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To everyone who thinks brangus are wild

cypressfarms

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This evening went out to check on the cow group. Had one commercial brangus that was close - this would be her second calf. Shined the spotlight out ahead, and sure enough two sets of eyes. Pulled up with the mule, walked over, took the newborn calf down and banded it and tagged it while the moma watched from about 6 or 8 feet away - mooing at the calf the whole time. No problems whatsoever. I love low birthweight bulls. I love good cows even better.

Not all brangus' are wild and ornery. I cull for disposition, and any cow that will not let me work her newborn is changing zip codes! Having said this, I am respectful of the cow calf needing bonding time. I do my job quick, and let them be to develop that necessary moma calf relationship. Over 50 brangus girls that will let us do our jobs. Now if someone new had walked into the paddock, it would have been a defferent story.

I have some of the most gently brangus' around, but again I cull hard for disposition. If I have a really good moma, I will keep heifers from her. All we seem to hear on the board is how wild brangus and tigers are; we'll they can be some pretty tame and good moma's as well. On average I wouldn't compare them to herefords, but if you cull the bad tempered one's out, after several years you begin to have a real nice gentle herd.

Pics to come soon, ofcourse. I never want to disappoint Beefy and not put up big eared pics!
 

Loch Valley Fold

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Its always nice to work with calm cattle & your doing the right thing by culling on bad temperament not a lot of people do.
 

jcarkie

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my brangus cows are that way in the field, but when you pen them close they are totaly different. they tear stuff up or jump.
 

bigbull338

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every1 should cull on temperment.i know i wont buy any wild cows.your building a gentle herd of cattle the way your culling.
 

TexasBred

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Good job Cypress. Mine are gentle as well. Like any cow they don't care too much about being penned but have never had one go crazy in the pen or pastures. Had one beautiful registered brangus once that was a complete idiot. Carried her to the sale just knowing she would really "ring the bell". She came flying into the ring, fell down, jumped at the fence and they started her at $.42....a packer ended up with her which was probably where she needed to go.
 

Brute 23

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With our Brangus type cattle, you can not do that. If a calf bellers in the pasture the whole herd will group up and charge at you. Its pretty neat to watch them organize so quick. I think thats a good thing. IF you pin them, you can do what ever I want, just not out in the pasture.

When we wean calves we cull the heifers hard on temperment. They get fed in the pins for a week or two before they are turned out. IF they have not straighted up by then they usually won't and go down the road.
 

novatech

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There is a lot of diference between a cow with a bad temprament and a cow that protects her calf.
If you continue treating your cattle as if they have been culled for this trait you may find youself in the hospital.
Any cow with a new calf should be treated with a lot of caution.
 

Caustic Burno

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cypressfarms":11mu8465 said:
This evening went out to check on the cow group. Had one commercial brangus that was close - this would be her second calf. Shined the spotlight out ahead, and sure enough two sets of eyes. Pulled up with the mule, walked over, took the newborn calf down and banded it and tagged it while the moma watched from about 6 or 8 feet away - mooing at the calf the whole time. No problems whatsoever. I love low birthweight bulls. I love good cows even better.

Not all brangus' are wild and ornery. I cull for disposition, and any cow that will not let me work her newborn is changing zip codes! Having said this, I am respectful of the cow calf needing bonding time. I do my job quick, and let them be to develop that necessary moma calf relationship. Over 50 brangus girls that will let us do our jobs. Now if someone new had walked into the paddock, it would have been a defferent story.

I have some of the most gently brangus' around, but again I cull hard for disposition. If I have a really good moma, I will keep heifers from her. All we seem to hear on the board is how wild brangus and tigers are; we'll they can be some pretty tame and good moma's as well. On average I wouldn't compare them to herefords, but if you cull the bad tempered one's out, after several years you begin to have a real nice gentle herd.

Pics to come soon, ofcourse. I never want to disappoint Beefy and not put up big eared pics!

I have a couple when penned can get the wrinkles out of your back pocket. All brangus come with a box of matches and a stick of T-N-T some keep the matches in their pocket others lit the fuse.
 

grannysoo

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I bet you spend a lot of time with your cattle too.......

Culling is good, but it's not the only thing. Cattle are dumb, but they are not stupid. Over a period of time, they can learn who their friends and foes are.
 

dun

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We've only had the occasioanl Brangus over the years. Had a bunch of yearling in 1960 that would try to kill anyone that was within 100 feet or so. All of the rest haven;t been wild as much as just plain stubborn.
 

cypressfarms

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Caustic Burno":318lcqir said:
I have a couple when penned can get the wrinkles out of your back pocket. All brangus come with a box of matches and a stick of T-N-T some keep the matches in their pocket others lit the fuse.

