Veterinarians and why you don't use them

[hillsdown]

HD- but *would* you go to your veterinarian for classes rather than (or in addition to) the ag college if he *did* offer it? I wouldn't know what Canadian LA grads are like, but I'm told we have a handful of graduates who go to Canada every year. I have told you before that we would be extremely happy to have you here if you should decide to make the move north I think about 4 from the current graduating class already have job offers up there.

I think what is NOT taught in school is people skills ,and some just do not have it . Not only do you have to be compassionate to your actual clients but you have to be etiquettely correct to the ones that pay the bill . Personally I could care less as long as the practitioner knows what they are doing ,specifically , more than me . ;-)

Would I take/pay for a course instructed by a veterinarian , yes , as I have many times already .

 

[dun]

I'll stick with my vet and our relationship. He's terrible about returning calls, but if I call twice he knows it's something important. We used to do everything by ourselves, now it's easier to have him come out partly because it's an extra person to help work the stock. It's a 2 way street, he calls me and askes abut ostuff that isn;t in his knowledge/experience base. A couple of years ago he was offered the state vet job for this area, turned it down because it would have been more paperwork and less actaully working with the animals. I told him if he decided to bail on us to give me a heads up so I could sell out before hand. His wife is our SA vet and he does some of the more complex bone surgeries at the clinic. Prices are more then reasonable for either SA or LA, sometimes I don;t think they charge enough. But they're satisfied so I won't be complaining. When I've worked on an issue for a while and am completely flustered and frustrated and seriously worried, just talking to him calms me down and puts my mind at ease. he also has feelings for the animals and isn;t like one of the local vets that just sees them as a blank check.

 

[Jogeephus]

I think the animal's health should be the first priority however there is a point of diminishing returns in what the producer can spend on a cow as well as what the vet can afford to spend on site. The deal me and a few other producers in my area have with the vet is we pay him a yearly fee - based on size but is typically only $500 for a rather large operation. He comes out and looks at our operations and examines our procedures then he writes a prescription for what drugs we may need to keep the herd healthy. We also purchase these drugs through a couple of suppliers who he has made arrangements and they tack on a fee for him based on what we buy. This isn't hidden and we are aware of the charge. Out of courtesy and appreciation most will honor this agreement even though we don't actually have to. Just between me and another three producers he is servicing around 2000 brood cows and 1600 stockers so he is getting a pretty good check just off the drugs themselves.

For the more hands on stuff there are a few guys who play vet. These guys are not vets but they can sure palpate cattle better than any vet I've seen and they will come out and do the grunt work. Some of the dual vets (small/large) don't like these guys but I'd rather have them help me than the dual vets cause they do it every day and have the feel. This doesn't bother our main vet cause he doesn't have time for the field work cause he has so many producers he is seeing about. I don't know if he is doing right or not but we all appreciate him and he is always there if you have a question. Also with him having his hands in so many operations he knows a lot of what may be going around at the moment.

Each year he normally drop by - usually unannounced - and check in and see if we are having any problems. To me, he is a good vet and he is doing what he should do - taking care of the animals and I believe he is making pretty good money and EVEN has a life.

 

[tom4018]

We had a good local vet that retired, sold the clinic to another that was oringinally from this area. Had a need a couple weeks ago for some stroner antibiodics. Wife called clinic before lunch, by 2:00 he had not called so she tried again as I wanted to get the meds in them that evening. He finally called back the next day, daughter told what we had needed and we already got it, I think he is still wondering where we got it. He raised all his prices from the old vet.

Another vet that worked for the old vet started his own clinic about 35 miles away, been using him for all my farm calls, he drives the 35 miles for $15 less than the other guy comes 7 miles.
Called this guy several times for advice and always told him to send me a bill for his time, never has yet. I would gladly pay a small fee for his opinion. I like him and have got all my neighbors to using him.

We just use one for things we can't do ourselves. But like Hook would gladly say pay a $25 fee for a phone consult.

 

[regolith]

If a vet is competent, is helping my animals, and I can afford him, I'll probably use him quite a bit.

Believe me, a vet can be competent and still be of no use at all in helping resolve health problems - or limited use.

