Which Red Angus and Red Simmental bulls to use?

[ShuterSunset]

What is the best Red Simmental Bull to use to make commercial females? I am planning to use them on Red Angus X Red Poll cross females to make 3 way cross females to sell replacements and recips to commercial producers. What Red Angus bulls would work within this same program as well? Thanks in advance.

 

[dun]

For Red Angus it's hard to go wrong with Basin 79E from ABS. I have a couple of his daughters and they raised good calves that graded well on the rail. Weaning weights were in line with other heifers, one was right up with the cows WW wise. Not fancy looking but good solid cows with decent muscle for young cows.
The Simmenthal I really like is Autobahn fomr Select Sires although I've nver seen any daughters. He's blaze faced, throws moderate sized calves that grow well. We butchered a bull calf by him and you could cut the roundsteak with a fork. Tenderest beef I've ever eaten.

 

[goodbeef]

check out leachman bodybuilder from genex. i've seen some awfully nice red angus, bodybuilder cross heifers.

 

[rv@L&R]

I have used BHR Three Sixes (full fleck full blood from Buzzard Hollow Ranch, Granbury TX) successfully in my breeding program. Here's a pic of one of the results:

 

[TheBullLady]

VERY nice looking calf rv.

You can't go wrong with a "Fleck" influenced Simmental bull, but be very careful of birthweights and calving ease EPD's, as they tend to be high in Flecks.

I like Remington .. he's had some good calves. Of course Dream On is a hot Simmental bull, and he's heterozogyous black, so you'll get red calves. His semen has probably gone down substantially as well, since he has so many progeny on the ground right now.

 

[karlie45]

Of course Dream On is a hot Simmental bull, and he's heterozogyous black, so you'll get red calves. His semen has probably gone down substantially as well, since he has so many progeny on the ground right now.

I dont have any, but I LOVE fleck simmies. I can't give any advice on the Red Angus, but I do know of a red sim bull by Dream On that I think is pretty nice if you dont want to shell out for Dream's semen. (which is still high, as far as i know)
DILLONS K217 RED DREAM
http://abs-bs.absglobal.com/beef/simmen ... o=29SM0380
While I'm at it, I might as well post some more.
Freedom (I like the looks of this guy)
http://abs-bs.absglobal.com/beef/simmen ... o=29SM0376
Beef Maker (He's nice too)
http://abs-bs.absglobal.com/beef/simmen ... o=29SM0385

Good Luck!
*That was fun! Since we are pretty strick on our black bulls, I dont look at the red boys that often.

 

[Avalon]

i saw some red semis in the semex book that sure look nice

 

[simangus23]

Red Angus = Beibers - Make Mimi API 150 (ABS)

Red Simmental - Beef Maker API 148 (ABS)

Hooks pacesetter is a heterozygous blk bull that will throw red or black calves

there can be no other choices (pls stay away from the Fleckvieh Simms)

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Autobahn & Bodybuilder will give you some great commercial cattle. May be a bit thicker fronted, but you'll love the thickness throughout.
I have Beef Maker calves coming this year so don't know what their like yet.

 

[rv@L&R]

SimAngus 23 ... why your comment to stay away from fleck simmis?

 

[simangus23]

the fleckvieh simms have really poor EPD's:
1. especially Calving ease/BW EPD's
2. They have a huge frame which hurts the commercial cattleman thats selling these calves as stockers/feedyards dont want them.
3. The maternal milk is really high which costs the cow/calf producer more money to maintain an animal like that.
4. When is the last time you saw a full blood Fleckvieh Simm under 6.5 Frame score?
Let's do the Math:
FB fleck cow weighing in at 1500 lbs
Cow that weighs 1500 will eat 45 lbs of forage per day
From Day 0 (calving) to day 205 (weaning) that = 9225
If the cost of forage costs $100/ton that = $461.25
Say she weans a 700 lb calf and you get .85 cents/lb that = $595.00
$595.00 - 461.25 = $134.00 profit

