Trump returning public lands in Utah

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Bigfoot

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You'd probably have to live, and work there to really know. Notice I said work. I've heard, but don't know, that the states can't afford to own it. Outside looking in, that doesn't seem right though.
 

sim.-ang.king

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Caustic Burno":3lrlt4f0 said:
Good IMO as all that “Federal land” is unconstitutional.
That land belongs to the state and it’s residents to do with as they see fit.
But if the federal government doesn't own it, and care for it, the evil states, and private citizens will do evil nasty things to it.
 

Dave

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sim.-ang.king":3sf7311b said:
Caustic Burno":3sf7311b said:
Good IMO as all that “Federal land” is unconstitutional.
That land belongs to the state and it’s residents to do with as they see fit.
But if the federal government doesn't own it, and care for it, the evil states, and private citizens will do evil nasty things to it.

The federal government caring for it????? Do you know why you don't call the BLM to a kitchen fire? Because they would start a back fire in the living room.
I have dealt with lots of federal land managers in my life. The vast majority that I have met are educated beyond their ability to think.
 

TennesseeTuxedo

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Dave":2854rrxm said:
sim.-ang.king":2854rrxm said:
Caustic Burno":2854rrxm said:
Good IMO as all that “Federal land” is unconstitutional.
That land belongs to the state and it’s residents to do with as they see fit.
But if the federal government doesn't own it, and care for it, the evil states, and private citizens will do evil nasty things to it.

The federal government caring for it????? Do you know why you don't call the BLM to a kitchen fire? Because they would start a back fire in the living room.
I have dealt with lots of federal land managers in my life. The vast majority that I have met are educated beyond their ability to think.

I hear a lot of their EPA agents suffer from the same affliction.
 

HDRider

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TennesseeTuxedo":35v4wkhu said:
Dave":35v4wkhu said:
sim.-ang.king":35v4wkhu said:
But if the federal government doesn't own it, and care for it, the evil states, and private citizens will do evil nasty things to it.

The federal government caring for it????? Do you know why you don't call the BLM to a kitchen fire? Because they would start a back fire in the living room.
I have dealt with lots of federal land managers in my life. The vast majority that I have met are educated beyond their ability to think.

I hear a lot of their EPA agents suffer from the same affliction.
Can you give us an example TT?
 

TennesseeTuxedo

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HDRider":2vd186w0 said:
TennesseeTuxedo":2vd186w0 said:
Dave":2vd186w0 said:
The federal government caring for it????? Do you know why you don't call the BLM to a kitchen fire? Because they would start a back fire in the living room.
I have dealt with lots of federal land managers in my life. The vast majority that I have met are educated beyond their ability to think.

I hear a lot of their EPA agents suffer from the same affliction.
Can you give us an example TT?

Shouldn't have to. :D
 

Dave

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A friend of mine said that people complain about government employees sitting around doing nothing. He said that isn't the problem. If they did that it would just cost us their wages. The problem is they sit around thinking of things to justify their job. Those ideas become the problem.
 

HDRider

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Dave":33du6tb7 said:
A friend of mine said that people complain about government employees sitting around doing nothing. He said that isn't the problem. If they did that it would just cost us their wages. The problem is they sit around thinking of things to justify their job. Those ideas become the problem.
And,, how to grow their budgets and staff.
 

ddd75

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HDRider":1j9f0t1q said:
Dave":1j9f0t1q said:
A friend of mine said that people complain about government employees sitting around doing nothing. He said that isn't the problem. If they did that it would just cost us their wages. The problem is they sit around thinking of things to justify their job. Those ideas become the problem.
And,, how to grow their budgets and staff.
''

yep.. "hey, you know John, my good buddy? He's needs a job.. let's tell this idiots we need another levy for something and we'll all get a 10k raise and get john a job with us."
 

