Why Prices Are Down

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Margonme":37pagjzh said:
HEY GRIT: DIDN'T THE 2014 ELECTION GIVE REPUBLICANS CONTROL OF HOUSE AND SENATE. HOW THE HEII DID THEY THINK REPEALING COOL WAS GOOD FOR US CATTLE PRODUCERS?


News flash - they all lie. News flash - they all follow the money. News flash - big corporations are the money. News flash - big corporations make the most profits from trade deals. News flash - any candidate on the ballot today or tomorrow will do the same thing (ANY candidate) - lie and side with corporate America. This is the lay of the land regardless of what they are saying today to get elected. Your savior is not coming regardless of which way you vote. The only hope is that a true lobbying effort exists to protect the situation. The problem - all candidates swear they can't be persuaded by lobbyist. The truth: They ALL are persuaded by lobbyists - even when they SAY they aren't. The final problem: we are corporate America. Anyone who owns stocks in a retirement plan, 401k or any other vehicle actual OWNS the companies in question and we expect those companies to make more money so those stocks will appreciate. We also want everything WE are buying to be cheap while everything we are selling we want to be expensive. Life doesn't work that way.

I am my own problem.
 
The whole thing stinks to high heaven. Getting sold out to international interest and corporations. Either have to reform the laws, find a niche in the market or find an economical way of raising cattle that conforms to the crashing cattle market if it is not to recover based on foriegn inports.
 
None of us cow/calf producers would have liked COOL the way it was written. We have used and depended on cattle from Mexico and Canada for 100 years. U.S. stocker operations have grazed Mexican calves since the west was won. At some point those calves should have more rights than an illegal immigrant. All of our calves would have had to been permanently marked to identify them as U.S. born. The explanation to me was we needed to micro chip our calves so they could be traced each step of the way to slaughter. Feeder yearlings from Canada and stocker calves from Mexico could not co-mingle with U.S. born calves.
The label should should have been North American beef.
COOL was designed to intentionally fail and allow cheaper fresh beef imports.
Congress defunded the enforcement branch of the USDA on November18, 2011.
U.S. meat packers began closing slaughter facilities. It is cheaper to import beef than pay union wages to process them.
It is illegal to import fresh beef from Brazil. They have Foot and Mouth Disease, which is an airborne disease.
Brazil (JBS) is now allowed to import 250 tons of fresh beef into the U.S. each month. Next year the number increases to 2,500 tons a month.
Since COOL was repealed and the USDA unable to enforce current laws, the American people will never know where their beef was raised and processed. Until recently all Brazil could export to us was canned beef.

The other side of the coin is that the meat packing industry controls the raising of pork and chicken. They profit from the farm to the store. Much more profit for them in pork and chicken. Our kids were raised on chicken fingers and we did not see this coming.
Not so with beef. The only way to price control is to import cheaper beef, reduce U.S. slaughter numbers and make fat cattle back up on the feed lots.
We are currently processing around 600,000 a week. That is probably close to our capicity. We would need to reopen slaughter facilities to get back to the 650,000 weeks of old.
Packers are sending the trimmings from U.S. beef to their over seas facilities and mixing in the grind to add flavor. Some claim this makes at least part of the beef U.S.

We were set up from day one with the way COOL was worded.
 
Tim/South":1qywua2e said:
None of us cow/calf producers would have liked COOL the way it was written. We have used and depended on cattle from Mexico and Canada for 100 years. U.S. stocker operations have grazed Mexican calves since the west was won. At some point those calves should have more rights than an illegal immigrant. All of our calves would have had to been permanently marked to identify them as U.S. born. The explanation to me was we needed to micro chip our calves so they could be traced each step of the way to slaughter. Feeder yearlings from Canada and stocker calves from Mexico could not co-mingle with U.S. born calves.
The label should should have been North American beef.
COOL was designed to intentionally fail and allow cheaper fresh beef imports.
Congress defunded the enforcement branch of the USDA on November18, 2011.
U.S. meat packers began closing slaughter facilities. It is cheaper to import beef than pay union wages to process them.
It is illegal to import fresh beef from Brazil. They have Foot and Mouth Disease, which is an airborne disease.
Brazil (JBS) is now allowed to import 250 tons of fresh beef into the U.S. each month. Next year the number increases to 2,500 tons a month.
Since COOL was repealed and the USDA unable to enforce current laws, the American people will never know where their beef was raised and processed. Until recently all Brazil could export to us was canned beef.

