Why Angus?

[Nite Hawk]

supposed to be 8500 wolves in B.C.?
Bet there is alot more than that. Bet some pencil pusher from some extreme green outfit probably dumbed down the numbers so they wouldn't be a push to remove a few more.
The ranchers have lost plenty of cattle the last few years from wolves, and the government was helping for a while to control their numbers there was that many.
What people don't realize is that we have basically 2 types of wolves in B.C. The smaller wolves that are a bit bigger than a german shepard, and the huge northern timber wolves that stories say may have Siberian blood in them, they are that big. I have seen them and I would bet they weigh close to 180 pound or so, maybe more. A neighbor years ago had one take a leak on a snow bank and he measured where the "whizz" hit the bank to the ground, and it was 30 inches. I have seen their paw prints, and they look like cougar tracks except there are toenail marks, where a cougar pulls his claws in. Have seen tanned wolf pelts that are the size of a small yearling black bear, except of course they have a tail. some of them are huge.
So far haven't heard any this year down around close, but have in winters past, although our neighbor who said he had never heard any around his place before has heard them this winter.
As most cattle are turned out on the range, they have to be tough to impress any predator whether wolf, cougar or bear, and angus are tough in that aspect, but other breeds of cattle who are not quite a aggressive do survive out there too.
In this country Herefords have gotten docked ( and their numbers shrunk) because of their tendency to have heavy hide, and the butchers want to pay for meat not hide, so Black & red baldies are pretty common.
There has been some fussing from some of the butchers because of the over all lack of meat on an angus carcass. There has been a slight swing in some areas toward Char X Angus with "smokie' cattle, Bit more meat than angus, less bone than Charolais and easier calving.
The angus like every other breed has its place, but the color of the hide does not always guarentee good eating.
Some of the best flavored, fine grained beef I have eaten came from scrawny Jersey cows, not angus.
Although the "angus hype" has reached here, I don't think it is as strong as down south, and red cattle are still looked on with favor here, and I hope it stays that way.

 

[inyati13]

I culled two flightly Angus cows in my whole life. I have Angus based herd and so far I have no issue with their dispoistion other than these two angus cows.

And here is where it starts. Dont want to start any fights but I will never have another black bull on the property. Only in a semen tank.

Now as far as flighty goes that is one of those things that has a different definition with everybody. My definition is if they are high headed and watch you every step then something will happen sooner than later. If they hit the chute and you dont have it anchored down and it moves, ( when they go in ) you go to tag calf and get chased over fence. You walk out to feed mineral and they run to other side of pasture.

I think you get my point.

Now that being said there are good and bad in all breeds. But I will stick with my herfs.

Oh and they had VERY VERY GOOD MARKETING. If the herf association had as good a promoter you would hear a different story.

I only have 16 total. Most are simmental/angus crosses. My bull is registered black angus. My cattle show no sign of ill temper. I have worked my bull through the chute alone. I take a bucket of feed and lead him into the sweep. I start the sweep door closing and he calmly walks down the alley. I move him into the chute and he stands until I close the head gate. I have even taken blood samples from him and he does not move. When you open the head gate, he calmly walks out. I set the bucket down and if I do it too soon he will still have his back legs in the chute. I scratch him under his chin when I meet him in the pasture. I can call him and unless the neighbors cows are bullin, he will come. I am not drawing any conclusions, just tellin you this one is gentle. The next angus bull I get may be a monster. My cows are about the same way. Maybe it is the Sim in them that makes them gentle.

 

[CKC1586]

I'm fairly unfamiliar with breeds other than Maines. So I'm sorry if I'm asking a stupid or obvious question here. Why are Angus such a popular breed? I know that most Maines were crossed with Angus to get the black hide, but is that the only reason? I do like some of the traits I've seen in the high quality Angus cattle, but I've also seen plenty of poor Angus. So what's the appeal?

Well, I have raised a lot of different cattle over the years.

I figure this thread to go viral on the site.

And sure as shooting someone will get angry.

The only thing about BLACK Angus that people relate to is the colour.

A great number of people worship at the feet of the black angus.

All things being equal, they do not give you anything that cannot be found in other breeds that are successful in North America.

Anyone tells you different is a true converted colour worshipper.

Heck even the RED angus is often considered inferior - I am pretty sure the only difference is the colour gene.

I admire the angus society for their successful marketing of a cow. They have actually managed to convince producers and consumers alike that their black CAB meat is the best in the world.

I guess old Barnum had it right after all. LOL

Essentially you take a cow to market with enough black on it you hit CAB - even if you are selling Welsh Blacks. So much for truth in advertising.