HDRider

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ddd75":3gatjggw said:
HDRider":3gatjggw said:
Dave":3gatjggw said:
A friend of mine said that people complain about government employees sitting around doing nothing. He said that isn't the problem. If they did that it would just cost us their wages. The problem is they sit around thinking of things to justify their job. Those ideas become the problem.
And,, how to grow their budgets and staff.
''

yep.. "hey, you know John, my good buddy? He's needs a job.. let's tell this idiots we need another levy for something and we'll all get a 10k raise and get john a job with us."
Think bigger, much, much bigger.
 

Bright Raven

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There is a term for the concept:

Empire-building.

the practice of obtaining more power, responsibility, or staff within an organization for the purposes of (making more money).

It is rampant in government when budgets are flush. It also occurs in private corporations.

The General Schedule or GS personnel scale is predicated on level of responsibility. That translates to how many subordinates you have. If a manager aspires to a higher GS level (more money), they must add subordinates. There is an exception for non-managerial professionals, for example, a toxicologist, veterinarian, medical doctor, engineer, etc. Those positions have higher GS ratings that are not based on number of subordinates.

The means to control it have long been known. James Madison was known for coining the term - tighten the purse strings. Anyone who has sat on the inside (I have) is aware. If you have watched, administration after administration has failed to find the courage to truly reinvent government based on a model that controls waste.
 

sim.-ang.king

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Bright Raven":vh7g96b5 said:
There is a term for the concept:

Empire-building.

the practice of obtaining more power, responsibility, or staff within an organization for the purposes of (making more money).

It is rampant in government when budgets are flush. It also occurs in private corporations.

The General Schedule or GS personnel scale is predicated on level of responsibility. That translates to how many subordinates you have. If a manager aspires to a higher GS level (more money), they must add subordinates. There is an exception for non-managerial professionals, for example, a toxicologist, veterinarian, medical doctor, engineer, etc. Those positions have higher GS ratings that are not based on number of subordinates.

The means to control it have long been known. James Madison was known for coining the term - tighten the purse strings. Anyone who has sat on the inside (I have) is aware. If you have watched, administration after administration has failed to find the courage to truly reinvent government based on a model that controls waste.
Ever since FDR the government has gone from running it like a business and working with what they take in, too trying to grow government on borrowed money and stolen land.
 

Bright Raven

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sim.-ang.king":14780m2a said:
Bright Raven":14780m2a said:
There is a term for the concept:

Empire-building.

the practice of obtaining more power, responsibility, or staff within an organization for the purposes of (making more money).

It is rampant in government when budgets are flush. It also occurs in private corporations.

The General Schedule or GS personnel scale is predicated on level of responsibility. That translates to how many subordinates you have. If a manager aspires to a higher GS level (more money), they must add subordinates. There is an exception for non-managerial professionals, for example, a toxicologist, veterinarian, medical doctor, engineer, etc. Those positions have higher GS ratings that are not based on number of subordinates.

The means to control it have long been known. James Madison was known for coining the term - tighten the purse strings. Anyone who has sat on the inside (I have) is aware. If you have watched, administration after administration has failed to find the courage to truly reinvent government based on a model that controls waste.
Ever since FDR the government has gone from running it like a business and working with what they take in, too trying to grow government on borrowed money and stolen land.

One can spend precious time lamenting over what the government does wrong, when it started, who is responsible and how do you fix it. It is not productive. The nation has chosen sides, one side (the right) points at the other side (the left) and the other side simply points back. The fact is, neither side has demonstrated they can set a new course. Wonder why that is?
 

Rafter S

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Bright Raven":gvs147ux said:
sim.-ang.king":gvs147ux said:
Bright Raven":gvs147ux said:
There is a term for the concept:

Empire-building.

the practice of obtaining more power, responsibility, or staff within an organization for the purposes of (making more money).

It is rampant in government when budgets are flush. It also occurs in private corporations.

The General Schedule or GS personnel scale is predicated on level of responsibility. That translates to how many subordinates you have. If a manager aspires to a higher GS level (more money), they must add subordinates. There is an exception for non-managerial professionals, for example, a toxicologist, veterinarian, medical doctor, engineer, etc. Those positions have higher GS ratings that are not based on number of subordinates.

