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<blockquote data-quote="Frankie" data-source="post: 627960" data-attributes="member: 13"><p><strong>If you believe that EPDs are that easy to manipulate, how can you put faith in them at all?</strong></p><p></p><p>Angus EPDs aren't easy to manipulate. I don't know about Herefords. No matter how many calves are reported, the Angus Assn holds accuracy at .85 until an animal has been used widely across the breed. It's easy enough to wait until a bull gets an accuracy above .85 before we use him. If the data is being skewed, it'll be noticable by the time a bull gets to .90 accuracy.</p><p></p><p></p><p><strong>Why? And what does "in line" mean? Some of the best cows in the Hereford breed have EPDs that are below breed average in several traits.</strong></p><p></p><p>"in line" means different things to different people. We stress weaning weights because most people who buy our bulls sell their calves at the sale barn. Because we run our cattle on native grass, we watch the milk EPD. What makes a Hereford cow "best" if she has below breed average EPDs? </p><p></p><p><strong>I totally disagree! If you don't know everything about the lines and who to trust, you really need to find out those things first. You don't yet know whether you can trust the cattle and the people behind the numbers, but you can trust the numbers? That makes no sense to me!</strong> </p><p></p><p>Not necessarily. What difference does it make whether a bull is from the New Design line or the EXT line or the 5175 line if he has the performance, numbers and phenotype that you like? Sure, talk to the breeder and decide if you're comfortable with him and his program. I guess you could ask for a DNA test on every bull to be sure he's what the breeder says, but if you're that suspicious you probably should get into another business. :roll:</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Frankie, post: 627960, member: 13"] [b]If you believe that EPDs are that easy to manipulate, how can you put faith in them at all?[/b] Angus EPDs aren't easy to manipulate. I don't know about Herefords. No matter how many calves are reported, the Angus Assn holds accuracy at .85 until an animal has been used widely across the breed. It's easy enough to wait until a bull gets an accuracy above .85 before we use him. If the data is being skewed, it'll be noticable by the time a bull gets to .90 accuracy. [b]Why? And what does "in line" mean? Some of the best cows in the Hereford breed have EPDs that are below breed average in several traits.[/b] "in line" means different things to different people. We stress weaning weights because most people who buy our bulls sell their calves at the sale barn. Because we run our cattle on native grass, we watch the milk EPD. What makes a Hereford cow "best" if she has below breed average EPDs? [b]I totally disagree! If you don't know everything about the lines and who to trust, you really need to find out those things first. You don't yet know whether you can trust the cattle and the people behind the numbers, but you can trust the numbers? That makes no sense to me![/b] Not necessarily. What difference does it make whether a bull is from the New Design line or the EXT line or the 5175 line if he has the performance, numbers and phenotype that you like? Sure, talk to the breeder and decide if you're comfortable with him and his program. I guess you could ask for a DNA test on every bull to be sure he's what the breeder says, but if you're that suspicious you probably should get into another business. :roll: [/QUOTE]
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