You will get CAB money with your animals as well - your Maine will also provide you with the same return - as long as they are black! Which they pretty much are now - so no problem.

Stick with what you have and you will have no regrets

As for the poor angus - starting to see a heck of a lot more of them - a darned shame actually as I once thought them to be fairly decent animal - not any more. Never seen a good cow herd that once again - all things being equal - could not equal or surpass that angus.

Black is so important, that people will actually by-pass a better animal at the market to buy into the hype.

Cannot wait to see how this one turns out! LOL

Best to all

Bez

:clap: BINGO :nod:
Brilliant and expensive marketing of "black".

 

[inyati13]

But if you were starting out as a commercial cow operation, one would want to produce what the market is asking for. As long as it is black with maybe some white on it. I started 3 years ago and my cattle are black with white on the head, gentle, and reproducing and growing well. I have not lost a calf. They are weighing out at about 600 to 730 pounds at 6 to 8 months. Selling at the top of the range at our stockyards. All my cows are coming in 40 days after calving and taking by an angus bull on the first heat. Except for one that was entirely black and weighed 1890 pounds and sold for 87 cents. Being open, I culled her. A knowledgeable farmer palpatated her and said she was too fat or had cysts on her ovaries or both.

 

[u4411clb]

My advice would be to try and catch the guys who are the main buyers at the stock yards where you take your cattle. And ask them what are they looking for ideally. What mix do they prefer. I will tell you everyone I have spoken to has been more than happy to talk about what they are looking for and why. And it can help that they know you and they know what kind of program you run and what kind of cattle you have so when they see you at the sale they may take an extra look at your cattle because they know more about them and what kind of health program you have and what kind of make up your cattle are breed wise. I have a friend who after speaking with some of the buyers with me had a buyer tell him to call him personally whenever he is bringing a group of calves to the sale so that he can bid on them.

 

[inyati13]

My advice would be to try and catch the guys who are the main buyers at the stock yards where you take your cattle. And ask them what are they looking for ideally. What mix do they prefer. I will tell you everyone I have spoken to has been more than happy to talk about what they are looking for and why. And it can help that they know you and they know what kind of program you run and what kind of cattle you have so when they see you at the sale they may take an extra look at your cattle because they know more about them and what kind of health program you have and what kind of make up your cattle are breed wise. I have a friend who after speaking with some of the buyers with me had a buyer tell him to call him personally whenever he is bringing a group of calves to the sale so that he can bid on them.

Your comment IMO has merit and will put more money in the pockets of sellers than a debate about color.

 

[AllForage]

If the herf association had as good a promoter you would hear a different story.

I agree that the angus association has been good at marketing but I don't agree that hereford would be a replacement for angus with better marketing. There are to many places where beef gets raised where herefords fall apart but angus holds up just fine. I'm currently making some baldies but that first cross is as far as I'll go and I've learned that by watching a few guys make the mistake of getting to much hereford in the equation. They just don't hold up in my country.

Grew up my whole life in CA before moving here in 2000 . Been all over the state and spent a lot of time in the mountains. Please explain this quote.

 

[cow pollinater]

Grew up my whole life in CA before moving here in 2000 . Been all over the state and spent a lot of time in the mountains. Please explain this quote.

I have over a thousand feet of elevation in between the top of my ranch and the bottom and some of the leases that I've held in the past were steeper than what I'm on now and the herefords really don't hold up that well in it. Horned bulls will go out and get cows bred but almost all of the polled bulls that my neighbors have tried(almost as in two did okay) have just flat fallen apart. Cows with to much hereford fall apart as well. My neighbor has had great success in a constant two way cross but any cow with enough hereford in her to look like one gets moved to the easier pastures and bred back angus.
Angus, on the other hand, come out of the same country in great condition, as do brangus.
Twenty miles south of me hereford works just fine and that's with less rain.

 

[Stocker Steve]

I do like some of the traits I've seen in the high quality Angus cattle, but I've also seen plenty of poor Angus. So what's the appeal?

It is very simple - - folks just copy what most others are doing.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Grew up my whole life in CA before moving here in 2000 . Been all over the state and spent a lot of time in the mountains. Please explain this quote.

I have over a thousand feet of elevation in between the top of my ranch and the bottom and some of the leases that I've held in the past were steeper than what I'm on now and the herefords really don't hold up that well in it. Horned bulls will go out and get cows bred but almost all of the polled bulls that my neighbors have tried(almost as in two did okay) have just flat fallen apart. Cows with to much hereford fall apart as well. My neighbor has had great success in a constant two way cross but any cow with enough hereford in her to look like one gets moved to the easier pastures and bred back angus.
Angus, on the other hand, come out of the same country in great condition, as do brangus.
Twenty miles south of me hereford works just fine and that's with less rain.

