Longhorn Cross

[piedmontese]

I'm surprised at all the positive remarks concerning longhorns. I have seen them bashed pretty hard on here n the past. I would try a few if I get the chance to pick up some decent ones. Most of them I see around here are little and look like they won't have enough milk. When I do get a few I will either use a saler or Hereford bull.

 

[Bigfoot]

I'm surprised at all the positive remarks concerning longhorns. I have seen them bashed pretty hard on here n the past. I would try a few if I get the chance to pick up some decent ones. Most of them I see around here are little and look like they won't have enough milk. When I do get a few I will either use a saler or Hereford bull.

I'm not a fan, but they do have a place. I guess like all breeds. I've noticed the ones that bash them have never had them. Funny how that works.

 

[TXBobcat]

We've crossed Longhorn cows with an Angus bull. From our calves, about 55% were completely black hided, with the remaining being black with some type of white markings on them. Some of calves have small horns (scurs), and at weaning, we dehorn any we keep (i.e replacement heifers and feeder steers). De-horning method is a Barnes dehorner.

From the replacements (LH x Angus), we have bred them back to an Angus again, for a 75% Angus X 25% LH calf. Haven't really had enough of those yet to make a good judgement, but as others say, even those calves can still have some white on them.

I do like the LH X Angus cows, in that they seem to make a good moderate sized mother cow. I would like to try crossing the LH X Angus cows with a Charolais bull to produce a terminal calf that is 50% Char, 25% Angus, 25% LH. Any thoughts on that?

 

[HDRider]

I'm surprised at all the positive remarks concerning longhorns. I have seen them bashed pretty hard on here n the past. I would try a few if I get the chance to pick up some decent ones. Most of them I see around here are little and look like they won't have enough milk. When I do get a few I will either use a saler or Hereford bull.

That's why I started off by saying don't jump on me cause I had seen so much LH bashers. I appreciate everyone posting.

I have to think shipping and handling (chutes, head gates, and such) is difficult with them big horns,

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

I am the first to admit that I am a rookie in beef production but I was born and raised around dairy cows. Now that I am able to have cattle as a hobby, I can tell you without a doubt that there is money to be made using longhorn influenced mother cows, at least around here. I can and have bought bred LH cows and heifers for less than 1/2 price of typical beef breeds and with very little marketing have sold the calves for more than I paid for the cow. I have made more money than I ever expected from my longhorn cows and for me it really is just a hobby.

Hey OhioSteve, how ya been?

I've been good TT, just real busy. I've really been struggling with what to do with all the money I've made from my longhorns. Me and my girl just got back from the Bahamas but we've still got way too much money left, we're thinking of heading to Nashville.

Come on down, with the weather we're having you'll never know you left Ohio!

 

[heath]

I'm surprised at all the positive remarks concerning longhorns. I have seen them bashed pretty hard on here n the past. I would try a few if I get the chance to pick up some decent ones. Most of them I see around here are little and look like they won't have enough milk. When I do get a few I will either use a saler or Hereford bull.

That's why I started off by saying don't jump on me cause I had seen so much LH bashers. I appreciate everyone posting.

I have to think shipping and handling (chutes, head gates, and such) is difficult with them big horns,

Just knock the horns off, anything works. Tree shears, sawzall, you can also put a band on the horn and tape it with duct tape to keep it from sliding off it will cut off the blood flow. I usually just knock on back as far as I can so they are not an issue in the alley.

 

[WalnutCrest]

<snip> ... you can also put a band on the horn and tape it with duct tape to keep it from sliding off it will cut off the blood flow. <snip>

Out of curiosity, how long does it typically take for the horns to come off using this approach? Any lingering health risks (vs. cut / cauterize)? How are the aesthetics?

 

[djinwa]

Let me throw out a few thoughts and let the experts tell me how I'm wrong.

Often in these threads, someone will comment that the calves from a Longhorn are smaller than those from angus or whatever. To which I often wonder, "No kidding, but how much do your cows eat to get those bigger calves?" You see, people don't really know how much their cows eat. Profit equals revenue minus expenses, but most the focus is on revenue - how big a calf and price at the salebarn.

