What is YOUR opinion of THIS bull??

[DOC HARRIS]

http://www.bullbarn.com/angblkepd.asp?ID=817

From the total of the information given, INCLUDING the picture, define his positive and negative points, describe in detail his phenotype (look CAREFULLY!) AND 'WEIGH' his EPD's as if you were going to use him for the next three years.

This is a real chance to use your GOOD observations!

DOC HARRIS

 

[oakcreekfarms]

I don't know the terminology like I should, but I will give it a go anyways. He has a weak top, a long goosy neck, weak front feet, small boned, small scrotal epd, to heavy of a milk epd, seems to sag across the bottom line, he has good overall thickness, a nice rear, possibly a bit posty, looks fairly soggy, to low of a BW for me. I think that his BW is part of the problem with the angus, though he has a nicer phenotype then most that I have seen around here.

 

[Workinonit Farm]

I'll give it a go with my completely non-expert opinion.

I do like his butt, he actually has one. I don't like his heart-girth area looks pinched as well as his flanks, both a bit on the small side for my liking. It could just be the picture, but his rib/barrel area not terribly thick.

As for EPD's, I like his CED, YW and Milk. BW okay, I don't like the SC.

He hasn't quite got the 'look' that I like to see.

JMVHO

Katherine

 

[Wewild]

I like this bull more.....

than this one

 

[DOC HARRIS]

I like this bull more.....

than this one

Wewild - Comparatively - -Why??

DOC HARRIS

 

[Sage]

LOL, that is a terrible picture check out ABS pic in there catalog. Not thrilled on the scrotal but besides that I like him, actually we have some of his calves on the ground right now and will have more next year if they continue the way they have started. I like his carcass data, maint might be a little high on saved heifers but I think tolerable. Calving ease is a dream(epd and real experience) and he looks much better that that picture check him out here:
http://abs-bs.absglobal.com/beef/angus. ... o=29AN1619

 

[DOC HARRIS]

LOL, that is a terrible picture check out ABS pic in there catalog. Not thrilled on the scrotal but besides that I like him, actually we have some of his calves on the ground right now and will have more next year if they continue the way they have started. I like his carcass data, maint might be a little high on saved heifers but I think tolerable. Calving ease is a dream(epd and real experience) and he looks much better that that picture check him out here:
http://abs-bs.absglobal.com/beef/angus. ... o=29AN1619

Sage-

Excellent post! This is EXACTLY why one should NEVER make a decision on buying or using an animal strictly on the basis of what a picture shows! You have made my point perfectly!

DOC HARRIS

 

[Wewild]

I like this bull more.....

than this one

Wewild - Comparatively - -Why??

DOC HARRIS

I never went through any schooled FFA programs. I can't disect an animal in that way. A picture speaks a thousand words.

Here is a better pic of the bull posted by the previuos poster.

I still like mine.

 

[Wewild]

Excellent post! This is EXACTLY why one should NEVER make a decision on buying or using an animal strictly on the basis of what a picture shows! You have made my point perfectly!

DOC HARRIS

Shall we compare EPDs now? I feel I may hold my own as I checked yours.

 

[alftn]

I think either or both Black Angus bulls pictured would be a great inprovement in most commerical cow herds in the country...If I was raising Reg. stock there might be a difference depending on my females..But in my herd of 1/2bax1/2 her. or 3/4bax1/4 chars either would be good.....

 

[Wewild]

I think either or both Black Angus bulls pictured would be a great inprovement in most commerical cow herds in the country...If I was raising Reg. stock there might be a difference depending on my females..But in my herd of 1/2bax1/2 her. or 3/4bax1/4 chars either would be good.....

one of those ain't a black angus.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

I think either or both Black Angus bulls pictured would be a great inprovement in most commerical cow herds in the country...If I was raising Reg. stock there might be a difference depending on my females..But in my herd of 1/2bax1/2 her. or 3/4bax1/4 chars either would be good.....

one of those ain't a black angus.

Right I think that the top bull is a Limousin. But the Phenotype is different. Looks like Black Rad.

DOC HARRIS

 

[grassfarmer]

Well it's maybe a part Limo - there never was a black limo in France. Like most breeds in North America it has been a victim of mongrelisation. So you're both right it's a Limo and an Angus unless they used Galloway!

 

[alftn]

So you sliped in one of them flake Black Angus, No wonder CAB has such a hard time tellin things apart...O by the way,Wewild I figured it was a limo....Even if it is black...I could not tell by the photo for sure but your little limm next to your name sort of gave it away....

 

[Chuckie]

I would like to see him with a cleaner straight back. He seems to be standing slightly uphill to balance him out. He needs a lot more heart girth, and his shoulders are straight and carries his head too high. He needs more length/depth to his shoulder. He is calf kneed, and his sheath hangs lower than most. For some reason in the picture, he looks slab sided. But it could just be the picture. No complaints on the first 5 EPD's until it gets to SC. Milk is too high and IMF can stand some improvement.
I do like his calving ease and BW.
Chuckie

 

[cfpinz]

Doc, thanks for bringing this up. Since I'm in the bull-buying mood I'll take your bait and give my reasons why this bull wouldn't catch a ride home on my trailer. If anyone disagrees with my reasoning please speak up and explain, never got to go to Cow College.

Reasons for DQ: 1. Lack of capacity, better in second picture but still not great, evident at heart girth in both pictures. 2. Questionable topline. 3. Milk EPD too high for my liking. 4. And the kicker for me, EXT blood on his dam's side.

Didn't take the time to look up his actual #'s, but the BW EPD is a tad extreme, but that's not an automatic out. His WW/YW #'s are good, wouldn't want them any higher, though.

His attributes to me are an exceptionally nice ass for an angus, along with nice length and a front end that I'd feel comfortable putting on heifers. I also like seeing the Bando and Traveler blood back in his pedigree.

FWIW - Wewild - I like your bull better, also. What frame is he?

cfpinz

 

[Chuckie]

I thought this was a bull judging lesson on the picture presented along with the EPD's. On the photography, the second picture, someone did a better job. The first picture should have never been published to sell semen. Eye appeal is what draws your eye first. The first picture, I would have kept on thumbing through the catalog. Chuckie

 

[Sage]

I'm suprised that nobody noticed his rib eye, he was the #3 bull now I believe he is #1. People needing to improve carcass trailts can sacrafice adding a little maint. if he is bred to the right cows.

 

[Daybreak]

Howdy,

Sage = I agree with you. The picture obviously does not do him justice.
Having a rib eye that size, and ultrasound data to back that up, the heart girth is fine. The same thing for capacity. That is a fact. The picture might not show what is there. I would be more concerned about the scrotal size at 365. Might not be as viral as you want. The milk epd is to high for an easy keeper. The only thing you might want this epd to help out on existing cow issues wthin your herd. A lot really depends on what your cows need. I also see he has the tenderness traits going on too. With his EPD's having an accuracy level like that, you know what you are having.

 

[houstoncutter]

So you sliped in one of them flake Black Angus, No wonder CAB has such a hard time tellin things apart...O by the way,Wewild I figured it was a limo....Even if it is black...I could not tell by the photo for sure but your little limm next to your name sort of gave it away....

How could anyone not tell the difference, look at the muscle in the Limi, nothing wrong with the Angus either , but you have two different body styles. One with a lot of muscle the other with a nice fat cover finish. Personally if I lived futher north, I would be crossing Limi or Simms on Angus. You get the best of all worlds. Enough muscle to get a higher yeild and enough fat to get a nice grade and replacement heifers that would work anywhere up north