Transitioning to starter feed

[Barnyard Chaos]

Please help me understand the process to transition my bottle calves to grain, hay and pasture. I have two, heifer and steer, at nearly 9 weeks old. Backstory is the steer's mother had mastitis; heifer's mother was a neighbor's old cow with huge udders dragging the ground. Lucky me, I got the honor of raising them both on the bottle. They're two days apart in age, beef cattle, but I intend to raise the heifer to be a milk cow for us. I've started training her to wear a harness. Steer will be going to Camp Frigidaire.

I finally got them to take starter feed on their own a couple of weeks ago, after about a month of handfeeding them a little at a time. In the last few days, their intake has taken a sharp uptick. They love it. So today counts the third day in a row they've taken about 3-4# each. It's also the third day I've cut their milk back to half a bottle in the morning, full bottle at night. They are grazing some and taking a little hay. Tomorrow, I plan to cut back to half a bottle morning and night for a few days and increase the feed. When they're eating 5-6# a day each, I'll drop to half a bottle in the morning only for a few days, then stop the bottle and plenty of free-choice starter/grower/grain/something. Does this sound about right???

My question is about the starter feed, and transitioning to grain mix, then to pasture and hay. I can't seem to find a good guide on when this is best - much of what I read is too technical, or geared to dairy cattle or larger producers. I'm feeding them Purina Startena, but read that should be transitioned to a pelletized feed/grain mix by about 8 weeks. So tomorrow, I'm off to the feed store, again.

What do you recommend? A grower feed like Accuration, or something else? Protein content? Mix with what - corn chops, or something more? How long do I keep them on the pelletized starter or grower/grain mix? At what point is it safe to turn them out to pasture with the rest of our cows?

 

[MurraysMutts]

Your plan above sounds solid!

As far as feed. I've used calf starter for a couple months. 16or18% I think. Then I transition to half 14% creep and half honey grain or high grain sweet feed.

They will need to be big enough and have enough age on em to transition to grass only. Hard to describe.

By 8 months, they SHOULD be OK.

@Buck Randall
has a guide on feed quantity intake to wean completely off milk. IIRC, your there. I bet he will pop in.


I spoil mine btw. I've got 2 now that have never missed a twice a day feeding. And they are both well over a year old. One goes to freezer camp late this fall.

 

[MurraysMutts]

Bottle calf! Some say I'm crazy...

But it keeps me from going insane... Found this lil gal a while back. Turns out my biggest cow had twin heifers and she was left behind. She was very lucky to be found even. I was out on the 4wheeler and just stopped and shut it off. Let out a big moooooo like I sometimes do, and she popped up...

www.cattletoday.com

This thread will show a timeline as to what I do...

 

[MurraysMutts]

Any pictures of the lil farts?

 

[Buck Randall]

Please help me understand the process to transition my bottle calves to grain, hay and pasture. I have two, heifer and steer, at nearly 9 weeks old. Backstory is the steer's mother had mastitis; heifer's mother was a neighbor's old cow with huge udders dragging the ground. Lucky me, I got the honor of raising them both on the bottle. They're two days apart in age, beef cattle, but I intend to raise the heifer to be a milk cow for us. I've started training her to wear a harness. Steer will be going to Camp Frigidaire.

I finally got them to take starter feed on their own a couple of weeks ago, after about a month of handfeeding them a little at a time. In the last few days, their intake has taken a sharp uptick. They love it. So today counts the third day in a row they've taken about 3-4# each. It's also the third day I've cut their milk back to half a bottle in the morning, full bottle at night. They are grazing some and taking a little hay. Tomorrow, I plan to cut back to half a bottle morning and night for a few days and increase the feed. When they're eating 5-6# a day each, I'll drop to half a bottle in the morning only for a few days, then stop the bottle and plenty of free-choice starter/grower/grain/something. Does this sound about right???

My question is about the starter feed, and transitioning to grain mix, then to pasture and hay. I can't seem to find a good guide on when this is best - much of what I read is too technical, or geared to dairy cattle or larger producers. I'm feeding them Purina Startena, but read that should be transitioned to a pelletized feed/grain mix by about 8 weeks. So tomorrow, I'm off to the feed store, again.

What do you recommend? A grower feed like Accuration, or something else? Protein content? Mix with what - corn chops, or something more? How long do I keep them on the pelletized starter or grower/grain mix? At what point is it safe to turn them out to pasture with the rest of our cows?

