2014/15 Florida Bull Test

[gizmom]

Well since the bulls have to be delivered I was forced to make a decision as to which bulls to send over for the test. I finally settled on the following:

Gizmo Regis 1314 991 904 Reg. # 17844686 - This is an ET calf we purchased the eggs out of the Coleman Angus program in Montana, we have two flush brothers and one flush sister out of this mating.

Gizmo EXT 1329 0709 6149 Reg. # 17844737 - This is a bull calf out of Ronnie's favorite cow and our now deceased herd sire 6149 a really nice calf that just kept catching our eye. The cow is really long sided and deep and the bull calf shows a lot of depth and thickness.

Gizmo Midland 1333 525 430 Reg. # 17844599 - I wanted to test this calf to see how he would perform, I know the cow family is a powerful one. His dam 525 is a Pathfinder and his full sister in blood Gizmo Pride 811 525 430 Reg. # 16358620 made Pathfinder in 2013 on her third calf. I know one thing for sure whoever ends up with this bull will be getting a cow maker.

Gizmo FA 1337 658 0035 Reg. # 17844590 - This is another ET calf out of our 658 donor. We have sold a bunch of bulls out of this cow and she has made some really good ones. This is the first flush out of Final Answer and we like what we see so far. I sure wish we would have had a heifer or two out of the mating but all we got were bulls. We have a couple more of the flush brothers here at the farm so we wanted to see how this one would do on the test. We are planning to flush the cow again and how he does will determine if we flush to Final Answer again.

Gizmom

 

[M5farm]

I am looking forward to seeing how they do. I am seriously thinking about picking up a bull at this years sale.

 

[gizmom]

I talked to Olivia this morning and she said they were expecting some good ones this year. This is always a good test, they do a great job!

Gizmom

 

[jscunn]

Good luck, I was hoping you would share. Have a safe trip and keep us posted.

 

[gizmom]

Thanks Scott,

I wanted to ride over tomorrow but I have to go to the office My boss is so strict! When do you get your first report the bulls you took to north Alabama?

Gizmom

 

[jscunn]

We delivered the bulls on July 9, so we have the delivery report, warm up is complete a week from today.
Lots of good consignors, should be a good test. 24 Angus bulls this year.

 

[gizmom]

The warm up phase of the test has been completed, the report we received indicated that the bulls are all doing well and eating feed in the feed efficiency facility. They also stated that the quality of the bulls this year is exceptional with 101 bulls on the test. At arrival on July 29 the bulls averaged 823lbs. During the three weeks from arrival to initiation of the test the bulls gained 2.96lbs/day and now average 885 lb. The next weigh day is scheduled for September 17th.

Our bulls did fine during the warm up stage:

Test ID 1295 - Gizmo Regis 1314 991 904 Reg# 17844686 - Arrival weight 684 Start weight 760 ADG since arrival (lbs/d) 3.62 rank 37. This is an ET calf we purchased the embryos out of the Coleman program in Montana. We have four calves out of this mating three bulls and one heifer. We wanted to put this calf on test get more data.

Test ID 1296 - Gizmo Midland 1333 525 430 Reg# 17844599 - Arrival weight 756 Start weight 816 ADG since arrival (lbs/d) 2.86 rank 50. This is a calf out of our Pathfinder cow 525. His full sister in blood 811 made pathfinder status on her third calf two other maternal sisters are working in the herd one is a 2011 the other a 2012 calf so to young to really know how they are going to perform, what I can say is the 2011 took AI as a heifer then bred back AI for her second calf the 2012 took AI her first time through the chute. 525 and 811 have both taken AI every time they have been AI'd this is a powerful cow family. I used the very last straw of the Coleman Midland 430 semen I had in the tank for this mating, I really was trying to make me another 811 but since we have the bull I wanted to see how the bull side of this cow family performed. I really think he is going to be a cow maker.

Test ID 1329 - Gizmo EXT 1329 0709 6149 Reg# 17844737 - Arrival weight 732 Start weight 776 ADG since arrival 2.10 rank 71. This bull is out of a really nice Matrix daughter and our now deceased herd sire Coleman EXT 6149. This calf should make a really nice one the 6149 calves are thick, deep, big footed and docile.