Some of the clinics here offer day classes in basic things like hoof trimming, calf rearing, reproductive management. They're not expensive. I haven't attended any because when I've attended similar things in the past they're generally aimed at the beginner, and there's little for an experienced person to learn with a vet whose time is taken up answering the most basic questions.
One of my bosses used to get the vet in to trim feet on a few cows, back when I was starting to trim feet, and we'd both watch and ask questions and learn. In that instance, we're paying for tuition rather than to get cows' feet fixed. Take note though that I rarely get a vet in to trim feet now - only if I can't find time to do them and in that instance I can hardly justify it because I still have to help the vet get the cows in and hold the rope while he's trimming.

A lot of the routine stuff that vets (or their technicians) here do is because the farmers aren't allowed. I'm not legally permitted to hold a syringe full of lepto vaccine, certain hormones or local anaesthetic. I can dehorn my calves without anaesthetic if I want to but I get the vet to do it because doing the job with anaesthetic significantly reduces their trauma.
I plead guilty of treating everything that looks as if she needs 'antibiotics' with white penicillin for 3 - 5 days because that's all I can get without consulting a vet and there have been instances in the past where I've called a vet to see an animal that needs something 'different' or 'stronger' and ended up culling her anyway, sometimes when the vet's discretion was not to treat her the way I thought she should be treated.

Charging for consultation is fair. My lawyer and accountant charge me for providing advice over the phone, why shouldn't a vet? The charge would certainly make me more reluctant to call when finances on farm are tight. My biggest complaint about vets is when they're wrong, gotta give them a certain amount of slack but only so far.
Just an example - and I don't blame any vet because both acted on the information they saw and the cow was treated appropriately:
A couple months ago at milking an 8 year old cow didn't milk out on one quarter, milk looked fine so I made a mental note to check for mastitis before milking her next. Saw her in the paddock later staggering around, frothing at the mouth - I left her there as the tracks were so poor I couldn't have got her home, fully expected to find her down or dead in the morning but she stumbled through the mud all the way to the milking shed then collapsed as soon as she reached the yard. I called the after-hours vet told them it was mastitis and I didn't have meds on hand to treat that sort of mastitis, vet came out found her hypothermic and nearly dead, treated her for milk fever and gave her antibiotics/anti-inflammatory 'just in case it helped' then came to where I was working and told me she was dying, and then looked at her and she'd sat up. Two days later I called my usual vet who came out and treated her for milk fever again and like the first vet, said the mastitis didn't cause this - though she was getting full treatment for toxic mastitis in addition. I asked him to come back to her again the next day. By then the mastitic quarter and the one next to it were turning purple and the skin sloughing off and I got to hear the vet say "I think we've under-estimated this infection". The following day I lifted her to her feet and both quarters were black and cold. We shot her - even with treatment most cows don't survive black mastitis.
In this case neither vet recognised the problem even though I told them she had mastitis and the rest of her symptoms progressed from the time she was identified as having mastitis. Both vets had decided it wasn't worth treating for black mastitis but had given her the appopriate drugs anyway 'just to be sure' or 'to prevent complications from being recumbent'. The vet bills were equivalent to the value of the cow but I'd wanted to give her the best chance to recover - she'd been a good cow.

Your business management lessons are more important than you might think. Something I never realised till working with a vet who just doesn't deal with the 'business' or paperwork side at all.

 

[sackshowcattle]

I have one vet at my clinic that I request hes good at what he does. The rest I have no use for. They just got a new vet and she is the down fall of the clinic. She convinced them to bump the farm call charge to almost double and put a 10 mile radius on it and charge almost 4 bucks a mile on top of the farm call charge over that. So cost is part of it for me. I had an older cow partial prolapse. She told us to get it back in as soon as possible to prevent damage and becoming a full prolapse. Not a problem. The cow was cleaned and put back together by the time she got there and ready for stitches. she was there for 10 minutes gave 2 shots and one stitch 300 dollar bill. looked at the bill 150 just to come the 23 miles and the rest of it was for being charged for 2 full bottles of meds that were partially used and she took with to use again. I think that was what stung the worst. Knowing this vet has the nerve to charge multiple clients for full bottles of meds that came out of the same bottle. This vet also wanted me to take a first time heifer to the clinic for a c section. I decided to give it an hour and it was just I caught her a little earlier in the labor process than I thought she was and had it on her own. I'm not saying there aren't plenty of great vets out there worth every penny, but the few that are quick to want to do major surgery or over charge for what they actually use and do are ruining it for all vets.