The other side of the coin is that the meat packing industry controls the raising of pork and chicken. They profit from the farm to the store. Much more profit for them in pork and chicken. Our kids were raised on chicken fingers and we did not see this coming.
Not so with beef. The only way to price control is to import cheaper beef, reduce U.S. slaughter numbers and make fat cattle back up on the feed lots.
We are currently processing around 600,000 a week. That is probably close to our capicity. We would need to reopen slaughter facilities to get back to the 650,000 weeks of old.
Packers are sending the trimmings from U.S. beef to their over seas facilities and mixing in the grind to add flavor. Some claim this makes at least part of the beef U.S.

We were set up from day one with the way COOL was worded.

You could be right or you could be tied in with ACA which is controlled by NCBA. We don't need Mexican or Canadian beef in this country is my feeling. Didn't Canada have mad cow awhile back?
 
Personally, I think it's time that we took a minute, and actually analyzed the writing on the wall. We are just another industry that has put under by cheap imports. We won't bounce back. We won't have a come back. It's just gone. I live in a town, that's entire economy is based on manufacturing. I can name product after product that left here to never to return. We just met the same fate. The packer was makin a dollar, and we were makin a dime. They found somebody willing to perform the same task for a nickel.

We say it, and I guess it sounds cliche, but what many of us do is way of life. It's not what I do, it's what I am. I felt the same way about tobacco absolutely refused to raise one single stalk for the companies, and never will. I still miss it. I'm afraid cattle will go the same way for me. I hate to let anybody down, and not be optimistic, but I'm not optimistic at all. I've seen it too many times, on too many other products.

I truly am sorry to feel this way, and I wish for the younger generation that it wasn't happening. I sat my son down this evening and tried to explain to him. He has been under the full understanding for a while now, that the market has fallen. It's started to affect many of our spending practices. He didn't take it so well, that this might be something that we used to do. Much as I love it, I won't do it for nothing.
 
In 1994 my father and I were booking cut and sew work for the garment factories we owned in Tennessee. We had over 700 sewing machine operators at the time.

By July of '96 I was in the mortgage business and he was down to about 50 machines in one solitary plant.

Thank you NAFTA.
 
True Grit Farms":3qcgq0y9 said:
Didn't Canada have mad cow awhile back?

You mean like those times the US had mad cow cases as well? And that's just the documented cases..

Judging from the news trends these days, its not as if there are large scale coverups down there from time to time either... :roll:
 
Canadians had the genius to fight COOL... they went to court MANY times, and won every time...

So then COOL was eliminated, and they bring in Brazilian beef.. We sure won that one! :banghead:

Supa Dexta +1 :)
 
Nesikep":n8j2kwvg said:
Canadians had the genius to fight COOL... they went to court MANY times, and won every time...

So then COOL was eliminated, and they bring in Brazilian beef.. We sure won that one! :banghead:

Supa Dexta +1 :)

You guys definitely did your part to help. But at least y'all have way better beef than Mexico.
 
True Grit Farms":1xltq5x4 said:
Nesikep":1xltq5x4 said:
Canadians had the genius to fight COOL... they went to court MANY times, and won every time...

So then COOL was eliminated, and they bring in Brazilian beef.. We sure won that one! :banghead:

Supa Dexta +1 :)

You guys definitely did your part to help. But at least y'all have way better beef than Mexico.
The typical pen of #1 Mexicans are better cattle than #1 Okies. Healthier and feed better than them too. Owned more than a few of both over the years. I've got no particular affinity to running Mexicans, we would run all Watusi if they were the most profitable use of our ranches.
We've seen our operation ebb and flow in terms of Mexican cattle. At times from the 1940's through mid 1980's, our yearling segment ran a varying percentage of our 2 season stocker inventory as Mexicans most every season. Our largest Mexican year, we crossed 25,000 Mexican steers to run on our ranches. We ran a much smaller number of Mexican steers through the back half of the 1980's up through the early 2000's, a year or two, not buying any. The reason for this was that light Nevada calves improved and were a better two season grass option for our needs. Over the last decade, that has started to change. More and more of these Nevada/Utah/Oregon/Arizona desert ranches wean bigger and bigger calves that don't work as well for our 2 season program and in more than a few instances, while the cattle are getting prettier, they are losing some of that toughness that those desert ranches bred and our med costs and treat rates for the cowboys riding through them are rising and their overall utilization of our country has declined somewhat. No to mention, the good light native calves that can be bought are a narrowing pool. While I buy a lot of them, and the ones that are around really are superior cattle, I'm not comfortable or certain that I can buy enough of them to meet our 2 season yearling needs every season. This has led to the pendulum swinging back and us buying a greater percentage of our 2 season stocker inventory as Mexicans every season. The heavier stockers, that go to grass for one season then to the feedyard, still is the domain of native cattle for us as we elect not to bang up against the wheat guys who buy 5x6 weight Mexicans.