Test ID 1337 - Gizmo FA 1337 658 0035 Reg# 17844590 - Arrival weight 688 start weight 790 ADG since arrival 4.86 rank 7. This is another ET calf out of our 658 donor. The 658 cow is just one of the never miss kind of cows we have flushed her four times twice to New Day, once to EXT and once to Final Answer all have worked really well. The cow is getting some age on her so we are keeping her open this year to flush her several more times. The plan is to flush to Final Answer again we really like the calves from this mating but we didn't get any heifers. We have two flush brothers to this calf at the farm and they are really nice.

I know they will juggle around a lot during the test they always do but though I would share what we know so far.

gizmom

 

[Workinonit Farm]

Sounds pretty good so far! Thanks for the update.

 

[gizmom]

Gizmom...thanks for the updates...I have a few questions if you don't mind? How do you get your bulls into such a test? Does it cost or is this a service the State performs? If bulls are sent to the test do they have to be sold? Lastly, can you explain how you guys use the data on your bulls to influence your future decision making? Anyway, I hope your bulls do great! I'm sure they do!

We nominate our bulls the test is open to any breeder, but the calves have to meet the test requirement http://nfrec.ifas.ufl.edu/fl_bull_test/ ... L_TEST.pdf The cost of the test is 850.00 per bull so it isn't cheap. You do not have to sell the bull that is up to the individual breeder last year we sold three but kept one to use on heifers. We do use the data to help us plan future breeding decisions or to see how a certain genetic line is working. I hope that answers the questions you have and I hope your right and they do great. I will post each time they are weighed good or bad they are what they are.

gizmom

 

[RegCowman]

Any red Simbrah in the FL bull test?

 

[gizmom]

Nope this year they have:

Charolais
Sim Angus
Simm
Hereford
Angus
Braford
Brahman

gizmom

 

[Chappydog]

At 850$ per bull do you really make any money by sending them to the test? That seems like a ton of money to put out, but that's just me

 

[RegCowman]

It is a lot of money -- for what they will spend down there. What I have noticed for years is that most of the bulls down there are mediocre at best and some breeders use the test station as a dumping ground for bulls that have little or no economic value. Normally, when we send a bull to the test station we do so to let them compete with others in their breed and other breeds then pull them out of the sale for Private treaty sales at home.

Next year we will send a Red Simbrah that ranks #1 in API nationally with 13 Trait Leading EPD's out of 15 total. He will be allowed to compete then pulled prior to the sale and sent to Genex- Baton Rouge. In order to not upset the applecart in the Texas area -- his semen will not be offered in the US except for the Carcass Merit Program. We are raising him specifically for the South American market that cares a bit more about performance and less about how well they prance in a show ring.

At 850$ per bull do you really make any money by sending them to the test? That seems like a ton of money to put out, but that's just me

 

[gizmom]

I would not say we make much, we actually make more selling them off the farm. But the data is good to have to help make decisions and to see how your cattle perform not just against your own herd but other breeders. I don't mean we use it as a competition against other breeders but we do use it as a measuring stick against other breeders, and if you are wanting to provide bulls that the commercial breeder wants you need to know as much as you can about your own program. It is very easy to get complacent when you walk out in your own pasture and look at your cattle and think wow they look really good, but your not comparing them next to anything other than your own cattle. Sometimes I ramble I hope I am saying this right but we want to ensure that our cattle are the right kind and that they work as well as any other program. We don't always sell all the bulls that we put on test sometimes we just bring the calf home to use but want the data that the test provides, so we have more information on the calves were raising out of the bull.

gizmom

 

[gizmom]

Well Reg Cowman it is nice to know my little raggamuffins will be standing in the pasture with royalty next year.

gizmom

 

[jscunn]

I would not say we make much, we actually make more selling them off the farm. But the data is good to have to help make decisions and to see how your cattle perform not just against your own herd but other breeders. I don't mean we use it as a competition against other breeders but we do use it as a measuring stick against other breeders, and if you are wanting to provide bulls that the commercial breeder wants you need to know as much as you can about your own program. It is very easy to get complacent when you walk out in your own pasture and look at your cattle and think wow they look really good, but your not comparing them next to anything other than your own cattle. Sometimes I ramble I hope I am saying this right but we want to ensure that our cattle are the right kind and that they work as well as any other program. We don't always sell all the bulls that we put on test sometimes we just bring the calf home to use but want the data that the test provides, so we have more information on the calves were raising out of the bull.

gizmom


Well Said..

