Winter feeding again..

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Limomike

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Since winter is fast approaching, I wanted to see what most of you plan to use for a protein source this year? And if cost is the main factor, tell me why you are going to use what you plan on using.
I asked this same question last year about this time; just wondered what the difference would be this year since costs on feed has jumped up so much.
 
Stockpiled fescue then when the weather gets too snowy or icey, hay that we've put up from here.
 
if i use any feed its a 14% creep feed.an its fed 2 or 3 times a week.the cows have access to all the hay they want.we wont start haying till the 1st big frost.
 
Have plenty of hay or at least thought I did til the army worms came thru last week. The place now looks like we had a hard frost. Hay is last years hay, fertilized but only about 10% protein. I feed the cows 2 lbs. per head per day of 40% cubes plus the free choice hay. Have a creep feeder with a 12% P, 5% F, 12% fiber ration in it. Use a lactating dairy cow mineral for all the cows except the close up cows and use a dry cow mineral with them.
 
TexasBred":2vpuggqq said:
Have plenty of hay or at least thought I did til the army worms came thru last week. The place now looks like we had a hard frost. Hay is last years hay, fertilized but only about 10% protein. I feed the cows 2 lbs. per head per day of 40% cubes plus the free choice hay. Have a creep feeder with a 12% P, 5% F, 12% fiber ration in it. Use a lactating dairy cow mineral for all the cows except the close up cows and use a dry cow mineral with them.
:D Army worm, that's what all that rain got you. If your pastures were like mine, the army worms are starving because the cows beat them to anything that was green. :lol2: I saw signs of them around some buildings where some lush growth came back after Ike other than that, the big pastures don't show any damage.

In a normal winter I graze oats and ryegrass, feed hay and supplement with range meal and molasses tubs.

This year, if I get any rain to grow oats and ryegrass, I think I will be cutting back on the supplement. I had my hay tested and it was a lot better than I thought so I plan to cut back on some of the "candy".
 
dun":1bmyof3e said:
Stockpiled fescue then when the weather gets too snowy or icey, hay that we've put up from here.

dun, you mean the hay you put up will still put on that ADG of 3-4 lbs??
 
To maintain a dry cow it only takes about 7% protein. For growing heifers or bulls a higher rate of 12% should be adequite.
The subject of protein always comes up but very little about fat. For lactating cows it is very important that it is considered to carry them through winter. Depending on the weather in your area, the breed you raise and the condition of your cattle it well may be the more important issue. Feeding protein will encourage cattle to consume more forage which may add the necessary energy to their diet.
 
Limomike":266q90dl said:
Since winter is fast approaching, I wanted to see what most of you plan to use for a protein source this year? And if cost is the main factor, tell me why you are going to use what you plan on using.
I asked this same question last year about this time; just wondered what the difference would be this year since costs on feed has jumped up so much.

Our cattle live outdoors year round and manage the Canadian winters quite nicely with our system.

If you are feeding cows or simply holding heifers and steers over until grass in the spring - like us - they do not need additional feed.

I am not talking milkers, or cattle still sucking calves, or feeding fats.

Decent quality hay is fine and all they need. Cattle cannot take in much more than 10-12% protein at best - the remainder is simply poured out on the ground behind the animal.

We feed hay in the 7% range for the first two to three months and then up it to 9/10% for the next two months and then the best (11-12%) at the end - this usually goes to the cows about to calve out. It is an excellent maintenance feed and we run our cows on this until they calve.

We might add some corn or barley if it gets cold - for energy - but the temp has to get to minus 20 - 30 before we worry about that - and we usually have additional mineral available on a free choice should they want it.

Feeding for finishing is an entirely different matter.

I know we live in different parts of the world and have different environments - but I often wonder why folks spend such big dollars on additives when not finishing cattle - it is to my mind simply not required. And if it is - then to keep the costs down it is vital to breed the appropriate genetics that can thrive without expensive additional feed.

I do not know if Aaron will read this - but if he does I hope he will wade in - he lives in a tougher climate than me and does pretty much the same - and his animals are stellar.

Breed for easy keeping and get rid of those that cannot do well on a simple and cheap diet - all part of the plan to actually MAKE money.

Regards

Bez+
 
Most of the time I do not have to put out protein. Occasionally I get some pretty sorry hay and will put out a lick tub. I measure the protein content of the hay, and stockpiled forage by the way the crap stacks or splats.
 
Limomike":13cm2o28 said:
dun":13cm2o28 said:
Stockpiled fescue then when the weather gets too snowy or icey, hay that we've put up from here.

dun, you mean the hay you put up will still put on that ADG of 3-4 lbs??

I'm not looking for 3-4 pounds a day. I'm looking for the cow to regain condition from raising her precious calf and the heifers to gain maybe a poound or 2 a day at the most. The hay probably has more nutrition then the stockpiled fescue
 
Bez+":25dolhtg said:
Limomike":25dolhtg said:
Since winter is fast approaching, I wanted to see what most of you plan to use for a protein source this year? And if cost is the main factor, tell me why you are going to use what you plan on using.
I asked this same question last year about this time; just wondered what the difference would be this year since costs on feed has jumped up so much.

