Weaning with or w/o signs?

[fnfarms1]

Pretty sure it's been ask but can't find it. Anyone wean according to the signs? As in almanac?
My dad always tried to, claimed weaning, castrating etc always went better if following signs. Typically I try as well. sept 22 this year is right to wean, however I getting calves in to vaccinate/deworm this Saturday and be easier to just keep separate and wean them now. Thoughts?
I know it'd be more ideal to work them, kick them back out for 2wks and wean 22nd, less stress etc. right now about 23 of the 29 are eating pretty regular. Others haven't learned to like feed yet

 

[Dsth]

I asked the same question a few months ago and got an answer from @kenny thomas. weaned my calves on days he recommended from the old farmers almanac. calves seemed to be less stressed and less motivated to reunite with the cows. cows also seemed less affected by weaning calves. my vet recommends waiting 3 weeks after vaccinating, worming, or other chute work before weaning. claims too much stress if all is done at the same time.

 

[Lucky_P]

I asked the same question a few months ago and got an answer from @kenny thomas. weaned my calves on days he recommended from the old farmers almanac. calves seemed to be less stressed and less motivated to reunite with the cows. cows also seemed less affected by weaning calves. my vet recommends waiting 3 weeks after vaccinating, worming, or other chute work before weaning. claims too much stress if all is done at the same time.

Your vet is right. Weaning is perhaps THE most stressful event in a calf's life; if you give vaccines at that time - especially if you couple that with castrating, branding, etc., the likelihood of optimal response - if any - to those vaccines, is pretty low. Far better to have carried out all those vaccinations beforehand so that the calf already has established immunity to the pathogens before we make their immune systems tank with all that stress and cortisol release.

 

[Dave]

Only signs near my weaning are the no trespassing signs on the fence. I try not to dehorn and castrate on the full moon. They seem to bleed more on a full moon.

 

[kenny thomas]

Your vet is right. Weaning is perhaps THE most stressful event in a calf's life; if you give vaccines at that time - especially if you couple that with castrating, branding, etc., the likelihood of optimal response - if any - to those vaccines, is pretty low. Far better to have carried out all those vaccinations beforehand so that the calf already has established immunity to the pathogens before we make their immune systems tank with all that stress and cortisol release.

How about bought calves? As we have discussed before i work them as soon as they come off the trailer. I try to buy weaned but some aren't.
I use Inforce 3, Presponse, Alpha 7, Cydectin, castrate as needed. What i buy tomorrow will be worked by this time tomorrow night.

 

[fnfarms1]

Gathered cows/calves. Vaccinated/dewormed calves. Go to turn last group calves out in corral, there's a BWF 500lb steer calf down. Acting like he was seizing or something. It died. But to be fair, they weren't even weaned at that point, just deprecated off cows to work them. Freak deal I guess, stress, heart gave out, random reaction to a vaccine. No idea but lost 1000dollars today. I did go ahead and wean them

 

[Lucky]

Gathered cows/calves. Vaccinated/dewormed calves. Go to turn last group calves out in corral, there's a BWF 500lb steer calf down. Acting like he was seizing or something. It died. But to be fair, they weren't even weaned at that point, just deprecated off cows to work them. Freak deal I guess, stress, heart gave out, random reaction to a vaccine. No idea but lost 1000dollars today. I did go ahead and wean them

Was the steer bought or raised? Did he stress or freak out during the working process? Poked with hotshot too many times? That's an odd deal. We think it's best to wean by the signs but it's nearly impossible to get help lined up, get a day off, etc.. Last year we used Ferappease and thought it made a difference so will give it another try. We fence line wean for 6-10 days then turn out in different pasture from cows. We also vaccinate while we wean. Rarely have a sick one.

 

[simme]

Gathered cows/calves. Vaccinated/dewormed calves. Go to turn last group calves out in corral, there's a BWF 500lb steer calf down. Acting like he was seizing or something. It died. But to be fair, they weren't even weaned at that point, just deprecated off cows to work them. Freak deal I guess, stress, heart gave out, random reaction to a vaccine. No idea but lost 1000dollars today. I did go ahead and wean them

It is rare, but cattle can have a reaction to vaccines and go into anaphylactic shock. Treatment is an injection of epinephrine. Like an epi-pen for humans for allergic reactions.

