Some of Greenwillow's Cattle

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Photos not the best quality, too late in evening, too hurried. Taken at the lease, where fence work is continuously in progress. A several week dry spell left the grass hurting, and pond needs a lot of work, so I have since moved them all to headquarters to eat down the three and four foot tall wilderness in the lot here. BCS has since improved greatly.

Bull calf pictured weighed 486 on the 11th of August, born on March 21.

Big bull will be 3 in November.
 
greenwillowhereford II":1md2txgy said:
Photos not the best quality, too late in evening, too hurried. Taken at the lease, where fence work is continuously in progress. A several week dry spell left the grass hurting, and pond needs a lot of work, so I have since moved them all to headquarters to eat down the three and four foot tall wilderness in the lot here. BCS has since improved greatly.

Bull calf pictured weighed 486 on the 11th of August, born on March 21.

Big bull will be 3 in November.


There is nothing like watching a field full of Herefords. Hard to explain the feeling to someone that doesn't love Herefords. Looks like you are doing someting right. TY for sharing. Great name in F150. why not F350? LOL
 
Nice calves, and bull. Very sorry that I didnt get back to you sooner. I would have tried to post them for you.

I really wasn't trying to avoid you I just got busy and also had some computer problems. I have been chopping pasture ( weeds) and havent got back into the house before 10.00 or 10.30 since last week.
Tractor broke tonight so I gave up till tommorow evening. Thanks Jay Hudnut.
 
Glad you like 'em. I figured that F250 and F350 and F450 etc might come along later....

I have to keep posting a few pics now and then to keep bigbull 338 reminded of that soft spot he has for those old Herefords. :)
 
Glad you like 'em. I figured that F250 and F350 and F450 etc might come along later....


I didn't know you like large cattle. I am glad I am not the only one.

If the F-150 name is a 1/2 ton or 1,000 pounds, and the F-250 name is a 3/4 ton or 1,500 pounds, and the F-350 name is a 1 ton or 2,000 pounds, then naming your next could be "Super Duty" after a Remitall bull.
 
HerefordSire":3dt0ljw5 said:
Glad you like 'em. I figured that F250 and F350 and F450 etc might come along later....


I didn't know you like large cattle. I am glad I am not the only one.

If the F-150 name is a 1/2 ton or 1,000 pounds, and the F-250 name is a 3/4 ton or 1,500 pounds, and the F-350 name is a 1 ton or 2,000 pounds, then naming your next could be "Super Duty" after a Remitall bull.

2,400# is about the absolute limit that I want a mature bull to weigh, and he needs to be moderate enough frame for the 1,800-2,400# to be packed on right. The F150 and so on would be more relative to how powerful the genetics became as they were stacked.

You really should look into the Harper Cattle Co. of Texas and New Mexico. They purchased the old Ochs Bros herd of Gunnison Colorado. Now there are some massive beef machines. Bulls up to 3,245# and 63" tall. Cows that weigh a ton. At least they did in Colorado. You might suppose that they've moderated to some extent in Texas and New Mexico.
 
Nice cattle greenwillow. In picture 4 it looks like you have a good "chore boy" as my grandpa would call it ;-) .

I hope you don't mind, but since you mentioned Harper Cattle I thought I'd post this picture. Every time I look at it I always have to clean up the drool. If more Hereford bulls looked like this we would be in the money business.

OB-Joyful.jpg
 
CPL":27z01bon said:
Nice cattle greenwillow. In picture 4 it looks like you have a good "chore boy" as my grandpa would call it ;-) .

I hope you don't mind, but since you mentioned Harper Cattle I thought I'd post this picture. Every time I look at it I always have to clean up the drool. If more Hereford bulls looked like this we would be in the money business.