Kind of like a trucking company that doesn' t know how much fuel their trucks use. You can brag about how much a truck hauls, but if it hauls 20% more, but burns 50% more fuel, is that smart?

If you breed your LH to a heavy muscled bull, and her calf is 20% lighter than a pure angus calf, but she eats 40% less than an angus cow, wouldn't she be a better deal?

Heavier muscled cows eat more. Muscle tissue is more metabolically active, so requires more energy to maintain. Which is why for weight control, you are encouraged to build muscle mass.

The leghorn laying hen is the most efficient, as she has a light body, so energy goes to the egg, not body maintenance. Dairy cows are light muscled so energy goes to the milk.

So every time I see a supposedly beautiful, well muscled cow on here, the first thing I wonder is how much she eats. I saw a beef cow at the fair one year with a nice big butt, and mentioned she was a nice looking cow. The owner said, "Yep, but she sure eats alot!"

So it may well be that an angus or whatever is the better deal, and her genetics for heavier muscling passed to the calf compensate for her increased maintenance over a LH. But without knowing how much a cow eats, I don't know how one can determine that and criticize a LH cow. Just seems like one should get the muscling more from the bull than the cow.

One problem is that breeding two different extremes in muscling will get you calves that are either light or heavy muscled or somewhere in between. Fortunately, consistency is not as important if selling beef directly to consumers.

As this guy explains, we're just now starting to study cow efficiency and feed intake. Amazing!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6hSQMz8hyo

 

[WalnutCrest]

<snip>
One problem is that breeding two different extremes in muscling will get you calves that are either light or heavy muscled or somewhere in between. Fortunately, consistency is not as important if selling beef directly to consumers.

As this guy explains, we're just now starting to study cow efficiency and feed intake. Amazing!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6hSQMz8hyo

First, I'm not an expert ... so, I think I'm safe in telling you that I think most of what you wrote is correct. :tiphat:

Second, consistency is very important in selling beef directly to consumers ... how do you think repeat business is built?

Third, there are some easy rules of thumb one can use to determine the efficiency of converting inputs to flesh ... namely, taking (say) 8 month hip heights and converting them to projected adult frame score using any one of a number of well-accepted tables (which will also include a projected adult weight at that frame score) ... and then compare their current 8 month weight to their projected adult weight ... and calculate a proportion of "current weight vs. projected mature weight" ... then compare these relative percentages, and the higher the percentage animals are the ones most efficient at converting forage to flesh.

 

[Bigfoot]

I have no way of knowing, but I have always suspicioned that longhorn cows have a lot of butter fat in their milk. Because when you breed them to something heavy muscled, those calves really come on.

 

[heath]

<snip> ... you can also put a band on the horn and tape it with duct tape to keep it from sliding off it will cut off the blood flow. <snip>

Out of curiosity, how long does it typically take for the horns to come off using this approach? Any lingering health
risks (vs. cut / cauterize)? How are the aesthetics?

http://www.nobull.net/bander/SBhornRemoval.htm
It takes about a month or so. it turns out a little smoother on the ends than if you just saw them off.

 

[u4411clb]

Let me throw out a few thoughts and let the experts tell me how I'm wrong.

Often in these threads, someone will comment that the calves from a Longhorn are smaller than those from angus or whatever. To which I often wonder, "No kidding, but how much do your cows eat to get those bigger calves?" You see, people don't really know how much their cows eat. Profit equals revenue minus expenses, but most the focus is on revenue - how big a calf and price at the salebarn.

Kind of like a trucking company that doesn' t know how much fuel their trucks use. You can brag about how much a truck hauls, but if it hauls 20% more, but burns 50% more fuel, is that smart?

If you breed your LH to a heavy muscled bull, and her calf is 20% lighter than a pure angus calf, but she eats 40% less than an angus cow, wouldn't she be a better deal?

Heavier muscled cows eat more. Muscle tissue is more metabolically active, so requires more energy to maintain. Which is why for weight control, you are encouraged to build muscle mass.

The leghorn laying hen is the most efficient, as she has a light body, so energy goes to the egg, not body maintenance. Dairy cows are light muscled so energy goes to the milk.