You're on the right track. Leave them on the starter feed for at least a month after weaning - you don't want to change anything to make the weaning process more stressful than it has to be. After that you can transition them to a grain mix; keep it around 15% protein. They can fend for themselves on forage after they're at least 6 months old and 400 lbs, assuming that you have good quality pasture.

 

[Barnyard Chaos]

Any pictures of the lil farts?

Of course! Glad to show them off.....


This is Missy laying down, Junior standing. Took these photos this morning, shortly after their morning bottle.


Missy, my sweet girl.


Junior getting a drink


Missy in the barn. She's had some mild scours for the last few days, and appears a bit bloated this morning.

 

[MurraysMutts]

I've had good luck with the big scour pills the vet gives me.
I forget the name once again. But it clears em right up!
@TCRanch knows the name of em.
Something Something cattle bolus?

 

[Barnyard Chaos]

I've had good luck with the big scour pills the vet gives me.
I forget the name once again. But it clears em right up!
@TCRanch knows the name of em.
Something Something cattle bolus?

Thank you - I have something around here, a powder mix to add to their bottle; just remembered. I'll give it to her this evening.

 

[Lucky_P]

Most of the information out there is geared toward dairy heifer development... for a reason. Beef bottle/bucket calves are a minor thing, and something of an anomaly (and yes, I've raised quite a few through the years). If you treat your beef bottle calves like a dairy heifer, they'll grow off well - and if they're heifers, they'll probably make productive beef cows. You may spend more on a steer than you really have to, but I have no idea if it'll pay off in the long run.

Back in the Dark Ages, when we were raising dairy calves, I tried to get all steers weaned by 4, or at most, 6 weeks of age... heifers I would bottle feed on out to 8 weeks. Bottle feeding milk replacer is the most labor-intensive and expensive part of raising a bottle calf.
Every time I fed, or even if I just passed by, from Day One, I'd cram a handful of calf starter in their mouths, and kept FRESH calf starter in front of them at all times. Once the steers were consuming 1.5-2 pounds of starter per day, I quit the bottle altogether, and rapidly upped their grain ration to 5 pounds daily ASAP. Usually turned them out into a grass lot during the day to allow them to start picking a little grass, too.

Your calves look pretty good. I agree with Buck. Just be sure to keep them on a quality 15+% starter/grower ration. A growing calf needs the extra protein and mineral supplementation a grower ration is formulated with. I've seen some wrecks when folks followed well-meaning, but ignorant neighbor's advice to feed 10% horse/mule feed... calves got out to about 400 lbs and started having pathologic fractures of long bones and vertebrae, because the Ca content/ratio was fine for an old horse in maintenance mode, but totally unsuitable for a growing calf.

 

[Barnyard Chaos]

Correction: It's not "scours" really. Just loose stools, no bad smell, runny & brown but not watery. I think I need to cut the milk back sooner rather than later, give some electrolytes maybe with 1 dose immodium if the scours remedy doesn't work by morning.

 

[Travlr]

Correction: It's not "scours" really. Just loose stools, no bad smell, runny & brown but not watery. I think I need to cut the milk back sooner rather than later, give some electrolytes maybe with 1 dose immodium if the scours remedy doesn't work by morning.

Nice couple of calves...

So the big question is... why do you think pounds of grain is a good idea for young calves? I'm not surprised at all that your calf has loose bowels.

It isn't necessary to feed young calves heavy grain rations... It is not unusual at all to raise healthy calves on grass with only enough grain to keep them friendly and give them some nutrition that they would otherwise be missing by being on a cow.

When we are getting an animal ready to slaughter... we "finish" the animal on grain for a couple of months. That's why they call it "finishing", because you are feeding the animal grain to lay fat on before eating it. Before that and over time, a heavy amount of grain is both unnecessary and could damage the liver of the animal. Dairy cows get a lot of grain when they a lactating, producing more milk than beef cattle. Otherwise grain is mainly to keep the calf docile.

Food is not love.

 

[MurraysMutts]

Nice couple of calves...

So the big question is... why do you think pounds of grain is a good idea for young calves? I'm not surprised at all that your calf has loose bowels.

It isn't necessary to feed young calves heavy grain rations... It is not unusual at all to raise healthy calves on grass with only enough grain to keep them friendly and give them some nutrition that they would otherwise be missing by being on a cow.

When we are getting an animal ready to slaughter... we "finish" the animal on grain for a couple of months. That's why they call it "finishing", because you are feeding the animal grain to lay fat on before eating it. Before that and over time, a heavy amount of grain is both unnecessary and could damage the liver of the animal. Dairy cows get a lot of grain when they a lactating, producing more milk than beef cattle. Otherwise grain is mainly to keep the calf docile.

