Appies

[cowgirl08]

I know Appaloosas tend to be high strung horses. I have a three year old solid red Appie and he is definitely high strung. But he also tends to be a little aggressive. He went to the trainers last september and did great when he got home. At least, for a little while. Then he didn't like not being the boss. I would never hurt him so i need some other way of showing him that he needs to respect me. I haven't quite grown accustomed to him trying to bite, kick, and run me over sideways all at the same time.

 

[Bez>]

I know Appaloosas tend to be high strung horses. I have a three year old solid red Appie and he is definitely high strung. But he also tends to be a little aggressive. He went to the trainers last september and did great when he got home. At least, for a little while. Then he didn't like not being the boss. I would never hurt him so i need some other way of showing him that he needs to respect me. I haven't quite grown accustomed to him trying to bite, kick, and run me over sideways all at the same time.

First thing is first.

It sounds to me like this horse has your number - he OWNS you - rather it should be the other way around.

You have some choices - some you will like and some you will not like - no matter the case, you have to become the boss - or toss the horse - he will hurt you or worse from your writing.

You asked - so here it is. Advice and comments.

1. This horse went to the trainer. But - did you go too? Why not? Any horse that is to be trained also needs to have a trained rider - sounds like you are timid or very new. Find out what the trainer did and do it. This horse has beat you into the ground and is loving it. Spend more money at the trainer - but this is a young animal - from what I have read to this point I would not put you on something under 10 years old with a lot of miles on him. Period.

2. He is an Appaloosa - cannot stand them myself - every one that I have owned has been trouble - yeah you readers who will jump on me - I know there are some good one - it is just that I have yet to see one that is worth more than dog food.

This one is aggressive - biting, kicking - I would tie the SOB up and beat the living snot out of him with a whip the very next time he did this to me. Tie him strong and tie him short and lay it on.

If you do a search you might even find where I laid a horse down and walked all over him, pis ss ed on his nose and would not let him up for the best part of the day. It was the only way to break that S.O.B. I had to break him before he killed me - and it took all day - but I did beat him - he was a great animal after that.

This my dear is not for the beginner - do not do this yourself.

You need to toss this horse if you cannot get him to mind.

3. Your age is important - if you are young and your parents bought you this horse - go tell them to sell him or can him - he is trying to hurt you. If someone makes fun of you for saying this - then they are the problem - certainly not you.

If you are not young - ie: an adult - then you should be mature enough to know the things I am writing about - fix him or toss him. My vote is to turn him into dogfood - horses are cheap like borscht - even horses with papers - papers - Bah!! Not worth the ink they are covered with.

4. I never - ever - ever - want to see you write this, say this or think this again:

quote - I would never hurt him so i need some other way of showing him that he needs to respect me. - end quote

It is this attitude that is causing you the trouble.

I have never gratuitously injured an animal. But if you had watched my two hay burners lay the hooves to each other this morning, you would realize it is highly unlikely you could seriously hurt a horse unless really laying on the lumber.

5. Stop - immediately - stop thinking this horse is a wonderful loving pet that wants the same things out of life you do.

This is a 1000 pound - maybe larger - eating, breathing and ready to kill you if you screw up - animal that does not love you, does not care if you pet him and does not care if you speak to him. He does not want you on his back - he does not like your smell - he does not even like you in the same barn he is in.

All he wants is his hay, his oats and his water and to be bloody well left alone.

It is up to you the rider to MAKE him obey. If you cannot you are in trouble - deep trouble.

So - you asked for advice - it is not likely what you wanted - but I am old enough to be a Grandpa to many if not most on this board - and I have the healed wounds and healed bones to prove I do know what I write about.

Finally - please tell me that the nuts have been cut out of this guy. I hope to he l l he is not a stallion.

You are now afraid of this animal and he knows it - establish dominance or get hurt - or for that matter - die.

The choices are yours - please choose wisely,

Bez>

 

[oscar p]

A horse that intentionally tries to hurt you is trouble. A big a$$ whipping probally will help him. But i'd, SHIP HIM. Spend the money on a older gelding, 10yrs or older. That you can ride and trust. I wouldn't trust this horse you are talking about. I ride a app mule so I have nothing against apps. He aint worth getting yourself hurt or killed.

 

[msscamp]

Then he didn't like not being the boss. I would never hurt him so i need some other way of showing him that he needs to respect me. I haven't quite grown accustomed to him trying to bite, kick, and run me over sideways all at the same time.

Do you mind my asking how old you are? It is not a matter of him 'not liking not being the boss', it is a matter of you not being able to enforce your boss status. Have you ever watched 2 or 3 horses establish their pecking order? Short of laying into this horse with a 2 by 4, you're not going to hurt him - so get over that mind frame. He doesn't 'need to respect you', he should have no other choice but to respect you - and that comes from you. I personally would ship him so fast his head would spin. There are too many good horses out there to put up with this type of behavior.