 

[Nite Hawk]

In our area there isn't a whole pile of vets available in general, and they charge a good penny for mileage plus fees, which I understand they have to do as they have to make a living and it costs to drive the distances that we have here.That is why most people in our area "pool" vet expenses unless it is an emmergency, in that case if the animal is mobile they are usually hauled into town instead of the vet coming out.
Because of the high costs of travel and vet fees, most people here do as much as possible themselves before even thinking of calling a vet. The first line of defense is calling an very experianced neighbor before calling a vet, unless it is an emergency.
Also, it can get frustrating if you know more than they do, and they end up charging you "for their lack of knowledge".
A neighbor had a young cow prolapse, and a young vet just out of school came out and sewed her up--wrong- which anybody who has ever sewed a prolapse up would know. Instead of criss -crossing the stitches back and forth cross the cows posterior, she sewed the cow up by sewing a few loops up and down beside the cows vulva. Of course the cow re-prolapsed and a different vet came out and did it right. All I could wonder was -"you paid $100,000 at vet school to learn to sew a cow up wrong, and I have never been to vet school and know how to do it right??" Plus charging the neighbor to do it wrong..?
At one time we had a real bad outbreak of sheep keds at one point, and of course some younger family members had the job of pulling the blood suckers off and flattening them,and once in a while the keds would stick and try to suck human blood. some of the animals were getting run down from blood loss, and I was trying to find a good treatment for the little buggers. When I asked the vet, he told me _"they don't suck blood"!. Well then you tell me when you squish them why is there a red blotch left behind? but he didn't believe me.
With that said there are good vets out there who when they say it will cost XYZ- it will cost fairly close to what they quote, but I have had it happen a number of times being quoted a certain price and when it was all said and done it was w-a-y above the quote.
When you live on a very small income it isn't a joke and when they want the full price right NOW, and won't take payments after gouging you, so you do everything you can to avoid their services when possible.
Canada has very few vet schools, so of course fewer vets, so they can charge higher prices because of lack of competition.
If I remember right about only 14 or so individuals are accepted from B.C per year for vet school, with corresponding and varying numbers per province across Canada.
A neighbor from Europe who was licensed overseas decided to get her Canadian ticket,and it cost her about $25,000 to up grade and take all the tests. It is a very controlled market here, and a difficult and expensive field to get into, and some of them charge accordingly. That said, yes I do use vet, but as little as possible. I will buy alot of my medicines from the vet instead of the feed store if the price is comparable,because some of them have helped with advice in the past, so I return the favor by giving them the business.
There are good vets out there,and who are good to deal with, but I have been "burned" so am careful.

 

[CKC1586]

CP- so it's a competence/knowledge issue in your situation? I know a DVM here who would have loved to solve that problem (does just repro work on everything from cows to camels), evidently your head vet wasn't near as interested.

HD- OK. So I'm interested in those classes you're taking at the local ag college. Food for thought: Would you take classes from your veterinarian instead? What would it be worth to you?

BTW, to the best of my knowledge, the large operations can get quite a bit from the drug companies, but not everything. Not the stuff that requires a DEA license or prescription, unless there's a DVM at the drug company supplying them with it.

What a grand idea! I would love to partake in an offering like this. BTW my vets are awesome and very patient with me and my questions! Have often "talked me thru" a situation and eliminated the need for a farm call. They are great!

 

[snake67]

Interesting way to start a post, isn't it?

So I'm taking a herd production medicine class and one of the things we've been discussing recently is why producers (beef, dairy, feedlot, hobby, large scale, etc) are using veterinarians less than in the past. And of course- the class has also been discussing how veterinarians have to approach the changing market in order to still work as veterinarians. I thought that CT would be a great place to pose my questions, since there's a lot of folks on here who either don't use a vet, or use one after consulting CT. :lol:

Tell me... why do you come here with your veterinary questions? no available veterinarian? incompetent veterinarian? cost? quicker? better answers? variety of responses? second opinion? better explanations with the answers?

What would your veterinarian have to do for you to feel it's worth your while to call him/her with your questions?

There's some discussion in the veterinary world about charging regular clients a flat fee per head (eg $1/cow/month) and they get A, B, and C veterinary services provided for their herd (eg providing vaccinations, preg checks, consultation). Think of it as a Herd Health Program you'd sign up for and you can talk to your veterinarian as needed. Some veterinarians have implemented this, and both they and their clients like it. From CT's perspective... does this type of arrangement interest you? why or why not?