The means to control it have long been known. James Madison was known for coining the term - tighten the purse strings. Anyone who has sat on the inside (I have) is aware. If you have watched, administration after administration has failed to find the courage to truly reinvent government based on a model that controls waste.
Ever since FDR the government has gone from running it like a business and working with what they take in, too trying to grow government on borrowed money and stolen land.

One can spend precious time lamenting over what the government does wrong, when it started, who is responsible and how do you fix it. It is not productive. The nation has chosen sides, one side (the right) points at the other side (the left) and the other side simply points back. The fact is, neither side has demonstrated they can set a new course. Wonder why that is?

Because they can't stop pointing fingers long enough to work together to get something done.
 

Bestoutwest

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Rafter S":2eimrvll said:
Bright Raven":2eimrvll said:
sim.-ang.king":2eimrvll said:
Ever since FDR the government has gone from running it like a business and working with what they take in, too trying to grow government on borrowed money and stolen land.

One can spend precious time lamenting over what the government does wrong, when it started, who is responsible and how do you fix it. It is not productive. The nation has chosen sides, one side (the right) points at the other side (the left) and the other side simply points back. The fact is, neither side has demonstrated they can set a new course. Wonder why that is?

Because they can't stop pointing fingers long enough to work together to get something done.


These last two posts are spot on. We need both sides to keep one side from hoarding too much from the public coffers and the other from taking too much to put in those same coffers. But they need to work together. Until that happens, we're all going to suffer.
 

Rafter S

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Bestoutwest":t1ti2n0s said:
Rafter S":t1ti2n0s said:
Bright Raven":t1ti2n0s said:
One can spend precious time lamenting over what the government does wrong, when it started, who is responsible and how do you fix it. It is not productive. The nation has chosen sides, one side (the right) points at the other side (the left) and the other side simply points back. The fact is, neither side has demonstrated they can set a new course. Wonder why that is?

Because they can't stop pointing fingers long enough to work together to get something done.


These last two posts are spot on. We need both sides to keep one side from hoarding too much from the public coffers and the other from taking too much to put in those same coffers. But they need to work together. Until that happens, we're all going to suffer.

I know we aren't supposed to get too heavily into politics here, and I don't want to cross that line, but does anyone know when or why Congress got so partisan? I know there have been political parties going back to George Washington (although if I recall my history lessons he didn't belong to one), but they used to not vote strictly on party lines like they usually do now. I seem to remember it starting about the time Newt Gingrich was speaker of the House, but I'm not sure. (And I'm not bashing him. I usually lean way to the conservative side of politics, although I don't blindly follow any party.)
 

Bright Raven

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Rafter S":2grxildq said:
Bestoutwest":2grxildq said:
Rafter S":2grxildq said:
Because they can't stop pointing fingers long enough to work together to get something done.


These last two posts are spot on. We need both sides to keep one side from hoarding too much from the public coffers and the other from taking too much to put in those same coffers. But they need to work together. Until that happens, we're all going to suffer.

I know we aren't supposed to get too heavily into politics here, and I don't want to cross that line, but does anyone know when or why Congress got so partisan? I know there have been political parties going back to George Washington (although if I recall my history lessons he didn't belong to one), but they used to not vote strictly on party lines like they usually do now. I seem to remember it starting about the time Newt Gingrich was speaker of the House, but I'm not sure. (And I'm not bashing him. I usually lean way to the conservative side of politics, although I don't blindly follow any party.)

You and I seem to have the same recollection. Newt Gingrich was a magician as Speaker. He was very effective at keeping it along party lines. However, it goes back further. In fact, it predates our government. The term "whip" goes back to our British roots:

In countries influenced by the British political system, a whip is an official of a political party whose task is to ensure party discipline in a legislature. Whips are the party's "enforcers"; they invite their fellow legislators to attend voting sessions and to vote according to the official party policy.
 

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