 

[cowgirl08]

When I said I would never beat him, I didn't use my wording correctly. I would never hurt an animal for doing something he didn't know was wrong. I'm seventeen and I do discipline him. I went with him to the trainers and I helped train him. The problem came when we brought him home right before winter. We don't have the best property for horses so we (against my will) were forced to take the winter off. Come spring it was the retraining that things started to go wrong. And i think a big part of this was bring the cows home. He was a perfect little angel when it was just me and him. But once he realized he could boss the cows around run them, that's when he thought he was top man. He's only actually tried to kick someone once but it was all out both legs. He missed but he got beat pretty good for that one. My main concern is the biting. He just needs to learn to give me my space. Surprisingly he does great with lunging and riding, it's the leading that he doesn't like. I just need him to mind my space and leave the cows alone.

 

[clampitt]

Believe me not all Apps are high strung.I raise Quarter Horses and we ride and show them.But I am here to tell you I have ridden some outstanding Apps. in my life and seen several others and they were as good as you would ever want.Your horse like was said owns you and you better get hold of him now.Since he was alright when you brought him home before.Send him back to who ever rode him before for another 30 or 60 days and go ride him there.Any horse the kicks.bits,knocks you down and does it just cause he can and you let him is dangerious.You have never been hurt very bad by one I take it and believe me when I say I have and they ainit worth it.If you are going to keep him.KNOCK HIM DOWN.What ever it takes you better get your bluff in on him before he nails you.

 

[flaboy?]

msscamps right, short of a 2x4 you ain't gonna hurt a horse. I watched my dad as a kid beat his stud horse across the rump with a 2x4 for kicking. He would sneak up behind his stall and touch his rump with the board, when the horse kicked he laid one on him. He (dad) stood behind a solid wall. I saw him do this twice and every time after that if you touched that horse on the butt he would squat. He turned out to be a great ranch horse.

For biting I use my fist but I would recommend a stiff wire brush for you. Don't hold back, smack the heck out of him across the mouth at the first sign he wants to put lips on you.

Show him who is the boss EVERYTIME you handle him or SHIP HIM somewhere else.

 

[circlet]

lucky for you cowgirl, you're getting some good solid advice instead of some touchy-feely BS about being the horses best friend. i have a 3 Y.O. appaloosa gelding who is kind of a lazy twerp, but is a very respectful and friendly horse, he's not mean or nasty, so don't just chalk this horses behaivor up to "app's are high strung". put some wheels under this horse (sell him). while i 100% agree with some of the remedies you've been given, my gut tells me that these remedies won't be your style or something you're capable of doing. just get rid of him, and before you get your next horse...evaluate yourself honestly. were you part of the problem with this guy? don't ever be afraid to be honest with yourself about these kinds of things. there's no shame in getting a little help if you need it. i still ask for help all the time, and i've broken more colts than you'd believe.

 

[Alice]

My rule of thumb has become...

If ya' can't enjoy riding the horse for fear of _________ (fill in the blank), then send it off and find one you can enjoy riding. Your loss may be someone else's gain, and vice versa...

That's just my rule of thumb, now...

Alice

 

[chippie]

Alice,
Wise words and advice.

 

[DrumRunner728]

My rule of thumb has become...

If ya' can't enjoy riding the horse for fear of _________ (fill in the blank), then send it off and find one you can enjoy riding. Your loss may be someone else's gain, and vice versa...

That's just my rule of thumb, now...

Alice

Alice, I absolutely live by that! It's kept me relatively injury free and healthy for 50+ years. As I've said before on this board, NEVER let anyone or anything intimidate you into getting on a horse that you aren't comfortable with. Life is too short, and there are too many good horses in the world, to ride/own/feed an idiot.

 

[lilmissfit]

As I've said before on this board, NEVER let anyone or anything intimidate you into getting on a horse that you aren't comfortable with. Life is too short, and there are too many good horses in the world, to ride/own/feed an idiot.

Also never let anyone talk you in to getting rid of a horse just because "they" don't like it. I was foolish and sold my 7yr retired off the track thoroughbred. Everyone always called him the "crazy thoroughbred" funny thing is I could go out and hop on him any time and off we would go thru the fields and trails. Also, talk about "BOMBPROOF" this guy was awesome. The first horse we bought after we brought him home was a mare, they bonded and he did show some studdish behavior around her. Now that he is gone and was replaced with a qtr gelding they have all realized that the problem in the herd was that "darned ole crabby mare"! As she has captured him just like she did the thoroughbred.

Now my young gelding 5yr and my percheron yearling recently gelded don't give that mare the time of day. LOL

 

[peg4x4]

One persons "killer" horse is someone elses "dream horse"..
Find that someone else and sell that nutcase to them.

 

[randiliana]

. We don't have the best property for horses so we (against my will) were forced to take the winter off. Come spring it was the retraining that things started to go wrong. And i think a big part of this was bring the cows home. He was a perfect little angel when it was just me and him. But once he realized he could boss the cows around run them, that's when he thought he was top man. He's only actually tried to kick someone once but it was all out both legs. He missed but he got beat pretty good for that one. My main concern is the biting. He just needs to learn to give me my space. Surprisingly he does great with lunging and riding, it's the leading that he doesn't like. I just need him to mind my space and leave the cows alone.