The other concept that's been talked about extensively in the veterinary world is consultation charges. For instance, feedlots, swine operations, large dairies, usually have a consultant on staff. Not much need for a veterinarian to do procedures as most people are perfectly capable of dehorning, castrating, etc. Instead, veterinarians are giving advice on decreasing incidence of DOAs, mastitis, acidosis, etc or are called in to solve "wrecks." Lawyers, accountants, etc charge consultation fees; veterinarians are starting to follow the other professions and not give away free advice, esp when advice/information makes up the majority of the work they're doing.

How do CT members feel about paying for consultation? how would you decide whether something warrants consultation, and how much you'd be willing to pay for it? how would you decide who you're willing to consult with?

There was a study done recently where they concluded veterinarians wanted to give their clients more advice on improving the health/management of their herd, and ranchers wanted to talk to their veterinarians more about how to improve the health of their herd... but neither was happening. Do you folks agree that you'd like to talk to your vet more, or are you happy with the way things are right now?

I've heard quite a bit from the veterinary side. What I'm interested in right now is the rancher/farmer side of the equation. I want to hear your thoughts. Opinions, constructive criticism, vents, advice, etc all welcomed. Thanks.

We seldom use a veterinarian here. The skills on this farm are increasing every year when it comes to medicines and techniques for fixing medical problems. We also have the infrastructure here to do the work.

That being stated, we have two veterinarians we do use when we run into something that is beyond our abilities. One for cattle and one for sheep. They are both good guys but each seems to have his own specialty. And we do an annual herd/flock health inspection to keep things here on an even keel. Some would say it is wasted money - but I would not agree.

These boards are absolutely the last place I would come for veteriarian style help - some folks here are considered Gods yet I would not trust their advice any further than I could throw my 170 New Holland skidsteer

If a veterinarian truly wants to pass on information, then it would help if they did not come in and leave within thirty seconds of completing the job - I have never in the past ten years had one stay for lunch or coffee or whatever - despite being asked every time. I know that time is money - but we are never late in paying the bill. And if I might say so I have taught my wife to be an excellent cook! (LOL and ducking!)

I value their knowledge and believe me we use it when we need it - perhaps it is the fault of the veterinarian that there is not a little additional conversation?

Good luck in your courses MM.

Best to all

Bez

 

[Brute 23]

It costs too much. These vets charge a premium to work on pets and horses but with cattle I can not pay that amount. Its not that I don't want to... the money is just not there.

 

[TexasBred]

TB- and that makes sense; producers are doing more of the physical work and veterinarians relying on their knowledge more. The veterinary profession agrees and I think most don't mind not spending all day in the heat or cold. But, surely you do rely on various sources for current information. Feed store? cousin? neighbor? internet? nutritionist? vaccine rep? what information are you getting from them that you can't get from your veterinarian? or perhaps better said, what information does your veterinarian not have that causes him/her to be dispensable?

I've been on CT since 2004... I'm well aware there's plenty of good information on here and then plenty of misinformation. :lol: Some of it gets straightened out with enough posters responding, sometimes not though. Is it just cost (free) that brings you here and to whatever other sources of information you have?

MM feed and pharmacuetical reps. will promote their product at any price. That's their job so I never pay them any attention. The feed store is a great place to visit...sort of like the sale barn but the information being passed is usually less than dependable. I think any good veterinarian should have a better understanding of animal nutrition than most have. Many have zero knowledge of nutrition ( you can tell by all the Science Diet on the waiting room) :lol2: and I've known many give less than accurate advice to clients relative to nutrition.

I have three vets I've used off and on and all were excellent. One was head and shoulders above the others tho. He was very down to earth, spoke a language of very short descriptive terms rather than trying to impress with his vocabulary and was always eager for the client to know exactly what he was doing and why. Learned more from him than anybody. He now has one of the largest clinics in the area with about a half dozen vets working for him and folks will drive a long way to use him rather than the local vet next door. Like everything else folks like to feel their business is wanted and appreciated so there is some salesmanship and P.R. involved for the vet that wants to be successful.

 

[TexasBred]

Vets are like lawyers and bankers......absolutely worthless until you need one. ;-) When we had our dairy dispersal sale the entire herd from oldest to youngest averaged a bit over $4,000 per head. You cannot afford to NOT have a good vet on call when you are risking the loss of even one of these animals. He earned every penny he was paid and we gladly paid it.

 

[Sir Loin]

milkmaid

Excellent post!!
So I will step out of character and respond with serious answers.

Re:

Tell me... why do you come here with your veterinary questions? no available veterinarian? incompetent veterinarian? cost? quicker? better answers? variety of responses? second opinion? better explanations with the answers?