OB-Joyful.jpg


I go to their websight and they do have some massive bulls. EPD's are lacking but that may be from no reports on old cows and calves.
 
greenwillowhereford II":4ar4vvgx said:
You really should look into the Harper Cattle Co. of Texas and New Mexico. They purchased the old Ochs Bros herd of Gunnison Colorado. Now there are some massive beef machines. Bulls up to 3,245# and 63" tall. Cows that weigh a ton. At least they did in Colorado. You might suppose that they've moderated to some extent in Texas and New Mexico.


I'm not sure moderated is the wordage I'd use. I heard they went to bee nice.
 
CPL":1qspskme said:
Nice cattle greenwillow. In picture 4 it looks like you have a good "chore boy" as my grandpa would call it ;-) .

I hope you don't mind, but since you mentioned Harper Cattle I thought I'd post this picture. Every time I look at it I always have to clean up the drool. If more Hereford bulls looked like this we would be in the money business.

OB-Joyful.jpg
There is no question that this picture of this bull is one to drool over! He fits the mold of the Hereford Bull Phenotype that most breeders have in their mind as the perfect image.

That said, I question whether THIS is the optimal IDEAL PROFIT PRODUCER that the current Bull selection choices profess to be the model for the ICON of perfection, given that the FOCUS is being placed on 1250# momma cows, and in light of the feed and fuel costs (including land and pasture values)going out of sight! He is a beautiful animal - "droolable" for certain, but is he what we want to be making our current brood cows for the future!? :shock:

I think not.

DOC HARRIS
 
DOC HARRIS":39926jgi said:
CPL":39926jgi said:
Nice cattle greenwillow. In picture 4 it looks like you have a good "chore boy" as my grandpa would call it ;-) .

I hope you don't mind, but since you mentioned Harper Cattle I thought I'd post this picture. Every time I look at it I always have to clean up the drool. If more Hereford bulls looked like this we would be in the money business.

http://harpercattle.com/sires/images/OB-Joyful.jpg[/ig][/quote]There is no question that this picture of this bull is one to drool over! He fits the mold of the Hereford Bull Phenotype that most breeders have in their mind as the perfect image.

That said, I question whether THIS is the optimal IDEAL PROFIT PRODUCER that the current Bull selection choices profess to be the model for the [b][i]ICON[/i][/b] of perfection, given that the FOCUS is being placed on 1250# momma cows, and in light of the feed and fuel costs (including land and pasture values)going out of sight! He is a beautiful animal - "droolable" for certain, but is he what we want to be making our current brood cows for the future!? :shock:

I think not.

DOC HARRIS[/quote]

Doc, the penotype is where it needs to be and even though he is a little out of range (being a little over 7 in FS) that does not mean he is worthless. A similar type bull Rambo 279R sold for a ton and made a lot of headlines. I've always said that he himself is too big, but if the current owners could get a son that was in acceptable FS range and mature weight, with the same body and power, they'd have a real nice bull. I think the same about 57H. With all that being said, I would rather have 10 7 Frame cows that were more ideal in phenotype and moderate them than have ten 4,5,6 Frame cows that'd I'd have to add body, depth, soundness, etc. Frame 7 cows don't scare me, I think they have their place. I think alot of breeders are thinking they have to scarifice quality for moderate size and it shouldn't be that way.
 
DOC HARRIS":2cosydv3 said:
CPL":2cosydv3 said:
Nice cattle greenwillow. In picture 4 it looks like you have a good "chore boy" as my grandpa would call it ;-) .

I hope you don't mind, but since you mentioned Harper Cattle I thought I'd post this picture. Every time I look at it I always have to clean up the drool. If more Hereford bulls looked like this we would be in the money business.

OB-Joyful.jpg
There is no question that this picture of this bull is one to drool over! He fits the mold of the Hereford Bull Phenotype that most breeders have in their mind as the perfect image.

That said, I question whether THIS is the optimal IDEAL PROFIT PRODUCER that the current Bull selection choices profess to be the model for the ICON of perfection, given that the FOCUS is being placed on 1250# momma cows, and in light of the feed and fuel costs (including land and pasture values)going out of sight! He is a beautiful animal - "droolable" for certain, but is he what we want to be making our current brood cows for the future!? :shock:

I think not.