Our cattle live outdoors year round and manage the Canadian winters quite nicely with our system.

If you are feeding cows or simply holding heifers and steers over until grass in the spring - like us - they do not need additional feed.

I am not talking milkers, or cattle still sucking calves, or feeding fats.

Decent quality hay is fine and all they need. Cattle cannot take in much more than 10-12% protein at best - the remainder is simply poured out on the ground behind the animal.

We feed hay in the 7% range for the first two to three months and then up it to 9/10% for the next two months and then the best (11-12%) at the end - this usually goes to the cows about to calve out. It is an excellent maintenance feed and we run our cows on this until they calve.

We might add some corn or barley if it gets cold - for energy - but the temp has to get to minus 20 - 30 before we worry about that - and we usually have additional mineral available on a free choice should they want it.

Feeding for finishing is an entirely different matter.

I know we live in different parts of the world and have different environments - but I often wonder why folks spend such big dollars on additives when not finishing cattle - it is to my mind simply not required. And if it is - then to keep the costs down it is vital to breed the appropriate genetics that can thrive without expensive additional feed.

I do not know if Aaron will read this - but if he does I hope he will wade in - he lives in a tougher climate than me and does pretty much the same - and his animals are stellar.

Breed for easy keeping and get rid of those that cannot do well on a simple and cheap diet - all part of the plan to actually MAKE money.

Regards

Bez+


WELL PUT BEZ!!!!
 
novatech":meh3lm2g said:
Most of the time I do not have to put out protein. Occasionally I get some pretty sorry hay and will put out a lick tub. I measure the protein content of the hay, and stockpiled forage by the way the crap stacks or splats.

NT - Your last comment is very valid and an excellent way to measure how the animal is doing

Limomike - you holding / maintaining cows or finishing fats?

Bez+
 
dun":fw60vzea said:
Stockpiled fescue then when the weather gets too snowy or icey, hay that we've put up from here.
We usually stockpile but it has been so dry nothing is growing, just about ready to feed hay.
 
novatech":qb9q3lwb said:
To maintain a dry cow it only takes about 7% protein. For growing heifers or bulls a higher rate of 12% should be adequite.
The subject of protein always comes up but very little about fat. For lactating cows it is very important that it is considered to carry them through winter. Depending on the weather in your area, the breed you raise and the condition of your cattle it well may be the more important issue. Feeding protein will encourage cattle to consume more forage which may add the necessary energy to their diet.

You use the word "fat" and I assume you're using this as a energy supplement. Fat has about 3 1/2---4 times the energy of corn yet cost about 10 times as much. A very expensive energy source for maintenance, however, I agree that more intake of hay is also critical especially for body warmth during colder weather. "Breed" of cow also factors heavily into the equation as well as body condition going into colder weather, pregnancy and/or lactation. We're asking for performance so need to supply a diet with adequate protein and energy to allow the cow the best opportunity to perform up to potential.
 
Bez+":2oi6rxi0 said:
Limomike - you holding / maintaining cows or finishing fats?

Bez+

Bez, Since my cow herd calves year round, I am usually maintaining the cows who have calves through the winter. I too have adequate forage for the winter, and only give creep (14%) or some other protein supplement when the weather gets really cold. (which for this part of the country is around 10-20 degrees) Most of my cows/calves do fine through the winter and can graze right up until January.
 
Limomike":3s0r8bzf said:
Bez+":3s0r8bzf said:
Limomike - you holding / maintaining cows or finishing fats?

Bez+

Bez, Since my cow herd calves year round, I am usually maintaining the cows who have calves through the winter. I too have adequate forage for the winter, and only give creep (14%) or some other protein supplement when the weather gets really cold. (which for this part of the country is around 10-20 degrees) Most of my cows/calves do fine through the winter and can graze right up until January.

Must be nice.

We often are forced to start feeding hay in late Sept to mid Oct - once we made it to end of Nov! :D - depending on the weather (snow) and right through to next May 15 when the grass comes on.

Bez+
 
ill be feeding citrus pellets and hay...5-9% protien. plenty of good filler. get em thru the winter here.

also i will be selling it for 200/ton....
 
TexasBred":11vkz4in said:
novatech":11vkz4in said:
To maintain a dry cow it only takes about 7% protein. For growing heifers or bulls a higher rate of 12% should be adequite.
The subject of protein always comes up but very little about fat. For lactating cows it is very important that it is considered to carry them through winter. Depending on the weather in your area, the breed you raise and the condition of your cattle it well may be the more important issue. Feeding protein will encourage cattle to consume more forage which may add the necessary energy to their diet.