No to all of the above.
I come here mostly to learn what problems others are encountering and to keep up on the newer techniques in dealing with them.
To me this is a great place to find problems that I may need to brush up on or reevaluate my position through research, both historical and new.

Re:

What would your veterinarian have to do for you to feel it's worth your while to call him/her with your questions?

Does not apply as the 3 vets I use welcome calls for advise.

Re:

There's some discussion in the veterinary world about charging regular clients a flat fee per head (eg $1/cow/month) and they get A, B, and C veterinary services provided for their herd (eg providing vaccinations, preg checks, consultation). Think of it as a Herd Health Program you'd sign up for and you can talk to your veterinarian as needed. Some veterinarians have implemented this, and both they and their clients like it. From CT's perspective... does this type of arrangement interest you? why or why not?

For me it does NOT interest me as almost all of the aforementioned services I can perform my self.
But I am sure there are those who have less experience then I who could use this type arrangement. ( hobby farmers )

Re:

How do CT members feel about paying for consultation?

I have no problem with it. I think it's a good idea.

Re:

how would you decide whether something warrants consultation, and how much you'd be willing to pay for it?

I would have no problem in paying $25 for a ½ hr. consultation fee when I felt it was warranted.
Re:

how would you decide who you're willing to consult with?

There lies the problem with a consultation fee.
The vet would have to have a proven track record with me before I would agree to a consultation fee and not just dispense a cookie cutter response.

Re:

Do you folks agree that you'd like to talk to your vet more, or are you happy with the way things are right now?

I'm happy with the way things are right now?

Re:

I'm interested in right now is the rancher/farmer side of the equation. I want to hear your thoughts. Opinions, constructive criticism, vents, advice, etc

OK but remember "you asked for it "!!

Opinions:
Veterinarians are professionals and deserve the same pay and respect as other professionals.
constructive criticism:
Just because you have that sheepskin on the wall does not mean you know it all.
Respect is a two way street so learn to respect those who have been in the business for many years as they just might teach you what you can't learn from a book.
Learn to listen and not just talk.
Your people skills are as much a part of your profession as you knowledge.

Now here is one or two that has been eating at me for several years now and not just in the cattle industry. I'm seeing this on TV also.

Ladies, when you speak, " S L O W" down!
I don't know if it's just because I am old or not, but lately you ladies sound like a machine gun going off when you talk.
There should be a pause between sentences to give me time to digest what you just said or to ask a question if I wish.
Otherwise you sound like a used car salesman/woman.

Respectfully
SL

 

[Howdyjabo]

Plain and simple vets need to do like DRs are now.
They do the "complicated" stuff and have a practitioner to do the rest under their supervision.
they get a % of the practitioners check- and the practitioner doesn't have as much schooling to pay for.
Secondly most practitioners should be coming from a background of hands on work. So they can relate to the farmers better and actually know more about proper day to day management than most of the vets coming out of school in the last 30 yrs.

I think that alot of farmers would use a practitioner to do routine work. Mostly as another needed hand but one that should know how to do it right on top of that.

Schooling just costs too much to ever pencil out for a vet in an Agricultural setting-- there just isn't enough money in it.

I have a consultant that charges by the minute. He knows what I am doing, he has an extensive background in what I am doing.He understand the business end of what I do(so his recommendations are based on me making more money). He is a whizz at nutrition(a must have for a vet). I can get most answers that I need in 5 minutes or less. Money well spent.
I also use him to buy my meds. But....... he runs that competitively and I end up paying less than going anywhere else.
He has 1000's of customers like me. that little bit of money off each of us adds up.

He does joke that over the years he works his way out of money- as we pick up on things and don't call him again till something new shows up , over the years theres less new stuff.

 

[Ouachita]

After reading these post, I realize even more than before, that we are very fortunate to have an accessible DVM that is beyond reasonable in regards to what he charges. He is primarily a LA vet but does SM on Fridays, and I truly believe that those foofoo shytzoo lapsaoodles subsidize our large animals. (I think he makes as much on Friday as he does the rest of the week).
He charges $60 for a farm call. He has never been to my place because I would feel bad having him come out to diagnose an animal for that little money. We have not had the need to use him much in the few years we have had cattle, but when we have, we always take the animal to him.
I would certainly consider paying an annual retainer fee. It would make me feel better about having his, and his wifes cell phone numbers.

 

[djinwa]

I'm been further pondering this interesting thread, which illustrates how things are a bit backward.

In a free market, one would first identify demand, and then provide it to customers.