This is a very key difference. Out in the pasture, any cow must let me tag and band a calf without charging me. I don't care how good she is, if I can't do it when the calf is born, she's not worth it. There have been times when I arrived too late to tag/band but only because the calf caught on and would run away. I've sold some nice looking Brangus cows that wouldn't let me handle their calves. I don't mind if they come close and stand right next to me, just don't get snotty at me.

The big difference that I can tolerate is when they are worked. If a brangus gets in the corral and gets a little hot, I have no problem with that. I work them very carefully to not antagonize them. To me this is acceptable behavior - they are pinned in and sometimes come out of the corner like a cat. ;-) But out in the pasture it's a different story. There are so many good tempered cows, why risk my health over one? Last spring I sold a cow that was 5 years old with her calf ( 1300 pounder that consistently weaned calves above my average). After she had the calf, she charged me and wouldn't let me get within 10 feet. Two of the guys that helped me work the cows when we seperated her called me crazy for selling her. Maybe if I were a huge ranch full time and had the facilities that would be one thing, but with the hands on time I spend with my cows, I don't want trouble. To be honest that's why my herd has been inching more and more torward Beefmaster every year.
 

novatech

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cypressfarms":1hfx5mfh said:
Caustic Burno":1hfx5mfh said:
I have a couple when penned can get the wrinkles out of your back pocket. All brangus come with a box of matches and a stick of T-N-T some keep the matches in their pocket others lit the fuse.

This is a very key difference. Out in the pasture, any cow must let me tag and band a calf without charging me. I don't care how good she is, if I can't do it when the calf is born, she's not worth it. There have been times when I arrived too late to tag/band but only because the calf caught on and would run away. I've sold some nice looking Brangus cows that wouldn't let me handle their calves. I don't mind if they come close and stand right next to me, just don't get snotty at me.

The big difference that I can tolerate is when they are worked. If a brangus gets in the corral and gets a little hot, I have no problem with that. I work them very carefully to not antagonize them. To me this is acceptable behavior - they are pinned in and sometimes come out of the corner like a cat. ;-) But out in the pasture it's a different story. There are so many good tempered cows, why risk my health over one? Last spring I sold a cow that was 5 years old with her calf ( 1300 pounder that consistently weaned calves above my average). After she had the calf, she charged me and wouldn't let me get within 10 feet. Two of the guys that helped me work the cows when we seperated her called me crazy for selling her. Maybe if I were a huge ranch full time and had the facilities that would be one thing, but with the hands on time I spend with my cows, I don't want trouble. To be honest that's why my herd has been inching more and more torward Beefmaster every year.
If you had cattle that behaved in the corral you would not have to tag in the pasture. If they are calm in the corral you can pair them up and tag. If mine do not behave in the corral they are culled.
This calf protection is something built in to Brahmans. To my knowledge it is something that has never been culled for in the Brahman breed. Given that, anything with Brahman influence is highly susceptible to having this same trait, including Beefmaster. It may not show up with the first or second calf, or ever for that matter but there is always the chance. Letting a brangus stand next to you while tagging is one of the most life threatening things I have ever herd of. Getting a tag in a calf's ear while it is still in the pasture is not all that important. Single trait selection for that trait should be at the very tale end of priorities.
I can put my hands on any of my cows in the pasture or the coral most anytime I want. I work my cattle in the pens by myself with out fear or them getting excited. They have good temperament. I do not ever attempt to mess with their calf for at least 2 weeks after birth unless it is absolutely necessary.
To me this is no different than trying to give your bull a sponge bath while a heifer in heat stands in front of him.
You can look at it another way. Every time you out there in the pasture installing this highly important ear tag you are using your life as the test for culling.
 

cypressfarms

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novatech":1pcbmj3l said:
If you had cattle that behaved in the corral you would not have to tag in the pasture. If they are calm in the corral you can pair them up and tag. If mine do not behave in the corral they are culled.
Letting a brangus stand next to you while tagging is one of the most life threatening things I have ever herd of. Getting a tag in a calf's ear while it is still in the pasture is not all that important. Single trait selection for that trait should be at the very tale end of priorities.
I can put my hands on any of my cows in the pasture or the coral most anytime I want. I work my cattle in the pens by myself with out fear or them getting excited. They have good temperament. I do not ever attempt to mess with their calf for at least 2 weeks after birth unless it is absolutely necessary.
To me this is no different than trying to give your bull a sponge bath while a heifer in heat stands in front of him.
You can look at it another way. Every time you out there in the pasture installing this highly important ear tag you are using your life as the test for culling.

