Well Pump Trouble

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I didn't see where he said what the static level of the water in the well is, only how deep the pump was set so we can't know what the lift actually is.
Yes, you are correct about the lift (pump TDH required). Where I was headed was the actual discharge pressure at the pump. Is the pipe and pump rated for the pressure?
 
Ya I'm not a fan of that set up. It sound overly complicated for what you need.

Is there a house on any continual use items on it or just water troughs and things if that nature?
My home is also on it. I strongly dislike it. I could have redone it at this point and been money ahead. It's just a long long ways to get high enough to gravity feed. But that's what needs to happen.

This property is long and narrow, going up in elevation as you move away from the house.
 
If it worked fine for 15 years the design would not be all of your problem. If you can maybe jot down all of your changes in the last few years. It could be as simple as your waterers were leaking enough to let the system cycle more. Sometimes things are not as unimportant as we think. Good luck in fixing it as lack of water is a terrible thing.
I thought that same thing as I submitted that one. Really the only thing I've done is remove the 200 foot rise.

I can't help but wonder about the electrical connections between the driver and the pump. Caused something to heat up and short. Had black copper inside the were nuts at the well head connections. Stripped 3 inches lower on one and was still smoked.
 
My home is also on it. I strongly dislike it. I could have redone it at this point and been money ahead. It's just a long long ways to get high enough to gravity feed. But that's what needs to happen.

This property is long and narrow, going up in elevation as you move away from the house.
I like the idea of pumping up to a holding tank with deep wells. I like the pump to kick on and run continously to add several feet. Then using a booster on surface from it to every thing else. It's simple and easy to troubleshoot/ maintain. You make the booster on surface the "burn" item. I'm not a water well guy though nor don't really know all your requirements.
 
Question since i am a little familiar with your farm. 200 ft in elevation, straight up, is a high hill. Are you sure on that?
Distance usually effects pressure more than elevation in our area.
A couple things about a storage tank and gravity systems. Its easier on a pump to run for 20 minutes constantly than to kick on 40 times a day for 30 seconds or 80 times for 15 seconds.
It doesn't require a pressure tank. Pressure is added by elevation.
Even if power is out you can have water for several days.
I have 2 systems with 1800 gallon reservoir and love them. They pump on a timer and fill up daily. Water runs out to the tire troughs and ball waterers by gravity. On a couple i had to add a restriction to keep the pressure down.
 
I like the idea of pumping up to a holding tank with deep wells. I like the pump to kick on and run continously to add several feet. Then using a booster on surface from it to every thing else. It's simple and easy to troubleshoot/ maintain. You make the booster on surface the "burn" item. I'm not a water well guy though nor don't really know all your requirements.
This is more and more common in East Texas. The ones I have seen tho, used air to bring water to a non pressurized surface tank, and that poly surface tank having a float valve to kick the compressor on and off That surface tank uses a mall sub pump in it, to pressure up a conventional pressure tank.
 
I'm no well guy but sounds like an over complicated system. I deal with VFDs in hvac and there's nothing about them cheap when they fail. In hvac VFDs help with energy efficiency of system but I doubt they save enough energy to offset the repairs.
 
I do a decent bit of plumbing work, but this well stuff is over my head. All the components and terminology just leave me confused.

All I do know for sure is ya lose around 4 psi for every 10 feet you push up. So that's a loss of 80 psi going 200 feet. So that one was pointless from the get go. Crazy that they thought this was a logical setup/system.
I don't know who dug or services your well, but I have been very pleased with "Joe Samples Well Drilling" in White Pine. They have always fixed any problem I had.
 
I don't know who dug or services your well, but I have been very pleased with "Joe Samples Well Drilling" in White Pine. They have always fixed any problem I had.
R&R. They're here the day I call them usually. They honor warranty and all that good stuff. They drilled the well back in the early 2000's. The guy that comes here I've gotten to know a little bit. He's got cows and that makes me feel better. 😆🤣😂
 
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Question since i am a little familiar with your farm. 200 ft in elevation, straight up, is a high hill. Are you sure on that?
Distance usually effects pressure more than elevation in our area.
A couple things about a storage tank and gravity systems. Its easier on a pump to run for 20 minutes constantly than to kick on 40 times a day for 30 seconds or 80 times for 15 seconds.
It doesn't require a pressure tank. Pressure is added by elevation.
Even if power is out you can have water for several days.
I have 2 systems with 1800 gallon reservoir and love them. They pump on a timer and fill up daily. Water runs out to the tire troughs and ball waterers by gravity. On a couple i had to add a restriction to keep the pressure down.
Call it a good ways up NRCS map showed it's around 200 feet difference between house and top water spot, it is a long way back there too though. It doesnt happen all at once. Runs downhill part of the way back there and shoots up again, does that two or three times. It's enough that there's just a trickle. Pipe friction is part of it. But the push up isn't helping.