So what changes in 20 miles - - is it a mineral thing or ???

 

[Taurus]

Grew up my whole life in CA before moving here in 2000 . Been all over the state and spent a lot of time in the mountains. Please explain this quote.

I have over a thousand feet of elevation in between the top of my ranch and the bottom and some of the leases that I've held in the past were steeper than what I'm on now and the herefords really don't hold up that well in it. Horned bulls will go out and get cows bred but almost all of the polled bulls that my neighbors have tried(almost as in two did okay) have just flat fallen apart. Cows with to much hereford fall apart as well. My neighbor has had great success in a constant two way cross but any cow with enough hereford in her to look like one gets moved to the easier pastures and bred back angus.
Angus, on the other hand, come out of the same country in great condition, as do brangus.
Twenty miles south of me hereford works just fine and that's with less rain.

So what changes in 20 miles - - is it a mineral thing or ???

I think it has do with surface soil and the environment. My neighbors' Belgian Blue cattle just fallen apart in their pasture (it was very rough and swampy environment).

 

[cow pollinater]

So what changes in 20 miles - - is it a mineral thing or ???

It's easier country. More of a gradual slope up into the mountains. No cliffs.

 

[AllForage]

Grew up my whole life in CA before moving here in 2000 . Been all over the state and spent a lot of time in the mountains. Please explain this quote.

I have over a thousand feet of elevation in between the top of my ranch and the bottom and some of the leases that I've held in the past were steeper than what I'm on now and the herefords really don't hold up that well in it. Horned bulls will go out and get cows bred but almost all of the polled bulls that my neighbors have tried(almost as in two did okay) have just flat fallen apart. Cows with to much hereford fall apart as well. My neighbor has had great success in a constant two way cross but any cow with enough hereford in her to look like one gets moved to the easier pastures and bred back angus.
Angus, on the other hand, come out of the same country in great condition, as do brangus.
Twenty miles south of me hereford works just fine and that's with less rain.

Well that kinda goes against everything one mostly hears. I respect your opinion, it's not to say thought if the right type and line were tried they would not succeed.

I grew up in San Jose. Did a lot of backpacking out of the south sierras and up near Lassen where my grandparents had a place above Fall River Mills. Fished the resovoirs all over the Gold country as well. Where are you at if you are willing to say?

 

[cow pollinater]

Three Rivers. Think Visalia, which is halfway between Fresno and Bakersfield and then head East. Have you been up the 198 to the parks? If so then as you look accross Lake Kaweah you can see the backside of where my cows run.

 

[AllForage]

Three Rivers. Think Visalia, which is halfway between Fresno and Bakersfield and then head East. Have you been up the 198 to the parks? If so then as you look accross Lake Kaweah you can see the backside of where my cows run.

Cool, my Dad is still in Bakersfield. He was the wrestling coach at CSUB for over 20 years. I packed out of the Golden Trout Wilderness mostly. We accessed a lot above Lake isabella as well. I miss Ca sometimes, just not the taxes, home prices, and politics. Hands down the most diverse and beautiful state.

 

[AllForage]

Sorry everyone, get back to the black bashing! LOL

 

[djinwa]

So cp, can red angus survive the hills, or do they have to be black?

 

[Stocker Steve]

So cp, can red angus survive the hills, or do they have to be black?

Could be an energy thing - - and blacks collect more solar power...

 

[Lazy M]

Regardless of all the reasons why it is this way, if you sell calves at market:
Hereford? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a angus bull..
Gelvieh? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a black angus bull..
Simental? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a black angus bull..
Limo, Red angus, Brahma, Charlois, etc? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a black angus bull..
The only exception to this is if you have angus cows you can run em with whatever breed of bull you want..
Long horn cows? Get in the real world, sell out, and buy cows of an acceptable breed..

 

[cross_7]

Regardless of all the reasons why it is this way, if you sell calves at market:
Hereford? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a angus bull..
Gelvieh? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a black angus bull..
Simental? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a black angus bull..
Limo, Red angus, Brahma, Charlois, etc? Great cows, but you'd better run em with a black angus bull..
The only exception to this is if you have angus cows you can run em with whatever breed of bull you want..
Long horn cows? Get in the real world, sell out, and buy cows of an acceptable breed..

:clap: Lazy M