Choctaw Chief 373

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jdg

jdg

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Anybody ever come across any direct descendants of Choctaw Chief 373, considered one of the foundation bulls of the Red Angus breed? I saw that Halfmann down in texas sold a few bulls last year out of teenage cows that were grandsons. I know he seems to be lined up in some of the early good pedigrees of the RA breed.
 
373 and his sire Choctaw Chief were indeed foundation sires along with a number of others. Considering the time frame, living direct sons/dtrs of the former are unlikely at this point unless semen/eggs have been stored. Wouldn't be surprised if someone has semen on both 373 & Chief. Vast majority of my foundation RA trace back to Chief genetics.
 
I have friends with 373 semen that are interested in ET work utilizing the bull. Was wondering what people thought of him, in consideration of a potential partnership. Wanted as much info to know what people thought of him or his direct progeny, and what he did or did not offer the breed.
 
Appears to be two photos still in circulation at what I'm guessing were taken at youth and maturity. Not surprisingly, the latter depicts him as more impressive than the former. All things considered, for a 65 model beef bull 373's 3,241 recorded progeny is astounding and especially in light of the AAA's stance.
jdg...could be wrong but probably a needle in a hay stack finding contemporary & savvy breeders still utilizing up close Chiga genetics. No question 373 likely had his faults but his remarkable individual performance for that era and subsequent heavy use for decades is nonetheless impressive.
 
jdg said:
Anybody ever come across any direct descendants of Choctaw Chief 373, considered one of the foundation bulls of the Red Angus breed? I saw that Halfmann down in texas sold a few bulls last year out of teenage cows that were grandsons. I know he seems to be lined up in some of the early good pedigrees of the RA breed.
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My name is mike norby I am the owner of kiowa red angus that will use semen directly from Choctaw chief 373 I have finally found someone who feels competent in using my ancient ampoules that I have. I have identified a cow in my herd that is chief line, bread, top, and bottom the top side to Leachman Midland, heavy weight, the bottom side, three generations back 2373. The cow is 10 years old. She has never missed a Kevin opportunity. She has only had one heifer calf, and none of her calves have ever gotten sick. Her bag is perfect. Her feet are very good confirmation perfect in my eyes, and when you talk about fear deficiency, she can live on ice and air, and remain in a very good body condition. Score we hope all goes well and we will market semen in the future out of any bull calves that we deem good enough for our herd. Then they are good enough for your herd.
 
Welcome to the forum @Mike norby . I like red angus although most of the buyers in this area can only see one color... BLACK... will be interested in seeing how things work out for you... stick around.
And if you go to the top right and click on your name, go down to account details, and put your general area in, you might find some of the information more geared to your area... helps to know where people are... state, general area... and it will show up under your avatar with location...
Thanks
 
Good luck Mike. Let us know how the breeding goes. Being from the SE, hair coat is an interest to me.
 
jdg said:
Good luck Mike. Let us know how the breeding goes. Being from the SE, hair coat is an interest to me.
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We were able to get 15 number one eggs Will you put 10 eggs in reseps that are out of my heard and we froze five the technician that did the work for us commented on the mobility of the semen itself. He hasn't seen that good and mobility and modern-day semen that he's checked. He said it was very very good. He was very surprised because of the age of it of how good the quality still remain. Sometimes I wonder if we are going backwards with our new technology I have used semen in the past that I had Barton from ABS and it was no good. I will keep you updated. We're very hopeful will get a few calves next spring , we have sent DNA samples into red Angus because evidently I have been told that and read that there is no DNA samples on file for 373 and we have also sent the Jacen samples to neogen for testing as well with the Angus gold test I believe it is I want to see what I can learn ahead of time to back up what I already know with the Cattle that I currently have in there. Evidently was an article printed that other breeders are going backwards in time to correct some of the mistakes that have been made, and as some of us have seen growth, growth growth is not always the answer , I feel that too many years, the industry has been driven by a computer program and the newest and latest and greatest silver bullet that cures all problems. Well, I believe that there were cattle in the past that were overlooked because they were an optimum, functionable and profitable, and now with the declining numbers in the cattle herd Cattle that were not efficient and profitable or function are no longer here but once again, they will be breeding for growth, growth and growth because we have to get beef made as fast as we can without looking at the consequences involved when you look at the DNA test for cardiac pulmonary heart disease I think that's the correct term we find that they only collected one piece of data. The ones that died. I had had numerous conversations with the individuals involved in the test and where the test was conducted. Needless to say they no longer want to talk to me. They have made up their mind with their single piece of data, the AA,AA Jeanne , well when you do DNA testing your phone, a large percentage of the English cattle have this genetic sequence as I tried to talk to these people the data that needed to be collected along with this is dry manner conversion average daily gains growth curve, and I leave this the very last growth curve we know has red Angus breeders red. Angus has a slower growth curve than the modern black genetics, but these cattle grow in spurts naturally, therefore we do not have this huge problem with the heart issue, and especially in the older, genetic cattle I have found with all the years I have fed cattle out an optimum , I look for start to finish putting forward cattle in the feedlot and coming out at around live weight 1320 average daily gain I use is 3.25. Here's the kicker here's profitability dry matter conversion average 6.25 when industry average runs between 7.6 and 7.8, and I have seen feed sheets close out sheets and a hell of a lot of red ink on cattle in that perimeter And then the difference between a 1600 pound fat steer with his high number high daily game one set of papers I seen $250 Reddick my stairs, 120 black ink. It all comes down who pays who the difference in the growth curve's in relationship to the longevity of the cattle but this is just my opinion mine alone the proofs in the pudding it's the cows in the pasture
 
I totally agree. That is why I decided to do this project. I have done jeans are testing in the past, but at the end of the day, the proof is in the pudding when you put fat cattle on a grid, that is what determines true value of your animal, and that is where I believe the industry needs to go and to do this we must identify the gene pool that will make these animals and that is the foundation of what I'm working for with this project I do in chief line bread And the characteristics that I desire are within this bloodline, there are other bloodlines as well, that work in conjunction but I have the opportunity to do this I think, like-minded people are the same. We look at real world, cattle, not numbers, manufactured the silver bullet the one shot wonder whatever it may be because at the end of the day we are making beef and cows. Thank you.
 

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