 

[Chappydog]

Sounds like an ok plan to me got the business your in. I'm that commercial cow guy you were talking about

 

[gizmom]

Reg Cattleman
“It is a lot of money -- for what they will spend down there. What I have noticed for years is that most of the bulls down there are mediocre at best and some breeders use the test station as a dumping ground for bulls that have little or no economic value. Normally, when we send a bull to the test station we do so to let them compete with others in their breed and other breeds then pull them out of the sale for Private treaty sales at home.

Next year we will send a Red Simbrah that ranks #1 in API nationally with 13 Trait Leading EPD's out of 15 total. He will be allowed to compete then pulled prior to the sale and sent to Genex- Baton Rouge. In order to not upset the applecart in the Texas area -- his semen will not be offered in the US except for the Carcass Merit Program. We are raising him specifically for the South American market that cares a bit more about performance and less about how well they prance in a show ring.”

Ok I have to say I really tried to let this go I just couldn’t for a number of reasons, the first being that your statement is just wrong and to be honest an insult to the breeders that are participating in this sale. I look forward to seeing how your Red Simbrah does but have to question that since the rules state:
1. Bulls must be born between August 15 and December 31, 2013. (note for next year make that 2014)
I would have to guess that the calf you are talking about is less than 20 days old or not born yet. I would then have to say aren’t you counting your chickens before they hatch. I don’t give a rats behind what a calf’s EPD’s are they still have to perform and there is a whole lot of things that can go wrong prior to July 2015. I hope your calf is every bit as good as you expect him to be I just can’t see running other breeders down in order to promote what you are selling.
The test sets up criteria to insure that the bulls entered are performing within the herd they are developed in, and to call the sale a dumping ground is quite honestly just wrong and again an insult to all of us that are out there working hard to provide bulls that will work for our customers. In addition to the requirements mandated to allow a bull into the sale there is also requirements in place to be allowed to sell the bull at the completion of the test. If a bull hasn’t performed then they do not get to sell.
5. A bull should weigh 2.5 pounds per day of age when delivered to the test station. A transit shrink of 1% per hour of transit time will be allowed.
2. All bulls not eligible for the sale due to poor performance, disposition, structural soundness, incomplete performance data, unsatisfactory BSE, etc., must be removed from the test station, and all test costs paid within one week of notification.

gizmom

 

[jscunn]

Gizmom,

:clap:

Thanks for taking care of that, I didnt have the time tonight.. A 20 day old calf has a LONG way to go before he is a bull test candidate.. Maybe he is overly optimistic..

 

[gizmom]

The first 28 days of the test are completed last week. From the letter we received from Dr. Lamb the bulls are performing well and have adapted well to the diet with no bulls requiring treatment for metabolic issues. Overall, the bulls are consuming 19.5 lb of feed per day on a dry matter basis. For the first 28 days of the test, all bull have had an average daily gain of 2.50 lb/day, but ranged from 4.61 to 0.14 lb/day.

Our bulls are all over the board this round the report we received is a bit confusing because the letter said that the range was 4.61 pounds per day but our top bull shows a 28 day ADG of 4.64 so who knows he is showing an index ratio of 137. That would be the 1337 bull out of Final Answer and our donor 658.

Our second bull is down a ways with a 2.35 ADG and an index of 93 this is the 1329 calf out of Ronnie's favorite cow 0709 who is a BC Matrix daughter and our now deceased herd sire Coleman EXT 6149.

Our third bull is way on down the list with a 1.79 ADG and an index of 76 this is an ET calf out of the Coleman program in Montana.

Our fourth calf had a 1.14 ADG with an index of 67 this is the 1333 calf out of a Pathfinder dam who's full sister in blood also made Pathfinder status on her third calf.

It will be interesting to see how they shake out for the next weight which is scheduled for October 15th.

Gizmom