You use the word "fat" and I assume you're using this as a energy supplement. Fat has about 3 1/2---4 times the energy of corn yet cost about 10 times as much. A very expensive energy source for maintenance, however, I agree that more intake of hay is also critical especially for body warmth during colder weather. "Breed" of cow also factors heavily into the equation as well as body condition going into colder weather, pregnancy and/or lactation. We're asking for performance so need to supply a diet with adequate protein and energy to allow the cow the best opportunity to perform up to potential.
Fat was probably the wrong word to use. Energy may have been a better word. I rarely need to supplement so I am not famliar with the pricing.
 
Bez+":1j1jns0m said:
Limomike":1j1jns0m said:
Since winter is fast approaching, I wanted to see what most of you plan to use for a protein source this year? And if cost is the main factor, tell me why you are going to use what you plan on using.
I asked this same question last year about this time; just wondered what the difference would be this year since costs on feed has jumped up so much.

Our cattle live outdoors year round and manage the Canadian winters quite nicely with our system.

If you are feeding cows or simply holding heifers and steers over until grass in the spring - like us - they do not need additional feed.

I am not talking milkers, or cattle still sucking calves, or feeding fats.

Decent quality hay is fine and all they need. Cattle cannot take in much more than 10-12% protein at best - the remainder is simply poured out on the ground behind the animal.

We feed hay in the 7% range for the first two to three months and then up it to 9/10% for the next two months and then the best (11-12%) at the end - this usually goes to the cows about to calve out. It is an excellent maintenance feed and we run our cows on this until they calve.

We might add some corn or barley if it gets cold - for energy - but the temp has to get to minus 20 - 30 before we worry about that - and we usually have additional mineral available on a free choice should they want it.

Feeding for finishing is an entirely different matter.

I know we live in different parts of the world and have different environments - but I often wonder why folks spend such big dollars on additives when not finishing cattle - it is to my mind simply not required. And if it is - then to keep the costs down it is vital to breed the appropriate genetics that can thrive without expensive additional feed.

I do not know if Aaron will read this - but if he does I hope he will wade in - he lives in a tougher climate than me and does pretty much the same - and his animals are stellar.

Breed for easy keeping and get rid of those that cannot do well on a simple and cheap diet - all part of the plan to actually MAKE money.

Regards

Bez+

Bez!!

I just found this comment while I was searching for an old thread of mine. I think you pretty much summed it up.

This year, we have scrapped a lot of older (and potentially profit-losing) cows and are in a position of having excessive feed....we have about 200 5x4 bales too many. :banana: Even so, we have about 40+ acres of standing forage that was supposed to be grazed this past summer. It wasn't, and now we are the profitable position to feed our cows (possibly with calves) on this standing feed well into December...maybe even January, depending how lazy we are and how hungry the cows get. Being as such, I only calculate our feed costs based on what goes through the cow. I figure the worst years, our feed cost is somewhere around the $200 mark. Most years, I would say it is more like $150. I am hoping that maybe this year, we might have a chance at $100 winter feed cost. These are not times to splurge on feeding cows. We have now set ourselves into a position where, we can decrease the amount of feed we put up next year, stockpiling more forage and potentially increasing our grazing further in the winter.

As far as protein goes, we have never really worried about it. Whatever the feed has, it has. We now occasionally throw out a 20% protein block, perhaps once every month or every two months. The cows seem to consume them rapidly in the spring after they calve, but their needs for it steadily decrease until they calve again. At $27 a 50 lb block, we probably spend about $200 or so on them. The two most critical times to use them, we found, was at calving to give the cows a boost and in late July, early August when pastures have run down and we need the cows to increase their consumption and maintain a steady flow of milk production. Unlike Bez, who lives more in the corn country of Canada, we don't feed any grain to our cows in the winter and limit feeding it to our calves. Grain, is an area where a lot of money can be lost in the cattle biz, especially in the cow/calf industry. Focus your attention to buying bulls with good hair coats and a lot of capacity to turn that hay into energy. We hit -40+C (-40F) for about 2 to 3 weeks during the winter up here. Cows are fed more often, but they don't get special treatment. If they can't eat, maintain flesh and walk half a mile to the water trough (or eat snow) they don't deserve our :heart: . :cowboy:
 
I pretty well go with Bez and Aaron on the cow feed thing. A dry cow sure doesn't need a lot of protein to maintain herself. If she goes into winter in decent shape it doesn't hurt her to lose a few pounds?
An alphafa/grass mix will be in that 12% range and that is more than she needs. We always feed test and feed two row barley straw to target that 7% range. No fancy haybuster, just roll it out and let them go to it.
We don't calve until May so don't get all bent out of shape about feeding better near the end although we will be keeping the better stuff for the end.
Don't need to start feeding cows until Christmas unless the snow is to deep. They go on stockpiled native grass usually about Nov. 1st and if they don't get it cleaned up it is still there in April.
This last year we left the calves out with cows until April 1st. and weaned them onto decent hay. The first cow calved May 2! Worked pretty good only 3 open out of 130 cows this fall. Most of the older cows kicked their calves off around February...some of the young ones never did!
The yearlings sold off grass in August. Steers avg. 941 lbs. heifers 872.
 
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