Worlds largest storm water pumping plant

[jedstivers]

The W.G. Huxtable pumping is located about 12-13 miles from my house. I can hear the motors when it's running. It has ten 3600 HP Fairbanks Morris engines that can pump 100 acre feet an hour.
It drains 2000 square miles, only problem is it is pumping onto my farm. I'm on the unprotected side.

To give it a scale of size there is a red pickup parked in the center of it.
Google it and you can find more images.

 

[cow pollinater]

Come on out to CA. Out here they take all your water away from you.

 

[jedstivers]

Come on out to CA. Out here they take all your water away from you.

We have plenty right now, July and August will be a different story.

 

[cow pollinater]

Come on out to CA. Out here they take all your water away from you.

We have plenty right now, July and August will be a different story.

We're looking more like April- November being a different story.

 

[kenny thomas]

I know you showed it to me but I still dont understand why they dont just let the water flow down the channel. Does it make the water move faster or what is the reason for it. When I was there it was almost dry above it.

 

[greybeard]

My old style math sez that's about 98,000 gals per second.
KT, I would guess that the reason it is being pumped is because it's destination (Mississippi River) is running higher than the level of Jed's river. (St. Francis?)
And, It's Fairbanks Morse--not Morris.
(I used to work on 'em)

It is a big pumping station for sure, but it won't handle what Old River Control Structure or even Bonnet Carre can.
We may see both of those, as well as Morganza opened up this year.

 

[jedstivers]

I know you showed it to me but I still dont understand why they dont just let the water flow down the channel. Does it make the water move faster or what is the reason for it. When I was there it was almost dry above it.

The pumps turn on when the gauge on the riverside (Mississippi river) hits a certain height. It keeps the Mississippi from backing up the St. Francis basin and also takes water out of that basin to protect land and towns all the way to the MO boot heal.
It is showing problems though, so much land has been graded and so many ditches dug the water gets here so much faster than when it was designed it can't protect the land right at it.
Another thing is after the flood of '11 the Mississippi finally fell so fast everything on the unprotected side was gone and the protected side had accumulated so much rain and seep water that it could flow through the structure fast enough and it took forever for that side to go down.

 

[jedstivers]

My old style math sez that's about 98,000 gals per second.
KT, I would guess that the reason it is being pumped is because it's destination (Mississippi River) is running higher than the level of Jed's river. (St. Francis?)
And, It's Fairbanks Morse--not Morris.
(I used to work on 'em)

It is a big pumping station for sure, but it won't handle what Old River Control Structure or even Bonnet Carre can.
We may see both of those, as well as Morganza opened up this year.

Yep, I think they list it at 100,000 gps. Those other structures just open and free flow don't they? No pumping involved?
The engines are massive, they were WW2 surplus I have always heard. In 1983 in the firs big use of the system they had I think two runaway and melt down, they then shut the plant down and a lot was lost on the protected side. Have heard it was gas in the fuel and also it was some kind of reverse preventer that was taken off. Either way it was human error.

 

[Caustic Burno]

Jed the Corp's built a pretty impressive system here as well.
The pump's are impressive the whole system is WOW
http://www.tcphx.com/hurricane.htm

 

[jedstivers]

Jed the Corp's built a pretty impressive system here as well.
The pump's are impressive the whole system is WOW
http://www.tcphx.com/hurricane.htm

Interesting, I googled it and found more on it.

 

[greybeard]

My old style math sez that's about 98,000 gals per second.
KT, I would guess that the reason it is being pumped is because it's destination (Mississippi River) is running higher than the level of Jed's river. (St. Francis?)
And, It's Fairbanks Morse--not Morris.
(I used to work on 'em)

It is a big pumping station for sure, but it won't handle what Old River Control Structure or even Bonnet Carre can.
We may see both of those, as well as Morganza opened up this year.

Yep, I think they list it at 100,000 gps. Those other structures just open and free flow don't they? No pumping involved?
The engines are massive, they were WW2 surplus I have always heard. In 1983 in the firs big use of the system they had I think two runaway and melt down, they then shut the plant down and a lot was lost on the protected side. Have heard it was gas in the fuel and also it was some kind of reverse preventer that was taken off. Either way it was human error.

Yes, they are free flowing--gravity is a wonderful thing and the best part is it is everywhere. According to USCOE, in what they call the Project Flood or Design Flood, St Francis River and it's floodway will put 80,000 cu ft per second into the Mississippi R. Design flood is the most severe flood USCOE hydrologists can imagine within reason--a 1000 year type event. Old River can divert 620,000 CFS, Morganza relieves 600,000 cfs, and Bonnet Carre can run 1/4 million cfs with all it's timbers pulled.

All this, for USCOE to meet the congressional mandate that the Miss River flow forever to be maintained at a ratio of 70% flow to the Atchafalya getting only 30%---------regardless of Miss. river flood stage.
I wrote a lengthy article a few years ago about what would happen if Old River failed. It would be catastrophic, a disaster far worse than Hurricane Katrina and it would be irreversible. If Old Rver fails (washed away), the Miss R. will alter it's course down the Atchafalya basin and river channel and Miss River as far North as Baton Rouge will become brackish and soon begin to fill in since there will be no spring flood flow to help keep it scoured out. Someday when I have time, I will paste that over here to CT in another thread.