 

[fnfarms1]

Was the steer bought or raised? Did he stress or freak out during the working process? Poked with hotshot too many times? That's an odd deal. We think it's best to wean by the signs but it's nearly impossible to get help lined up, get a day off, etc.. Last year we used Ferappease and thought it made a difference so will give it another try. We fence line wean for 6-10 days then turn out in different pasture from cows. We also vaccinate while we wean. Rarely have a sick one.

No that's the odd part of it. There were the usual idiots that bawl and make a big deal out of shots etc. he was pretty calm, my wife even told him he was pretty, lol. He is out of a cow I bought but has been raised here since birth, March-ish, had the cows since December. Sucks to raise one that long and kill over, I guess I need an Epi-Pen around

 

[Lucky]

No that's the odd part of it. There were the usual idiots that bawl and make a big deal out of shots etc. he was pretty calm, my wife even told him he was pretty, lol. He is out of a cow I bought but has been raised here since birth, March-ish, had the cows since December. Sucks to raise one that long and kill over, I guess I need an Epi-Pen around

I guess you never know. We had a friend years ago that lost several to a reaction from a modified live vaccine. They died pretty quick after getting the nasal spray. He fought sickness for several weeks after too.

 

[fnfarms1]

I guess you never know. We had a friend years ago that lost several to a reaction from a modified live vaccine. They died pretty quick after getting the nasal spray. He fought sickness for several weeks after too.

Mine was Covexin8, Virashield6, Noremectrin, and a dose of Synevex S for steers which he was

 

[Lucky_P]

How about bought calves? As we have discussed before i work them as soon as they come off the trailer. I try to buy weaned but some aren't.
I use Inforce 3, Presponse, Alpha 7, Cydectin, castrate as needed. What i buy tomorrow will be worked by this time tomorrow night.

KT, I'll defer to the guys who work with stocker calves on a daily basis. That's out of my wheelhouse as an old cow-calf guy. Those guys advocate for some things that seem counter-intuitive to me, but have worked for them in those high-stress calves.
I certainly like the Inforce-3 as the initial 'priming' viral vaccine for those purchased calves, and since they likely may not have seen a Clostridial, the Alpha-7 (or comparable) is essential - but they sure need a booster 2-3 weeks out for both the viral and Clostridial products, once they've settled in.
While I wouldn't advise it for the cow herd - you know I don't even recommend deworming adult cows - there's pretty good evidence that deworming with 2 classes (Cydectin & a white wormer, like Safeguard or Synanthic) at the same time is a good practice for those stocker calves that may or may not have ever 'seen' a wormer.

 

[coachg]

Probably should but when I have time and we can catch the group we want . 2 groups easy , one group a chore .

 

[Lucky]

The amount of operators both big and small that either don't vaccinate or only vaccinate once surprises me. If we bought calves from a salebarn we'd most likely vaccinate and quarantine them for 2 weeks. I understand why people don't work cattle but I feel like you should.

 

[fnfarms1]

Good friend that runs a bigger ranch here(1500acress, 500hd pairs) preg checked last nite for me. Discussing this deal he brought up needing epinephrine on hand. Said what I gave was all killed viruses so shouldn't. They were giving Gold One Shot and had a couple react to it. They sent it off for testing since his boss is a drug rep. It came back that the One Shot caused it. Just something to think over. if I hadrealized I would have had an epi pen or something on hand

 

[redcowsrule33]

there's pretty good evidence that deworming with 2 classes (Cydectin & a white wormer, like Safeguard or Synanthic) at the same time is a good practice for those stocker calves that may or may not have ever 'seen' a wormer.

What is your opinion then on the new Valcor dewormer?

 

[fnfarms1]

KT, I'll defer to the guys who work with stocker calves on a daily basis. That's out of my wheelhouse as an old cow-calf guy. Those guys advocate for some things that seem counter-intuitive to me, but have worked for them in those high-stress calves.
I certainly like the Inforce-3 as the initial 'priming' viral vaccine for those purchased calves, and since they likely may not have seen a Clostridial, the Alpha-7 (or comparable) is essential - but they sure need a booster 2-3 weeks out for both the viral and Clostridial products, once they've settled in.
While I wouldn't advise it for the cow herd - you know I don't even recommend deworming adult cows - there's pretty good evidence that deworming with 2 classes (Cydectin & a white wormer, like Safeguard or Synanthic) at the same time is a good practice for those stocker calves that may or may not have ever 'seen' a wormer.

Why wouldnt you deworm with 2 types of dewormers? Honestly curious. In my mind killing any and all parasites has to be good especially on animals that may be carrying God knows what