Canadian cattle I just don't have a whole lot to do with any consistency. After their beef business melted down back in 2004 or 2005 after that whole mad cow thing, we bought a tremendous amount of Canadian feeders when they were hammered down unbelievably cheap based purely on non market factors and panic selling and it was obvious that there was a good profit to be made if one had cash, a marketing avenue and was willing to stick a capable guy up there for 18 months like we did. While we have owned some on feed several times since, that was really our one big Canadian cattle endeavor.

I guess I'm the enemy as it were.

Funny thing, I'm not Tyson or JBS. Just the fourth generation rancher on a family operation trying to grow and preserve it for the fifth generation. No multinational conglomerate here. I won't deny we've been blessed and have expanded to multiple States and are pretty vertically integrated but the current ownership of our company isn't some nefarious board shrouded in mystery but rather my parents, myself and my wife, my sister and her husband and hopefully someday, our respective kids.
I also won't deny that R-Calf over the last 20 odd years its been beating it's drum has raised some legitimate concerns and COOL has some value on multiple levels but accepting the broad brush strokes that makes not being for COOL in it's entirety bad or it's detractors unAmerican no matter what or some such nonsense is just as silly.
 
Bigfoot":3lll6db7 said:
Personally, I think it's time that we took a minute, and actually analyzed the writing on the wall. We are just another industry that has put under by cheap imports. We won't bounce back. We won't have a come back. It's just gone. .

x2.


The only thing we might have is the local buyer or restaurant that needs/wants organic, free range verified or farm verified. While corporate America runs the show and makes the rules, my neighbor still knows if he bought a side of beef from me or not.
 
angus9259":3jaxnhg1 said:
Bigfoot":3jaxnhg1 said:
Personally, I think it's time that we took a minute, and actually analyzed the writing on the wall. We are just another industry that has put under by cheap imports. We won't bounce back. We won't have a come back. It's just gone. .

x2.


The only thing we might have is the local buyer or restaurant that needs/wants organic, free range verified or farm verified. While corporate America runs the show and makes the rules, my neighbor still knows if he bought a side of beef from me or not.

It's just for this reason we've been toying with the idea of starting some sort of off-the-farm grocery store ---- your beef was sired by those bulls over there, your pork was out of one of those sows over there, your eggs came from those hens in that coop over there, etc.

All that'll probably be illegal in a couple of weeks...
 
js1234":1oivrhvs said:
True Grit Farms":1oivrhvs said:
Nesikep":1oivrhvs said:
Canadians had the genius to fight COOL... they went to court MANY times, and won every time...

So then COOL was eliminated, and they bring in Brazilian beef.. We sure won that one! :banghead:

Supa Dexta +1 :)

You guys definitely did your part to help. But at least y'all have way better beef than Mexico.
The typical pen of #1 Mexicans are better cattle than #1 Okies. Healthier and feed better than them too. Owned more than a few of both over the years. I've got no particular affinity to running Mexicans, we would run all Watusi if they were the most profitable use of our ranches.
We've seen our operation ebb and flow in terms of Mexican cattle. At times from the 1940's through mid 1980's, our yearling segment ran a varying percentage of our 2 season stocker inventory as Mexicans most every season. Our largest Mexican year, we crossed 25,000 Mexican steers to run on our ranches. We ran a much smaller number of Mexican steers through the back half of the 1980's up through the early 2000's, a year or two, not buying any. The reason for this was that light Nevada calves improved and were a better two season grass option for our needs. Over the last decade, that has started to change. More and more of these Nevada/Utah/Oregon/Arizona desert ranches wean bigger and bigger calves that don't work as well for our 2 season program and in more than a few instances, while the cattle are getting prettier, they are losing some of that toughness that those desert ranches bred and our med costs and treat rates for the cowboys riding through them are rising and their overall utilization of our country has declined somewhat. No to mention, the good light native calves that can be bought are a narrowing pool. While I buy a lot of them, and the ones that are around really are superior cattle, I'm not comfortable or certain that I can buy enough of them to meet our 2 season yearling needs every season. This has led to the pendulum swinging back and us buying a greater percentage of our 2 season stocker inventory as Mexicans every season. The heavier stockers, that go to grass for one season then to the feedyard, still is the domain of native cattle for us as we elect not to bang up against the wheat guys who buy 5x6 weight Mexicans.