Sorry, but it has nothing(or very little) to do with having the winter off. There had to be issues before then. Most of our horses have the winter off, and they don't come back in the spring with a new attitude. The cows could have certainly given him ideas, but again there had to be issues there before. If he wants to bite you smack him, use a crop, use a wire brush, whatever, but do it, and do it if he even OFFERS to lip you. Be sure, he doesn't care if he hurts you!!

As for crowding, smack him again, use a crop, a stick, your elbow, the lead shank. He has to know that HE has to stay out of your space. If he even bumps you smack him. As for kicking, this is a LOT more dangerous. I have cured horses from kicking, but I sure wouldn't try it if I was not pretty experienced, find someone who has experience with sour horses (cause that is what you have) and send him there.

And, remember, there are way to many good horses out there (especially now) to mess with one that might hurt you. This is my motto, and I have sent off some pretty nice looking ones because of it. But better safe than sorry....

 

[randiliana]

. We don't have the best property for horses so we (against my will) were forced to take the winter off. Come spring it was the retraining that things started to go wrong. And i think a big part of this was bring the cows home. He was a perfect little angel when it was just me and him. But once he realized he could boss the cows around run them, that's when he thought he was top man. He's only actually tried to kick someone once but it was all out both legs. He missed but he got beat pretty good for that one. My main concern is the biting. He just needs to learn to give me my space. Surprisingly he does great with lunging and riding, it's the leading that he doesn't like. I just need him to mind my space and leave the cows alone.

Sorry, but it has nothing(or very little) to do with having the winter off. There had to be issues before then. Most of our horses have the winter off, and they don't come back in the spring with a new attitude. The cows could have certainly given him ideas, but again there had to be issues there before. If he wants to bite you smack him, use a crop, use a wire brush, whatever, but do it, and do it if he even OFFERS to lip you. Be sure, he doesn't care if he hurts you!!

As for crowding, smack him again, use a crop, a stick, your elbow, the lead shank. He has to know that HE has to stay out of your space. If he even bumps you smack him. As for kicking, this is a LOT more dangerous. I have cured horses from kicking, but I sure wouldn't try it if I was not pretty experienced, find someone who has experience with sour horses (cause that is what you have) and send him there at the very least, if not sell him.

And, remember, there are way to many good horses out there (especially now) to mess with one that might hurt you. This is my motto, and I have sent off some pretty nice looking ones because of it. But better safe than sorry....

 

[cowgirl08]

he's going back to the trainers this week. She's gonna let me do almost all the retraining. i do think the cows had a lot to do with his sudden boost of confidence. before the cows he had never been with other critters besides his mama. and the the woman who bred and raised him spoiled him. She was constantly hand feeding him and that's why he's always nibbling. I just don't like it when i'm trying to do something and all of a sudden he's nippin at me cause he thinks i got something for him. Any idea how to break him from chasin cows? i'm afraid he's gonna run my calves to death.

 

[Bez>]

he's going back to the trainers this week. She's gonna let me do almost all the retraining. i do think the cows had a lot to do with his sudden boost of confidence. before the cows he had never been with other critters besides his mama. and the the woman who bred and raised him spoiled him. She was constantly hand feeding him and that's why he's always nibbling. I just don't like it when i'm trying to do something and all of a sudden he's nippin at me cause he thinks i got something for him. Any idea how to break him from chasin cows? i'm afraid he's gonna run my calves to death.

I know some folks keep cows and horses together.

But ...... don't.

Keep them apart - and yes he will run them to death.

Bez>

 

[cowgirl08]

yeah i was never to happy about having to fence the cattle with Chey, but we don't have a whole lot of land to do much separating. i mean we could but that means we're cutting our hay field short. and we're already gonna be extremely low on hay this year. usually the cattle go to the pasture (property about 20 miles from our house) during the summer. well, the cows usually get bred there. this year however, we have a coupla heifers that are too young to breed. so we kept them home. one of our many problems. has anybody noticed that nothing seems to work out when u most need it to? it's always either the money or the weather. but one of them will always kick u while ur down

 

[Canadian_Cowgirl]

I know some folks keep cows and horses together.

But ...... don't.

Keep them apart - and yes he will run them to death.

Bez>

Why not??? We always see horses and cows together, and our horses and cows are together, and they never hurt anything!!

Katy

 

[cowpunk'd]

You are right, being the boss of cows will have something to do with his bad attitude. I don't think you can cure him of chasing cows so you will have to separate them. Taking him back to the trainer is definitely the best plan. It is a rare horse that needs to be layed down and p'd on in my experience, hobbling one leg so he has to figure out how to stand three legged is humbling enough for most horses. The hobble, which can be an english stirrup leather or even a belt, goes around the pastern below the fetlock and around the leg above the knee in a figure eight, with the leg flexed. He is likely to get worried and try to come to you to save him so get out of the way, he could fall on you. Doubling, when one rein is tied to the girth of the saddle with the horses neck flexed, nose towards girth is also humbling. He is fighting himself, not you, and when he stops fighting and gives to the pressure he has learned something, and you untie the rein then. Just incase it sounded like a good idea to you I want to mention that it is a very bad idea to sneak up behind a horse in its stall and smack it with a 2x4. If you hate the horse that much just shoot it. That is insane.