I'll be calling nrcs here pretty soon to try doing thr whole thing again. I figure its gonna be 1500 to 2 grand when they leave today. Hope it's the motor and I don't have to replace all that wire.
 
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R&R. They're here the day I call them usually. They honor warranty and all that good stuff. They drilled the well back in the early 2000's. The guy that comes here I've gotten to know a little bit. He's got cows and that makes me feel better. 😆🤣😂
Has anyone asked why your well is so deep? Are you on top of a Tennessee mountain?
 
My inlaws had one of those constant pressure setups installed years ago because it was going to be the best thing ever. After numerous costly controller issues in the last few years it wasn't so great anymore.

Fast forward to 2023 we ripped it all out and hung a traditional submersible pump and plumbed in a traditional pressure switch and tank. Simple setup with hardware store available parts is a plus when you want to flush your toilet.
 
Constant pressure system that is mechanical so no controllers. I have it set to hold 60-65 psi when you are continuously running water.

The 10 gallon pressure tank only holds a few gallons of water so for toilet flushing, washing your hands, etc. the pump isn't running depending on how much is left in tank when you start.

For showers the pump just keeps running and keeps the pressure the same and you can have a couple showers going at the same time and it holds pressure. I will take this system over a traditional pressure tank and pump setup everyday.


IMG_6352.jpeg
 
My inlaws had a circuit board controller and other giblets that were special order when they crapped out. So you had to wait 3+ days before you could have water again.
 
I'd say something definitely isn't strong enough for the water you need pumped. Our setup is somewhat similar. One deep well, not as deep as yours, about 200 feet. Our house is on it and the cattle waterer about a 1/4 mile uphill. In our case it's the distance which causes the problem. The pressure has to be at least around 70 psi to make it there and be more then just a drizzle.
Our pump setup held for 30 years, but the Franklin controls and the pressure switches had to be replaced quite often, let's say every few years. Pressure tank is about a 30 gallon.

We had to get our pump etc replaced last year finally. The guy doing the work suggested to go to a multiple stage pump because of the high pressure required so far away. Can't explain it, but it's suppose to be easier on the pump.

I wonder with your problem if they put in a pump not strong enough or the wire isn't heavy duty enough, otherwise why would things burn out. Honestly, if they just installed this system a few years ago and you are having such trouble with it.......... I'd get somebody else to look at your requirements and tell the current guys to take their system under warranty back. Keep us posted as to what they find......... I'm curious.
 
water was about 60 foot down last time we pulled it.
Your well might be 580 feet deep, but your static water level is only 60' down? Can't imagine then that they would have set your pump 580' down in the hole. Regardless of that though, you're pump will still only be lifting the water with the pump the distance above the "static water level"... so around 60'. Pretty much any submersible won't have any trouble doing that. The 200' rise to your furthest waterer potentially "could" create enough "back pressure" to never allow the pressure switch to turn on (because with 200' of rise in a pipe full of water beyond the pressure switch, the pressure at the pressure tank ought to be measuring around 92#.... .46#/foot of rise)! So the pressure switch probably wouldn't be expected to ever kick in to turn on the submersible, if you actually did get water up to that waterer. I'm surprised you ever had water at the waterer at all, without a secondary lift pump to get it there.

But of course, you've indicated that you have disconnected that now. Does that mean that you've closed a valve where that line leaves the pump house/pressure system, or that you've shut it off up by the waterer at the top of the hill? If you've not closed a valve where that line leaves the pressure tank system, the weight of the water in that line is still pressing down against it, and it will likely act as a "mini-pressure tank" (albeit with limited volume capacity) on the system. At the very least, it will generate significant pressure against the pump when it needs to run.

It'll be interesting to hear what the well guy has to say about it.
 

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