Wormer for fly control?

[Brute 23]

I worm every thing once a year, in a year like this where there is no grass they will probably all get it twice. If a cow is looking poor and can catch it I have no problem giving it another dose in between.

As for using worming med for flyes, I believe it has been covered.
-not economical
-builds a resistance
-other methods that work just as good or not better

I have better luck with the fly spray if I pour it on instead of spraying it out of a hand sprayer, but its not always an option.

 

[snickers]

how about ear tags for fly control? I haven't used them and have been researching if they work or not. I could use some feedback from people that use them and which is the best.

 

[brandonm_13]

Dang stupid back button on my mouse. Now I'll have to type this again.

Shortened version. Where I live you shouldn't mix diesel for the spray version. The cows get too hot, and the diesel burns their skin in the sun. The back rubs work well, but the misting seems to be too much. I've known producers who've tried it, and regretted it later. The lucky cows had a pond or a lot of shade to get to, but some didn't.

 

[spinandslide]

I was told the pour on can help in keeping the flys away..and I saw it in action when I used some pour on Ivermectin on my cow...flys dissapeared.

I dont know if Id reley on it as my only means of fly control..I use a permethin spray and my fly blocks.

 

[TexasBred]

I was told the pour on can help in keeping the flys away..and I saw it in action when I used some pour on Ivermectin on my cow...flys dissapeared.

I dont know if Id reley on it as my only means of fly control..I use a permethin spray and my fly blocks.

As I mentioned earlier....not the most cost effective way to handle pesky flies. Temporary limited fly control is more of a side benefit from a product which is primarily for internal parasaites. At $4 to $5 everytime you pour it on it can get expensive.

 

[spinandslide]

I was told the pour on can help in keeping the flys away..and I saw it in action when I used some pour on Ivermectin on my cow...flys dissapeared.

I dont know if Id reley on it as my only means of fly control..I use a permethin spray and my fly blocks.

As I mentioned earlier....not the most cost effective way to handle pesky flies. Temporary limited fly control is more of a side benefit from a product which is primarily for internal parasaites. At $4 to $5 everytime you pour it on it can get expensive.

Agree 100%..was a side effect that I didnt mind though ;-)

 

[gberry]

Thanks for the replies. You've given me some things to think about. I know that this is not the most expensive or least effective measure out there. We can basically keep the flies controlled on about 80 head for around $80 for the entire summer. For us, it definitely works better than spray for fly control although we haven't tried pour on fly control recently. It may be better. It's also quite a bit cheaper than any IGR mineral we've found.

I am curious about the resistance issue. We are treating a portion of the herd at the recommended dose, but not treating every animal. I suppose this could lead to resistance although I am not sure. Is it really any different than treating one "every time they have to be run through the chute for any reason?" I suppose that the remaining animals in the herd could be receiving a sub-therapeutic dose just from close contact with the treated animals, but I'm not sure. I'll have to think about it a little more.

 

[TexasBred]

Thanks for the replies. You've given me some things to think about. I know that this is not the most expensive or least effective measure out there. We can basically keep the flies controlled on about 80 head for around $80 for the entire summer. For us, it definitely works better than spray for fly control although we haven't tried pour on fly control recently. It may be better. It's also quite a bit cheaper than any IGR mineral we've found.

I am curious about the resistance issue. We are treating a portion of the herd at the recommended dose, but not treating every animal. I suppose this could lead to resistance although I am not sure. Is it really any different than treating one "every time they have to be run through the chute for any reason?" I suppose that the remaining animals in the herd could be receiving a sub-therapeutic dose just from close contact with the treated animals, but I'm not sure. I'll have to think about it a little more.

You can worm a cow with pour on type wormer for $1.00 per head?? What are you using??? Does it work on "worms"??? ;-)

 

[spinandslide]

Thanks for the replies. You've given me some things to think about. I know that this is not the most expensive or least effective measure out there. We can basically keep the flies controlled on about 80 head for around $80 for the entire summer. For us, it definitely works better than spray for fly control although we haven't tried pour on fly control recently. It may be better. It's also quite a bit cheaper than any IGR mineral we've found.

I am curious about the resistance issue. We are treating a portion of the herd at the recommended dose, but not treating every animal. I suppose this could lead to resistance although I am not sure. Is it really any different than treating one "every time they have to be run through the chute for any reason?" I suppose that the remaining animals in the herd could be receiving a sub-therapeutic dose just from close contact with the treated animals, but I'm not sure. I'll have to think about it a little more.

You can worm a cow with pour on type wormer for $1.00 per head?? What are you using??? Does it work on "worms"??? ;-)

Im wondering the same thing?

 

[gberry]

Iveron pour on available from tractor supply for $70 for 5 liters (I may have overestimated the cost in my original post). Privermectin 10 liters available for $104.10 from Jeffers.