Food is not love.

Not a heavy ration of grain. Good grass is prefered.
But getting them off milk sooner requires grain to supplement nutritional needs the milk gave them. Grain is cheaper than milk.

But again....
My calves are usually winter projects and fresh spring flush grass isn't an option for me.

 

[Travlr]

Not a heavy ration of grain. Good grass is prefered.
But getting them off milk sooner requires grain to supplement nutritional needs the milk gave them. Grain is cheaper than milk.

But again....
My calves are usually winter projects and fresh spring flush grass isn't an option for me.

Do you feed them six pounds a day? Or "free choice" starter/grower/grain/something... which sounds like it could be more than 6#?

 

[MurraysMutts]

@Travlr
I'd have to go back and look. But I think the smaller ones got about 3 pounds a day. Increasing to about 5 or 6 until spring.
Total weight split it into 2 feedings. One in the morning.
One in the evening.
And of coarse best free choice hay I have. Usually just good Bermuda.
I toyed with some alfalfa a bit.
I actually think if one could feed good alfalfa hay, the feed required would be very little.

Neighbor friend did his 2 heifer on milk for far longer than I did. Milk and free choice Bermuda. I couldn't see much difference in size aside from his calves may have been a touch more pot bellied. And he spend a LOT more on milk replacer.

So I think the grain helps with the pot belliedness and saves money

 

[TCRanch]

I've had good luck with the big scour pills the vet gives me.
I forget the name once again. But it clears em right up!
@TCRanch knows the name of em.
Something Something cattle bolus?

Sustain III Calf Boluses. They're my go-to for scours & foot rot in the pasture.

Sustain III Calf Bolus Bimeda - Sulfa Antibiotics | Oral Medications | Farm

Free Shipping on most orders over $49. Great Low Price. Sulfamethazine in a sustained release bolus provides treatment level for 3 days in beef and non-lactating dairy cattle. Effective against foot rot, shipping fever, calf diphtheria, acute metritis caused by organisms sensitive to...

www.valleyvet.com

 

[MurraysMutts]

Sustain III Calf Boluses. They're my go-to for scours & foot rot in the pasture.

Sustain III Calf Bolus Bimeda - Sulfa Antibiotics | Oral Medications | Farm

Free Shipping on most orders over $49. Great Low Price. Sulfamethazine in a sustained release bolus provides treatment level for 3 days in beef and non-lactating dairy cattle. Effective against foot rot, shipping fever, calf diphtheria, acute metritis caused by organisms sensitive to...

www.valleyvet.com

Yeah!!
That's the ones.
Sustain lll
Sustain lll
Sustain lll

There. I've said it 3 times. Bound to remember now!

Those things are like magic! One n done. One treatment. 2 pills for 100lb calf.
Straightens their guts right out!

 

[Barnyard Chaos]

So the big question is... why do you think pounds of grain is a good idea for young calves? I'm not surprised at all that your calf has loose bowels.

It isn't necessary to feed young calves heavy grain rations... It is not unusual at all to raise healthy calves on grass with only enough grain to keep them friendly and give them some nutrition that they would otherwise be missing by being on a cow.

I'm going by instructions on the back of the bag of Land O' Lakes calf milk replacer and Purina Startena starter feed (which contains grain), and articles I've read from several legitimate sources on how to wean bottle-fed calves (university extensions, gov't articles, experienced farmers). All of them say the calves can be weaned when they're eating 3-lbs of starter feed a day for three days in a row. Once weaned, increase the feed ..... and that's where I got lost and came to this board to ask questions.

Thank you for your response, I took it to heart - but I'm curious: Are you successful turning 9-week old bottle calves to pasture? How can they digest enough nutrients and protein from grass, when they are still developing the rumen? Are Purina (and others) just trying to sell more grain when the calves don't need it?

My experience is very limited, I'll admit. I do know a family member who raised a calf on the bottle, and turned it out to pasture at 3 months. No grain, no starter feed. At 2 years old, she weighs maybe 600 pounds. Sad.

 

[Travlr]

I'm going by instructions on the back of the bag of Land O' Lakes calf milk replacer and Purina Startena starter feed (which contains grain), and articles I've read from several legitimate sources on how to wean bottle-fed calves (university extensions, gov't articles, experienced farmers). All of them say the calves can be weaned when they're eating 3-lbs of starter feed a day for three days in a row. Once weaned, increase the feed ..... and that's where I got lost and came to this board to ask questions.