I assume the anti reverse thingies are to prevent water flow thru the pumps from turning the engines backwards in cases of high water levels on the output side. I can see how that would burn up an engine pretty quick. Some FM engines tho, will run in reverse by design--worked on an old tug that had 2 engines like that. To get reverse, the engine is shut down, a big lever is moved that shifts the cam shaft to a different set of lobes, a reverse rotation starter on the other side of the flywheel housing is engaged, and if all went well, the tug would be in "astern". It was nerve wracking to get it all done in a hurry and we hit the pier on several occasions when the engines didn't want to re-start.

 

[jedstivers]

I read some articles about old river failing but it's been to long and I can't remember a lot other than it would be really bad. I think by reading between the lines in '11 flood some of the people in the know weren't sure that wouldn't happen then either. Don't know that but just had that idea.
That would be something to see an engine do what you are talking about. Lot of things in this old world we don't get to see being on the farm.
Something else they have at the plant here is the levee has fuse plugs in it but I can't figure what side it's to let the pressure off of. If it ever came to using it something would already be really bad.

 

[highgrit]

Man hasn't figured out mother nature yet, and we never will. If we would of left stuff alone everything would of been alright. But no we need to do this or do that for the people. And then we had to do something else for mother nature. And mother nature suffers all the consequences till she can't take it no more. Man needs to live and farm according to nature, or else we will all pay big time.

 

[Angus Cowman]

Man hasn't figured out mother nature yet, and we never will. If we would of left stuff alone everything would of been alright. But no we need to do this or do that for the people. And then we had to do something else for mother nature. And mother nature suffers all the consequences till she can't take it no more. Man needs to live and farm according to nature, or else we will all pay big time.

If it wasn't for these Levee systems millions of excellent farm ground would be un farmable most yrs and the economy in lots of areas would be greatly affected

 

[larryshoat]

Man hasn't figured out mother nature yet, and we never will. If we would of left stuff alone everything would of been alright. But no we need to do this or do that for the people. And then we had to do something else for mother nature. And mother nature suffers all the consequences till she can't take it no more. Man needs to live and farm according to nature, or else we will all pay big time.

If it wasn't for these Levee systems millions of excellent farm ground would be un farmable most yrs and the economy in lots of areas would be greatly affected

The same applies to drainage here. North of here is Saint Marys Lake, a man made lake that 1000's of acres drains into. That is some of the most productive land in the country, before that lake was built and systematic tiling came along they couldn't raise much at all. I've never verified it but I was told they have a drainage ditch that is 20 miles long with 3 feet of fall in it. That is some flat ground.

Larry

 

[greybeard]

I read some articles about old river failing but it's been to long and I can't remember a lot other than it would be really bad. I think by reading between the lines in '11 flood some of the people in the know weren't sure that wouldn't happen then either. Don't know that but just had that idea.
That would be something to see an engine do what you are talking about. Lot of things in this old world we don't get to see being on the farm.
Something else they have at the plant here is the levee has fuse plugs in it but I can't figure what side it's to let the pressure off of. If it ever came to using it something would already be really bad.

Most Levee fuse plugs flood the spillway in an uncontrollable fashion. Sort of like the Corps did in 2011 that flooded so much of Missouri, except they dynamited Birds Point. I don't know anything about the St. Francis system, but I imagine the fuse plugs there are just lower elevation levees designed to wash out should the river exceed levels beyond that which Huxtable can handle.
Old River has a structure near by, called Low Sill, which is a concrete levee lower than the main Old River control structure and lower than the top of the main levee. Low Sill is not really a fuse plug tho--it's the first line the water flows across in flood stage.
It is also not unusual for the COE to design in a fuse plug around a control structure to protect that structure itself. They'll flood half the country before they let one of their pride and joys get washed away.

 

[FarmGirl10]

The same applies to drainage here. North of here is Saint Marys Lake, a man made lake that 1000's of acres drains into. That is some of the most productive land in the country, before that lake was built and systematic tiling came along they couldn't raise much at all. I've never verified it but I was told they have a drainage ditch that is 20 miles long with 3 feet of fall in it. That is some flat ground.

Larry

Completely off subject, but didn't realize how close you were to where I grew up.

 

[larryshoat]

The same applies to drainage here. North of here is Saint Marys Lake, a man made lake that 1000's of acres drains into. That is some of the most productive land in the country, before that lake was built and systematic tiling came along they couldn't raise much at all. I've never verified it but I was told they have a drainage ditch that is 20 miles long with 3 feet of fall in it. That is some flat ground.

Larry

Completely off subject, but didn't realize how close you were to where I grew up.

I'm about 50 miles north of Cincinnati, but do business with folks around Saint Marys, Celina, Saint Henry, Minster. The world keeps getting smaller.

Larry

 

[FarmGirl10]

The same applies to drainage here. North of here is Saint Marys Lake, a man made lake that 1000's of acres drains into. That is some of the most productive land in the country, before that lake was built and systematic tiling came along they couldn't raise much at all. I've never verified it but I was told they have a drainage ditch that is 20 miles long with 3 feet of fall in it. That is some flat ground.

Larry

Completely off subject, but didn't realize how close you were to where I grew up.

I'm about 50 miles north of Cincinnati, but do business with folks around Saint Marys, Celina, Saint Henry, Minster. The world keeps getting smaller.

Larry

That isn't far away at all, should have guessed it based off of all those little Holsteins you have. :lol: Probably ran into you before and didn't even know it. For some reason i always guess you were from the Wooster area.