Canadian cattle I just don't have a whole lot to do with any consistency. After their beef business melted down back in 2004 or 2005 after that whole mad cow thing, we bought a tremendous amount of Canadian feeders when they were hammered down unbelievably cheap based purely on non market factors and panic selling and it was obvious that there was a good profit to be made if one had cash, a marketing avenue and was willing to stick a capable guy up there for 18 months like we did. While we have owned some on feed several times since, that was really our one big Canadian cattle endeavor.

I guess I'm the enemy as it were.

Funny thing, I'm not Tyson or JBS. Just the fourth generation rancher on a family operation trying to grow and preserve it for the fifth generation. No multinational conglomerate here. I won't deny we've been blessed and have expanded to multiple States and are pretty vertically integrated but the current ownership of our company isn't some nefarious board shrouded in mystery but rather my parents, myself and my wife, my sister and her husband and hopefully someday, our respective kids.
I also won't deny that R-Calf over the last 20 odd years its been beating it's drum has raised some legitimate concerns and COOL has some value on multiple levels but accepting the broad brush strokes that makes not being for COOL in it's entirety bad or it's detractors unAmerican no matter what or some such nonsense is just as silly.

Thank you for posting I really appreciate all your advice and knowledge on this issue.
 
Bigfoot":1q4tv7et said:
Personally, I think it's time that we took a minute, and actually analyzed the writing on the wall. We are just another industry that has put under by cheap imports. We won't bounce back. We won't have a come back. It's just gone. I live in a town, that's entire economy is based on manufacturing. I can name product after product that left here to never to return. We just met the same fate. The packer was makin a dollar, and we were makin a dime. They found somebody willing to perform the same task for a nickel.

We say it, and I guess it sounds cliche, but what many of us do is way of life. It's not what I do, it's what I am. I felt the same way about tobacco absolutely refused to raise one single stalk for the companies, and never will. I still miss it. I'm afraid cattle will go the same way for me. I hate to let anybody down, and not be optimistic, but I'm not optimistic at all. I've seen it too many times, on too many other products.

I truly am sorry to feel this way, and I wish for the younger generation that it wasn't happening. I sat my son down this evening and tried to explain to him. He has been under the full understanding for a while now, that the market has fallen. It's started to affect many of our spending practices. He didn't take it so well, that this might be something that we used to do. Much as I love it, I won't do it for nothing.

That is a tough one. Amazing how it affects people.

You make an excellent point. It has happened to every other enterprise where people take raw materials and produce something of higher value. In our vocation, we convert grass to a product of higher value. That feeds the need to breed better cattle, that feeds interest in the show business, etc. I tend to agree with you. I can see the part of the business that I enjoy dying on the vine - which is breeding and producing cattle to satisfy those who chase pedigrees and fancy cattle. That market has not suffered as much until lately.

The international meatpackers are not going to put premiums on quality. That is a fact Jack. Use your analogy of other business that have disappeared. Everyone suffers a tremendous loss of quality. Just one example, furniture. Today's furniture is shyt compared to what it was when quality furniture was made in the USA.
 
WalnutCrest":3ovxxf9n said:
angus9259":3ovxxf9n said:
Bigfoot":3ovxxf9n said:
Personally, I think it's time that we took a minute, and actually analyzed the writing on the wall. We are just another industry that has put under by cheap imports. We won't bounce back. We won't have a come back. It's just gone. .

x2.


The only thing we might have is the local buyer or restaurant that needs/wants organic, free range verified or farm verified. While corporate America runs the show and makes the rules, my neighbor still knows if he bought a side of beef from me or not.

It's just for this reason we've been toying with the idea of starting some sort of off-the-farm grocery store ---- your beef was sired by those bulls over there, your pork was out of one of those sows over there, your eggs came from those hens in that coop over there, etc.

All that'll probably be illegal in a couple of weeks...

We did this in same deal in the fishing business since 1928. Our boats would be to the dock at 4 pm every day and we'd sell fresh seafood to the public. Before you knew it we needed this license and that license. And once we got past that it was the health department and we kind of got past them. Then came the state GFC, they weren't to bad, but the USDA and NMFS was more than our pocket book and heart could handle. Funny thing was we never had any problems till we started making money.
 
We did this in same deal in the fishing business since 1928. Our boats would be to the dock at 4 pm every day and we'd sell fresh seafood to the public. Before you knew it we needed this license and that license. And once we got past that it was the health department and we kind of got past them. Then came the state GFC, they weren't to bad, but the USDA and NMFS was more than our pocket book and heart could handle. Funny thing was we never had any problems till we started making money.

and I will bet the big players were supporting the screamers for more regulation....
with the goal of squeezing out the smaller competition.
 

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