Thank you for your response, I took it to heart - but I'm curious: Are you successful turning 9-week old bottle calves to pasture? How can they digest enough nutrients and protein from grass, when they are still developing the rumen? Are Purina (and others) just trying to sell more grain when the calves don't need it?

My experience is very limited, I'll admit. I do know a family member who raised a calf on the bottle, and turned it out to pasture at 3 months. No grain, no starter feed. At 2 years old, she weighs maybe 600 pounds. Sad.

I'm not suggesting no grain... but six pounds sounds like a lot, especially for a small calf. Hot feed can cause liver abscesses. You are replacing mother's milk, not trying to fatten the calf until it weighs 900 pounds or so.

And I would never feed free choice grain.

 

[Lucky_P]

Travlr.
We're not talking about feeding 6 pounds of whole shelled or cracked corn to a weaned bottle calf. We're talking a grain/protein pellet starter/grower ration with 16-20% crude protein. It's not a 'hot' feed.

Nutritional research has shown that the VFAs(volatile fatty acids) produced during the rumen fermentation of grain products are much more effective in helping those baby calves develop functional rumen papillae than forages... most heifer development programs, anymore, don't recommend feeding any forages prior to weaning. Many dairy heifers these days don't see any hay or grass until they are 8 weeks or age, or older. Young calves can't digest hay or even gain a great deal of nutrition from fresh green grass... that's why we often see those potbellied, light-muscled, rough-coated little bottle calves... they've been fed, or allowed access to, too much forage/hay early on - they can't digest it, but at the same time, they're filled up on it, so they are less able to consume adequate amounts of more readily-digestible feeds (grain-based rations), and they don't meet their growth potential.

BC - a 9 wk old weaned bottle calf may 'survive', just turned out on good pasture, but they won't grow well. They still need supplemental energy and protein - in the form of a good quality calf grower ration.
Even though I used to wean steers at 4 weeks - once they were consuming at least 2# of calf-starter ration per day - I continued to feed a grower ration, in addition to whatever they were getting from their daily grazing. You can't starve a profit out of them!
I'm a veterinarian, but not a nutritionist. If I were going to be raising dairy calves again (I AM NOT!!!), I'd be needing to acquaint myself with the advances that have been made in nutritional management in the last 35 years. A lot has changed!

 

[Travlr]

Travlr.
We're not talking about feeding 6 pounds of whole shelled or cracked corn to a weaned bottle calf. We're talking a grain/protein pellet starter/grower ration with 16-20% crude protein. It's not a 'hot' feed.

Nutritional research has shown that the VFAs(volatile fatty acids) produced during the rumen fermentation of grain products are much more effective in helping those baby calves develop functional rumen papillae than forages... most heifer development programs, anymore, don't recommend feeding any forages prior to weaning. Many dairy heifers these days don't see any hay or grass until they are 8 weeks or age, or older. Young calves can't digest hay or even gain a great deal of nutrition from fresh green grass... that's why we often see those potbellied, light-muscled, rough-coated little bottle calves... they've been fed, or allowed access to, too much forage/hay early on - they can't digest it, but at the same time, they're filled up on it, so they are less able to consume adequate amounts of more readily-digestible feeds (grain-based rations), and they don't meet their growth potential.

BC - a 9 wk old weaned bottle calf may 'survive', just turned out on good pasture, but they won't grow well. They still need supplemental energy and protein - in the form of a good quality calf grower ration.
Even though I used to wean steers at 4 weeks - once they were consuming at least 2# of calf-starter ration per day - I continued to feed a grower ration, in addition to whatever they were getting from their daily grazing. You can't starve a profit out of them!
I'm a veterinarian, but not a nutritionist. If I were going to be raising dairy calves again (I AM NOT!!!), I'd be needing to acquaint myself with the advances that have been made in nutritional management in the last 35 years. A lot has changed!

Thanks for the explanation...

The take away I'm getting is that you weaned your steers from milk(replacer?) and were feeding them TWO pounds per day with small amounts of supplements as they got larger. So not 6 pounds on small calves, and not free choice grain.
There's another thread here with someone asking why their 1000# steers suddenly stopped eating... and they had been feeding 25# of grain per animal and still had sixty days to feed them. (Assuming I'm remembering all the particulars accurately)
My personal experience is that feed is used to make up for poor genetic selection. When I finish my own beef I choose an animal that will finish choice on less grain. Those are the animals I breed and raise. I don't breed for animals I have to supplement and pound the grain to.