can handle all that Saskatchewan weather can throw at them and they tend to be a bit smaller which requires less feed. Our cow herd consists of Red and Black Angus, Hereford, and Shorthorn and various crosses of these breeds. They are around 1250 lbs. The bigger the cow the more feed they require when the temps drop into the -20's and -30's. Whatever breed you look at you will want to find cows with lots of depth and length to them.