So every time I see a supposedly beautiful, well muscled cow on here, the first thing I wonder is how much she eats. I saw a beef cow at the fair one year with a nice big butt, and mentioned she was a nice looking cow. The owner said, "Yep, but she sure eats alot!"

So it may well be that an angus or whatever is the better deal, and her genetics for heavier muscling passed to the calf compensate for her increased maintenance over a LH. But without knowing how much a cow eats, I don't know how one can determine that and criticize a LH cow. Just seems like one should get the muscling more from the bull than the cow.

One problem is that breeding two different extremes in muscling will get you calves that are either light or heavy muscled or somewhere in between. Fortunately, consistency is not as important if selling beef directly to consumers.

As this guy explains, we're just now starting to study cow efficiency and feed intake. Amazing!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6hSQMz8hyo

You are needed over at the $EN discussion ASAP.

 

[Running Arrow Bill]

I'm surprised at all the positive remarks concerning longhorns. I have seen them bashed pretty hard on here n the past. I would try a few if I get the chance to pick up some decent ones. Most of them I see around here are little and look like they won't have enough milk. When I do get a few I will either use a saler or Hereford bull.

I'm not a fan, but they do have a place. I guess like all breeds. I've noticed the ones that bash them have never had them. Funny how that works.

No experience with LH Crosses. However, we've sold several LH Yearling Bulls to area commercial breed ranchers for their crosses. Also sold one Homozygous black bull to an Angus breeder several years ago. Our LH Cows are all good milkers and good BCS's. Eat less, eat almost anything that doesn't eat them first, and generally low maintenance. Breed back fast and frequent. Have one 20 yr old cow that had another good healthy calf in 2013. The ones we butcher for USDA meat sales averages about 60% hang to live weight; and, about 35% packaged to live weight (we don't keep any organ meats or other "variety" meats. We have good retail sales of our beef ranging between $6.00 and $17.50 a pound depending on cut. We also turn any old animals that have outlived their usefulness to us into Summer Sausage. Occasionally sell a skull/horn unit.

 

[wacocowboy]

I'm surprised at all the positive remarks concerning longhorns. I have seen them bashed pretty hard on here n the past. I would try a few if I get the chance to pick up some decent ones. Most of them I see around here are little and look like they won't have enough milk. When I do get a few I will either use a saler or Hereford bull.

That's why I started off by saying don't jump on me cause I had seen so much LH bashers. I appreciate everyone posting.

I have to think shipping and handling (chutes, head gates, and such) is difficult with them big horns,

Best thing to do is buy them young enough and scoop those devils off or if you go to sales often enough you may find a young cow who was dehorned I messed up could of had a 3yr old LH cow with a little Heifer calf the cow had been dehorned for $700 I sure wish I had bought her

 

[MO_cows]

Interesting how the merits of the longhorns can be discussed but if anybody brings up corrientes, the lynch mob is ready to ride.

 

[Bigfoot]

Interesting how the merits of the longhorns can be discussed but if anybody brings up corrientes, the lynch mob is ready to ride.

Spots aren't nearly as big of a problem with a corriente, even when crossed with an angus. I think they offer more calving ease, but don't grow nearly as well as LH calves. This doesn't pertain to the op's question, but I'd rather rope corriente cattle 2 to 1 over longhorn cattle. They are just harder to find.

 

[heath]

Interesting how the merits of the longhorns can be discussed but if anybody brings up corrientes, the lynch mob is ready to ride.

They're the same in my eyes. I have some crosses of both and I'm pleased with how both breeds raise a calf.

 

[cross_7]

Interesting how the merits of the longhorns can be discussed but if anybody brings up corrientes, the lynch mob is ready to ride.

I didn't realize there was a real difference
I always figured they were pretty much the same

 

[piedmontese]

I can see why a guy would use a LH cow as a cross but why would anyone use a LH bull as a cross? There are plenty of other options for small calves on heifers.

 

[Rafter S]

There are plenty of other options for small calves on heifers.

Not at the price you'll pay for a Longhorn bull. For a small operator like me it's hard to justify $3000 or more for an Angus bull to use on just a few heifers when you can get a Longhorn for $800.