When to breed.

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angus9259

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So - standard procedure is 12 hours after first standing heat - see that at night, breed in the morning, see them in the morning, breed at night. What do you do if you see them late afternoon?
 

dun

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My ROT is before 1 pm that evening, after 1 pm the next morning. But we breed at aorund 6 am and 8 pm
 
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angus9259

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cow pollinater":1kvvvojo said:
You can breed her anytime from now until tommorrow afternoon with pretty similar results.

I used a gnrh+cidr 7 day lute protocol. I typically time ai with gnrh all non-responders at 72 hours - heifers and cows. Do you do tai non responders as well?
 

KNERSIE

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yes you do, the GNrH will cause them to ovulate anyway, whether you see a heat or not.
 
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angus9259

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KNERSIE":clmnnfzi said:
yes you do, the GNrH will cause them to ovulate anyway, whether you see a heat or not.

Some suggest doing the tai on heifers earlier than 72 hours. Does it really matter or is that only if you're not doing heat detection?
 

KNERSIE

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angus9259":3ov7dcqs said:
KNERSIE":3ov7dcqs said:
yes you do, the GNrH will cause them to ovulate anyway, whether you see a heat or not.

Some suggest doing the tai on heifers earlier than 72 hours. Does it really matter or is that only if you're not doing heat detection?

Not sure what the thinking behind that is, some dairymen here who AI jersey heifers weighing 220kg will AI as soon as a strong standing heat is observed because they feel its easier to get the pistolette through the minute cervix of the jersey heifer earlier rather than later, but I never had problems getting through the cervix of hereford heifers (or holstein heifers for that matter).
 

dun

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KNERSIE":284yfw09 said:
angus9259":284yfw09 said:
KNERSIE":284yfw09 said:
yes you do, the GNrH will cause them to ovulate anyway, whether you see a heat or not.

Some suggest doing the tai on heifers earlier than 72 hours. Does it really matter or is that only if you're not doing heat detection?

Not sure what the thinking behind that is, some dairymen here who AI jersey heifers weighing 220kg will AI as soon as a strong standing heat is observed because they feel its easier to get the pistolette through the minute cervix of the jersey heifer earlier rather than later, but I never had problems getting through the cervix of hereford heifers (or holstein heifers for that matter).
I can almost underestand it in the days of magic wands or ampules when the pipettes were so much bigger in diameter then the sheaths that are used with straws.
 

cow pollinater

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angus9259":33owwep8 said:
cow pollinater":33owwep8 said:
You can breed her anytime from now until tommorrow afternoon with pretty similar results.

I used a gnrh+cidr 7 day lute protocol. I typically time ai with gnrh all non-responders at 72 hours - heifers and cows. Do you do tai non responders as well?

I do on my dairy accounts but not on my personal cows. On the dairy cows I breed them anywhere from an hour before they get the shot to twenty six hours after and the results are pretty similar with all of them. Your management will have alot more to do with tia conception rates than the timing will.
 

cow pollinater

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angus9259":3ngyll4x said:
KNERSIE":3ngyll4x said:
yes you do, the GNrH will cause them to ovulate anyway, whether you see a heat or not.

Some suggest doing the tai on heifers earlier than 72 hours. Does it really matter or is that only if you're not doing heat detection?

All of the protocals that we have were designed for cows and not much research has been put into synchronizing heifers. Syncronization of groups of cattle is actually an extra-label use of products designed to treat anestrus cows so it makes since that heifers were never in the equation when ovsync was developed.
My experiance with sync-ing heifers has been that simple is better and don't expect fantastic results. :D Not to be crude about it, but you're dealling with a bunch of teenage girls...nothing will work the way it's suposed to on all of them until they grow up some.
That being said, I have seen evidence that cutting out TWO days on heifers will give better results. One day in between the FSH and lutenizing hormone, and another in between the lutenizing hormone and ovulation. In my opinion the best way to sync heifer is with a single dose of lut and heat detection. Anything with a CL will cycle. Anything without a CL will cycle shortly thereafter and anyone who got mixed up in the confusion will show you a heat somewhere along the way. You can sleep at night because you know what you bred was in heat...By the time they calve it will make a nice tight group.
 

cow pollinater

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KNERSIE":3kwl3da2 said:
Not sure what the thinking behind that is, some dairymen here who AI jersey heifers weighing 220kg will AI as soon as a strong standing heat is observed because they feel its easier to get the pistolette through the minute cervix of the jersey heifer earlier rather than later, but I never had problems getting through the cervix of hereford heifers (or holstein heifers for that matter).

Jersey heifers are hard to breed. I honestly don't think I could pass one that wasn't in heat and I do an average of thirty of the little buggers a day. As fertile as the Jersey cows are, the heifers don't follow suite and are somewhat less fertile than other breeds and significantly harder to pass.
 

JustSimmental

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We have had this happen quite often-- as cows don't always cycle when it is convenient for "us".
It has been proven that you are "much better off breeding her a little late than early", but if this is not convenient; we give them a 2ml shot of Cystorellin (which will shut down Estrus early) and breed them early.
Conception rates using this protocol have been excellent over the years.

JS


angus9259":1uyz085t said:
So - standard procedure is 12 hours after first standing heat - see that at night, breed in the morning, see them in the morning, breed at night. What do you do if you see them late afternoon?
 
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angus9259

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cow pollinater":2h67beuu said:
You can breed her anytime from now until tommorrow afternoon with pretty similar results.

Same issue - different cow. I'm traveling this time. Daughter said the cow was standing this morning. I won't be able to ai till tomorrow morning (24 hours since standing) - she's been standing all day today. Still potentially effective?? Thanks.
 

dun

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angus9259":3ml02zj0 said:
cow pollinater":3ml02zj0 said:
You can breed her anytime from now until tommorrow afternoon with pretty similar results.

Same issue - different cow. I'm traveling this time. Daughter said the cow was standing this morning. I won't be able to ai till tomorrow morning (24 hours since standing) - she's been standing all day today. Still potentially effective?? Thanks.
If she's still standing this evening and you hit her early in the morning she will probably settle.
 

dun

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heat-chart.jpg
 

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