Lets look at a PB Simmental cow weighing in at 1200 lbs
Cow will consume 36 lbs of forage per day
Day 0 to day 205 = 205 x 36 = 7380 lbs
If the cost of forage costs $100/ton that = 369.00
say she weans a 600 lb calf and you get 0.95 / lb
600 x 0.95 = 570
$570 - 370.00 = $200.00

The PB Simm cow beats the FB Fleck cow everytime -- She can wean 50% of her Body Wt and a fleck cow cannot do it on avg.
The PB Simm cow will out perform the FB fleck in lbs of beef per acre (which is the real measurement to look at)
The PB Simm cow will cost you less money to maintain increasing your bottom line.
PB Simm sired calves will hit the ground unassisted and grow quickly to weaning (205 days) Weaned at 600 lbs
PB Simm sired calves will gain >2.5 lbs per day on wheat pasture (We have had calves push the 3.0 lb ADG on wheat pasture) (350 lb gain on Wheat pasture in 140 days max) (Entering feedyard at 950 lbs)
PB Simm sired calves (Steers) will finish out about 1300 lbs ( Low to Med Choice YG 2-3) in 125 days in the feedyard (<1300 lbs)
PB Simm sired calves will have a much better marbling percentage carcass and will have Quality Grades in Med Choice range.
FB Fleck sired steers will still be in the feed yard 2 months after PB Simm sired calves have been Harvested.
FB Fleck sired steers will normally Grade a moderate marbling score sending it to the Low Choice YG 2 (maybe) realm. and dont forget cost you more to feed whether at home or in the feedyard----

I would be glad to show you some steer data in the feedyard anytime you wanna look at it, but chances are you will be selling your fleck sired calves after you do-------------
Simangus23


Which cow calf pair do you want on your ranch?

 

[rv@L&amp;R]

SimAngus ...
I think your fleck stats are outdated ... I too am a SimAngus breeder but I successfully use fleck genetics and have zero calving problems, 72 lb calves, balanced strong EPD's, IMF scores of 3.5, reasonable frame scores, and adult females weighing 1100-1250 lbs. There are extraordinary fleck breeders out there who produce great modern day cattle that have a place in the market, including the market of creating Sim-Angus or purebred Sim cattle. Our end product cattle after crossbreeding are 7/8 purebreds and are highly desired. My disagreement with your post was the blanket fleck statements ... my agreement with your post was the push for more efficiently framed cattle. :cboy:
Here's another pic (the calf in the previous post was a 3/4 SimAngus) ... this one is as well ... this heifer below (picture shot a couple of months ago) is about to calve but will weigh after calving around 1250 lbs.

 

[simangus23]

There is not a single FB fleck Simm that can out perform a PB Simm on any category to date.
Check the sire summary--------- There isnt one

 

[rv@L&amp;R]

I guess that's the good thing about America and the cattle business ... everybody's entitled to their opinion. If you're going to throw around stats ... you oughta get them right.

 

[simangus23]

guess that's the good thing about America and the cattle business ... everybody's entitled to their opinion. If you're going to throw around stats ... you oughta get them right.


I did get them right RV -- show me one FB Fleck that can out perform a PB Simm in any category.. There isnt one. I rest my case.
Running a Forage bull test station we ask every year what cattleman (cow/calf man/ stocker/ feed yard/ Packer) want in a potential herd sire---
The cow/calf man wants this:
Calving ease is #1
WW is #2
YW is #3

The Stocker wants YW

The Feedyard wants Feed to weight gain ratios


The packer -- guess what-- he wants carcass merit > REA IMF, BF to name a few.

What should we all be growing ultimately? >>>> What the packer wants not what you specifically think is good- In this country if you are not raising what the packer wants you are going to take it in the shorts because poop runs down hill.
Good luck



I think the FB Flecks are a good animal to raise as a novelty item like Scotch Highland Cattle or something like that. As far as cattle for the packer they fall way too short on Quality grades and YG. For the Feedyard they dont perform as well due to a large frame which includes bone. That large bone makes the trimmings fill up fast and retail cuts are just a loss.