 

[jerry27150]

i use iver-on twice through the summer when flies start getting bad toward the end of june & again around the end of august. i use guard-star if flies get bad in between. it kills most flies for 5-6 weeks at a time ,plus kills internal parasites so calves grow better. have to watch the 48 day withdrawal time though

 

[gberry]

i use iver-on twice through the summer when flies start getting bad toward the end of june & again around the end of august. i use guard-star if flies get bad in between. it kills most flies for 5-6 weeks at a time ,plus kills internal parasites so calves grow better. have to watch the 48 day withdrawal time though

This is what I've found and the reason I started the thread. I discussed a few of the issues brought up here with our vet today. He doesn't think treating a portion of the herd is necessarily more likely to result in resistance than treating the whole herd. Also, liver flukes are not endemic to this area.

 

[backhoeboogie]

We worm twice a year. On bad years they get sprayed every six weeks and I use a mild soap to help it stick. There's no way I would use diesel in this climate. Changing pastures helps too. There's huge herds of cows all around me and across the river from me. It would help if we all treated at the same time but some never treat or worm.

The right kind of fly tags are very effective but you should change types routinely.

Pasture rotation is one of the best things you can do for all parasites.

 

[TexasBred]

Iveron pour on available from tractor supply for $70 for 5 liters (I may have overestimated the cost in my original post). Privermectin 10 liters available for $104.10 from Jeffers.

Wow that's cheap enough....so cheap I'd probably be a bit concerned about it. But at that price I'd probably worm monthly. The same size Ivomec would probably be over $250 now.

 

[cypressfarms]

This is what I've found and the reason I started the thread. I discussed a few of the issues brought up here with our vet today. He doesn't think treating a portion of the herd is necessarily more likely to result in resistance than treating the whole herd. Also, liver flukes are not endemic to this area.

The life cycle of most flies and most worms require the passage of larvae through the "poop" of the animal. Flies, as an example, will develop resistance to pesticides as time goes on. Each new generation of flies hatched that are exposed to the pesticide increases the likelihood that flies will develop a resistance. Once a fly develops resistance, then that fly will multiply profusely unchecked. This is the reason that people rotate active ingredients, and is also why this is more of an issue in warmer climates. By using a wormer as a fly control you are basically exposing two parasites to one chemical, increasing the likelihood that both will develop resistance. You are also - if applying the way you mentioned - exposing the flies/worms to a constant but partial dose of the chemical. Again, each succesive generation exposed to a chemical increases the chances that parasites will develop resistance. Horn flies, as an example, go through a complete life cycle (egg to egg) every 10-14 days. If you had a constant exposure to a chemical many more generations of flies have a chance to develop resistance than if you wormed two times per year. If you don't believe that parasites can develop resistance, ask any sheep or goat farmer.

 

[TexasBred]

And well managed herds with a good nutrition and herd health program can develop immunity to many of the internal parasites that infect other herds.

 

[gberry]

Cypressfarms, I hear what you are saying. I probably have more concern about resistance than most and certainly more than the beef industry as a whole, but I don't know that I follow your logic. I don't understand how treating each cow in your herd for parasites (with the added benefit of fly control) once a year will lead to accelerated resistance among parasites. I think you would be more likely to develop resistance by treating twice a year.

I can't figure how treating cow A would increase the likelihood of resistant parasites in cow B unless you think that the treating cow A somehow partially treats cow B. I agree that would lead to faster development of resistance. As long as the treatment is applied at the appropriate dose and assuming it is not somehow transferred to the other cattle, I don't think this would happen.

As far as the flies developing resistance, I'm not sure as they are gone within 48 hours and don't return for about 6 weeks. As you pointed out the life cycle is 10-14 days. That would be about 4 generations of flies. I actually think the flies just leave and don't return for 6 weeks as there won't be any flies on cattle which are nearby but not in the same pasture.

 

[S&S Farms]

For those of you who like to worm your cows yearly, you could treat 25-30% of the herd at a time and control flies through the summer without any extra costs strictly for fly control. Anyone see any problem with this?

Yes, I see a glaring problem with this. One of the biggest problems with effective medecines is the mis-use of them. By using the wormer as a insecticide you could conceivably develop parasite resistantance to your wormer very fast. What you are suggesting is a "continual" type administration to have an added benefit of fly control. My advice would be not to do this. There are too many effective ways to control flies without risking problems with your wormer. Parasites will naturally develop a resistance to medicines over several years dependant upon the parasite's life cycle; except in your case they will do it much more quickly because of the constant application. I just wouldn't chance it. If someone thinks I'm way off base, please chime in, but many of our medecines of today are not as effective as they used to be - and one of the reasons is because of incorrect dosage and mis-use.

As of now there is no evidence of parasite resistance in cattle. Yes I know there is one company trying to scare people into usiong there product but according to scientist and vets that I know it is not as issue here in Kansas. Goats on the other hand it is a major problem. The best way to check is to do a fecal egg count your vet can help you with the protical. We worm twice a year with a generic and have not had any problems yet. The wormer is a good in the fall at controlling lice also. Actually this year we wormed going to grass and then wormed when we preg checked 60 days later and will worm coming off of grass.

Jeff

 

[alftn]

Does anyone here,know how ivem works? How can anything become resistint to it????

 

[dun]

Does anyone here,know how ivem works? How can anything become resistint to it????

I would guess it's just like how everything else becomes resistant to something. It may receive a weakend dose (very few things are actaully 100% effective), if it lives it will be resistant and can cause it's offspring to have a ressistance.