Nova, we'll have to agree to disagree. I work my cows twice a year, and they know it. From the moment they enter the corral, I do everything possible to make the stay their quick and easy, but they will get incrementally "hotter" the longer they are kept in. For me to sort calves at that point would be fruitless. At that point the cows are in the "cornered animal" stage.

In the pasture, however, the cows are not cornered and are naturally much calmer. I do not have so many cows that I cannot know the temperment of each one. I do not feel threatened when tagging/banding in the pasture. If I do feel threatened in any way, I don't tag the calf. I'm not an idiot - no cow is worth me getting hurt, and yes I have had times many times when a cow stands close watching me while I tag the calf; all the while I watch her to see her behavior. However, I have been reading cows for 28 years now without an incident - this is not my first rodeo. I do have several cows that go off to calve, and will walk their calf away from me if I try to approach - this is still acceptable to me.

My cows do not go into a corral enough to be "comfortable". I could see, however, how some ranchers are able to put cows in corrals enough so that they are calm while in the corral. Or maybe even have a barn situation where the cows are actually looking forward to going in (as in here comes food). I don't have any of these luxuries. All of my cows are outside permanent, and only go into the corral to get worked - so they know what's coming.

I consider this single trait culling point the most important culling point for me, but that's my opinion. I am the only alpha in the pasture (including the bulls), and will not tolerate challenges. However, I do not only cull for disposition, there are many other factors for a cow to qualify.

I do respect your opinion, however Nova, it just doesn't work with me.
 

dun

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cypressfarms":293uwflz said:
My cows do not go into a corral enough to be "comfortable". I could see, however, how some ranchers are able to put cows in corrals enough so that they are calm while in the corral. Or maybe even have a barn situation where the cows are actually looking forward to going in (as in here comes food). I don't have any of these luxuries. All of my cows are outside permanent, and only go into the corral to get worked - so they know what's coming.

When we're weaning we wean the calves in the pasture that they have to enter the working pens for water and their grain. After they get used to coming in I'll change things around so they have to walk down the alleyway and through the chute to get the grain. When they're all at the grain I'll open the gate that will allow them to go back into the working pens. Sometimes I'll close the gate to the pasture so they have to hang around in the working pens. Doesn;t make any difference for the steers but it makes the heifrs a whoile lot easier to work as the get older. The only time it causes a problem is when I want to run one in to breed and they're all fighting to get into the alleyway and I have chase some off and just run some through the chute to get to the one I want.
 

Caustic Burno

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Cypress this is just different management styles I have an old Brangus I can catch with a piece of hay string and walk in the trailer. But the gates of he!! and all there fury will be upon you if you mess with her calf, that gets her a home and hay for another year here.
 

4CTophand

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bigbull338":337hwv20 said:
every1 should cull on temperment.i know i wont buy any wild cows.your building a gentle herd of cattle the way your culling.
Best answer yet
 

spinandslide

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Ive said it before and Ill say it again..a momma cow can be protective of her calf, but she better remember that Im the one wyho takes care of and feeds her..period.

I dont keep nasty broodmares around and I SURE wont keep nasty momma cows around. Im not a big person and I dont relish getting injured or killed...

Im glad to see this post. My heifer is Brangus, due for her first calf in early Feb. She was interesting to handle by herself when I first got her, as she'd been a range cow in a herd her entire life and with a herd..and now she was by herself(not ideal, but had to happen that way). had alot of friends make comments on her being Brangus..but I love this breed..they are absolutely beautiful and handle this climate REALLY well!

She has mellowed alot, I can hand feed her and scratch her big ole floppity flop ears. She knows she hot stuff though.. :lol:

I am going to be on guard when she calves, as I would with ANY momma cow..heifer or otherwise, I did not know.
 

Brandonm22

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Be real careful. Some of those "friend" cows that aren't afraid of you are the ones with the least fear of popping you (like they do their cow "friends") if they think you are messing with something that they consider "theirs" like their calf.
 

spinandslide

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Brandonm22":218walxo said:
Be real careful. Some of those "friend" cows that aren't afraid of you are the ones with the least fear of popping you (like they do their cow "friends") if they think you are messing with something that they consider "theirs" like their calf.
Good advice..my heifer got the business end of a stockpole the other day when she wouldnt back up when I went to feed her. Shes not what I call a pet, but I can work around her and not be constantly afraid of being launched into orbit. :oops: THAT is my goal....should be safe to work around an handle
 

novatech

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spinandslide":1aok8uem said:
Ive said it before and Ill say it again..a momma cow can be protective of her calf, but she better remember that Im the one wyho takes care of and feeds her..period.
In my area we have ice cream that is only made from happy cows,as per Bluebell advertising.
So you only make hamburger from the most intelligent cows? :lol2:
 
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