In our centrally planned economy, the government decides what we need, and when too much is produced, we have to create a demand.

We had a housing bubble because government decided everyone should own a home even if they couldn't afford it, and so policies were implemented to provide money to make too many houses, until the collapse.

We are now in an education bubble. Government has decided that every child should go to college. They make it easier by providing grants and cheap loans. How many kids would go to veterinary school if they had to pay the full cost?

In addition, the government schools decide how many slots to make available to students. So after pumping out so many graduates, you have to create a demand for them and ask producers why they don't use them more.

Have to remember that education is an industry, and they are happy to take money and produce students. Don't really care what happens to them afterwards. And by the way, with all the government money thrown at colleges, they can raise prices at will – tuition has gone up 3 times the rate of inflation.

There are many worthy students like MM who unfortunately have to use the system we have. Just seems we need to be more aware of how things really work. Which is why I've started a site to educate on the big picture:

www.thebigscam.org

 

[Ouachita]

Interesting reply djinwa, but can you start another thread? I do not disagree with your post, but I think MM has a valid question(s), and we should stay on topic.

 

[TexasBred]

Djinwa unlike politicians, lawyers and teachers we don't have an oversupply of veterinarians....even with the scholarships and grants available. Can't speak for other states but down here the curriculum is incredibly hard...downright brutal... It's easier to get into medical school than vet school and has been for 50 years that I'm aware of.

 

[milkmaid]

Not to stray too far off topic- but- the veterinary graduates are looking at an oversupply problem in the near future. The older veterinarians aren't retiring due to the economy, and we've just had some new veterinary schools open (eg Utah) or become AVMA accredited (non-US). I'd say it's more of a lack of available jobs/too many grads for the available jobs. (Since the new grads want to work *for* someone initially, they're limited to working for veterinary clinics that are hiring, rather than starting their own business.) As is quite obvious per this board, there are a lot of places without access to a local veterinarian. However, due to the amount of work y'all do on your own, a veterinarian couldn't be supported locally.

Not that it's your problem or necessarily ours or the AVMA's; it simply *is* and we just have to work with the hand we're dealt. I'm just thinking about what *I* need to do in order to become a quality veterinarian after graduation, and what I need to do for my clients or in order to acquire/retain clients. I understand the supply/demand issue Djinwa; the situation veterinarians are in right now is that they're looking for where the demand has gone. We either have to decrease the supply (not going to happen) or increase the demand. Limiting what producers/laymen can do on their own would increase the demand; I don't know as that will happen and I'm sure there'd be a lot of resistance to that. (I'm a client too- my veterinarian's worst client, I suspect lol, as I can do almost everything myself- I do understand the desire to do things yourself. I enjoy doing my own vet work, it saves me money, etc. I understand where you're coming from.) It sounds like most of the demand for veterinarians at the moment, per the board, is for emergencies, health certificates, prescription drugs (eg Nuflor), controlled vaccines/medications (eg sedation, Rabies/Bangs vaccinations), and some of you use veterinarians for information purposes as well. So how do I find an area (in terms of vetmed, not location) where there is demand for a veterinarian?

SL- thanks for the thoughts and I appreciate the last comment about slowing down. I think sometimes we try to go *fast* through the information that we assume is so basic you'd be bored if we slowed down. And I think most of you would understand what we're saying if we said it slower, and wish we'd just skip to the important/new information. But I'll keep it in mind.

For the rest of you; I'm hearing nutrition mentioned several times. Essential information? I'll be honest- if I had wanted to learn nutrition I would have become a nutritionalist. I wanted to learn medicine, surgery, and pathology - and so I came to veterinary school. I agree completely on SD and I know just enough nutrition to get by, and honestly am pretty comfortable with that. That said, I'm hearing quite a bit in the herd production class that nutrition is something a veterinarian has to know. (The other topic that's recommended is epidemiology/statistics as the veterinarian's role is shifting from individual management to herd management.) Your thoughts?

There's been a couple comments on communication skills and business. I agree. WSU is actually (the?) first veterinary school to implement a communication skills course in their curriculum. There has been recognization in the veterinary profession of the fact that many vets do not have good people skills and it hurts their business.

Keep the comments coming, thanks again~

 

[dun]

I've already said my piece but on the subject of "veterinarian's role is shifting from individual management to herd management" I view our vet almost as partner when it comes to herd health, mostly in the area of establishing a vaccination program. But that's a one shot deal unless the disease issues in the area or herd changes.