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<blockquote data-quote="randiliana" data-source="post: 1108075" data-attributes="member: 2308"><p>OK, I did some number crunching here. I am totally in agreement with Bez on this discussion. At least in our climate anyways. Things can very easily be different in a warmer climate... AI and proven AI bulls aside, BW is IMO directly linked to WW. The lighter the BW the lighter the WW in general. Sure there are 'curve benders' out there, but if you're running bulls on the hoof, chances are you're going to lose on WW if you reduce your BW.</p><p></p><p>I detest under 70 lb calves, and the lighter they get the more I hate them. In my calving situations 50-70 lb calves are usually the ones that cause problems. Usually they are weaker calves, if it's cold out they chill a lot faster than a 85+ lb calf. </p><p></p><p>So, here's what the numbers in my herd for the last 5 years looked like... I removed all the twins and adopted calves out of the figuring. And divided it : Under 70 lbs, 70-79, 80-89, 90-99, 100-109, 110 and up. The differences are from 1 group to the next only. So from the 70 lbs to the 80 lbs for example.</p><p></p><p>On the cow side of thing (3 year old and up) there was a total of 516 calves. Most of these are home bred calves, but a few will be out of cows we bought.</p><p>Under 70 lbs, 18 head - Avg BW 63, avg 205 DW 507, Avg ADG 2.17</p><p>70-79 lbs, 73 head - BW 75, 205 DW 548, ADG 2.31 - Diff of BW 12, 205 DW 41</p><p>80-89 lbs, 147 head - BW 84, 205 DW 573, ADG 2.38 - Diff of BW 9, 205 DW 24</p><p>90-99 lbs, 162 head - BW 94, 205 DW 595, ADG 2.44 - Diff of BW 10, 205 DW 23</p><p>100-109 lbs, 88 head - BW 104, 205 DW 632, ADG 2.57 - Diff of BW 10, 205 DW 37</p><p>Over 110 lbs, 28 head - BW 115, 205 DW 673, ADG 2.73 - Diff of BW 11, 205 DW 41</p><p>Difference in Weights from the Under 70's to over 110's was BW 52 lbs, 205 DW 166 lbs</p><p></p><p>On the Heifer side of things, (2 year olds) there was a total of 141 calves. This consists of heifers we bred to our bulls and heifers we bought.</p><p>Under 70 lbs, 24 head - BW 64, 205 DW 484, ADG 2.05</p><p>70-79 lbs, 49 head - BW 75, 205 DW 514, ADG 2.14 - Diff of BW 11, 205 DW 30</p><p>80-89 lbs, 48 head - BW 84, 205 DW 522, ADG 2.13 - Diff of BW 9, 205 DW 8</p><p>90-99 lbs, 20 head - BW 94, 205 DW 583. ADG 2.39 - Diff of BW 9, 205 DW 62</p><p>Difference in weights from under 70's to 90-99's was BW 31 lbs, 205 DW 86 lbs </p><p>There were a handful of heifers that had calves over 100 lbs. Most if not all of those calves were assisted if not C-sections, only a couple of those heifers stayed in the herd and actually raised that calf. Their weaning weights tended to be quite low. For example 1 had by C-section a 108 lb calf, 205 DW 455 ADG 1.69....</p><p></p><p>These are the actual numbers and they show quite a difference. I wouldn't necessarily recommend increasing BW to the top end of the scale. While there are definitely cows that can handle 110+ lb calves, the higher the BW the bigger the chance of having to assist. In our herd I like to see cows having 85-100 lb calves, and heifers 75-90 lbs. Those tend to be the best investment. Calves the cows/heifers can have on their own and that grow out really well. OTOH, I have no problem with a cow that has smaller calves if they actually do grow and I don't have to fight to get them going, or cows that have bigger calves so long as they can have them on their own.</p><p></p><p>Oh, and just in case anyone was wondering, the lightest calf was 42 lbs and the heaviest calf was 130 lbs</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="randiliana, post: 1108075, member: 2308"] OK, I did some number crunching here. I am totally in agreement with Bez on this discussion. At least in our climate anyways. Things can very easily be different in a warmer climate... AI and proven AI bulls aside, BW is IMO directly linked to WW. The lighter the BW the lighter the WW in general. Sure there are 'curve benders' out there, but if you're running bulls on the hoof, chances are you're going to lose on WW if you reduce your BW. I detest under 70 lb calves, and the lighter they get the more I hate them. In my calving situations 50-70 lb calves are usually the ones that cause problems. Usually they are weaker calves, if it's cold out they chill a lot faster than a 85+ lb calf. So, here's what the numbers in my herd for the last 5 years looked like... I removed all the twins and adopted calves out of the figuring. And divided it : Under 70 lbs, 70-79, 80-89, 90-99, 100-109, 110 and up. The differences are from 1 group to the next only. So from the 70 lbs to the 80 lbs for example. On the cow side of thing (3 year old and up) there was a total of 516 calves. Most of these are home bred calves, but a few will be out of cows we bought. Under 70 lbs, 18 head - Avg BW 63, avg 205 DW 507, Avg ADG 2.17 70-79 lbs, 73 head - BW 75, 205 DW 548, ADG 2.31 - Diff of BW 12, 205 DW 41 80-89 lbs, 147 head - BW 84, 205 DW 573, ADG 2.38 - Diff of BW 9, 205 DW 24 90-99 lbs, 162 head - BW 94, 205 DW 595, ADG 2.44 - Diff of BW 10, 205 DW 23 100-109 lbs, 88 head - BW 104, 205 DW 632, ADG 2.57 - Diff of BW 10, 205 DW 37 Over 110 lbs, 28 head - BW 115, 205 DW 673, ADG 2.73 - Diff of BW 11, 205 DW 41 Difference in Weights from the Under 70's to over 110's was BW 52 lbs, 205 DW 166 lbs On the Heifer side of things, (2 year olds) there was a total of 141 calves. This consists of heifers we bred to our bulls and heifers we bought. Under 70 lbs, 24 head - BW 64, 205 DW 484, ADG 2.05 70-79 lbs, 49 head - BW 75, 205 DW 514, ADG 2.14 - Diff of BW 11, 205 DW 30 80-89 lbs, 48 head - BW 84, 205 DW 522, ADG 2.13 - Diff of BW 9, 205 DW 8 90-99 lbs, 20 head - BW 94, 205 DW 583. ADG 2.39 - Diff of BW 9, 205 DW 62 Difference in weights from under 70's to 90-99's was BW 31 lbs, 205 DW 86 lbs There were a handful of heifers that had calves over 100 lbs. Most if not all of those calves were assisted if not C-sections, only a couple of those heifers stayed in the herd and actually raised that calf. Their weaning weights tended to be quite low. For example 1 had by C-section a 108 lb calf, 205 DW 455 ADG 1.69.... These are the actual numbers and they show quite a difference. I wouldn't necessarily recommend increasing BW to the top end of the scale. While there are definitely cows that can handle 110+ lb calves, the higher the BW the bigger the chance of having to assist. In our herd I like to see cows having 85-100 lb calves, and heifers 75-90 lbs. Those tend to be the best investment. Calves the cows/heifers can have on their own and that grow out really well. OTOH, I have no problem with a cow that has smaller calves if they actually do grow and I don't have to fight to get them going, or cows that have bigger calves so long as they can have them on their own. Oh, and just in case anyone was wondering, the lightest calf was 42 lbs and the heaviest calf was 130 lbs [/QUOTE]
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