DOC HARRIS

I have to agree with Doc.......He would make a great terminal sire but I wouldn't want to keep the rather large cows that he would produce.
 
DOC HARRIS":17m0u42r said:
That said, I question whether THIS is the optimal IDEAL PROFIT PRODUCER that the current Bull selection choices profess to be the model for the ICON of perfection, given that the FOCUS is being placed on 1250# momma cows, and in light of the feed and fuel costs (including land and pasture values)going out of sight! He is a beautiful animal - "droolable" for certain, but is he what we want to be making our current brood cows for the future!? :shock:

I think not.

DOC HARRIS



I agree with your statement Doc. Most seedstock breeders are too focused on the big show style bulls and cows and overlook the value of the smaller cow or bull. I like a bull to be thick and long but I do not want that much frame for raising retained heifers, it would be fine for terminal calves. Seed stock producers often find themselves between a brick and a hard spot because the commercial man wants something that looks impressive instead of realizing the value of a moderate bull or cow, so I can't say that the seed stock producer is at fault or wrong for breeding large frame stock. I am striving to use use bulls that keep the herds frame between 5 and 6 but it can make it difficult to sell breeding stock to others.
 
CPL":1nllmugz said:
Doc, the penotype is where it needs to be and even though he is a little out of range (being a little over 7 in FS) that does not mean he is worthless. A similar type bull Rambo 279R sold for a ton and made a lot of headlines. I've always said that he himself is too big, but if the current owners could get a son that was in acceptable FS range and mature weight, with the same body and power, they'd have a real nice bull. I think the same about 57H. With all that being said, I would rather have 10 7 Frame cows that were more ideal in phenotype and moderate them than have ten 4,5,6 Frame cows that'd I'd have to add body, depth, soundness, etc. Frame 7 cows don't scare me, I think they have their place. I think alot of breeders are thinking they have to scarifice quality for moderate size and it shouldn't be that way.

I went to an Ochs Bros sale in the 90s with my Dad. Those were the biggest and most impressive Hereford cattle I'd ever laid eyes on. I believe the Duracell bull they had was the "biggest of the big" back then. They were magnificent monsters living in an almost utopic setting. I tried to get my Dad to buy one of their bulls, as he was thinking of departing from the Anxiety 4th base that we had bred for 25 years. No doubt one of their bulls would have moved our FS4 and FS5 cattle up the range a bit.

CPL, you're correct in that this bull, OB Joyful, isn't that much different in stature and type from Rambo. I agree that he isn't "worthless" as a breeding tool in the right situation and, of the herd bulls that Ochs had, he is probably the most "moderate" and thrifty looking of the lot. You could do a lot worse, particularly if a little increase in FS was not a problem. Now, regarding FS7, I've got a bull in that range and I think a little moderation from there is a very good place to go, particularly for my environment. But most of all, I'd sure like to see more Hereford cattle with the volume, in relation to size, that OB Joyful shows....and Rambo. And I think that can be achieved in a package with a more moderate FS.

Ned Jr. is also correct. Once those big Ochs bred cattle left the confines of that high mountain setting and ended up in the foothills of New Mexico and the flatlands of Texas, a majority of them indeed went to "be nice"! I think their commitment to get their cattle bigger and bigger really backfired on them when forced to relocate to an area where the grass was a lot sparcer. I'd bet that elk and moose, raised in that type environment, would suffer the same fate if forced to move to the same area.

George
 
I agree with Doc, OB Joyful is certainly pleasant too look at (that pic would look good on my wall); but I wouldn't want 50 of his daughters.......particualarly in the clay hills of Northwest Alabama.
 
doc that bull would fitt nicely on my great grandpas reg horned hereford cows back in the 20s to 50s.as well as a friend that got his start from my great gandpa.my friends cows always weighed 1600 to 1700lbs.an they would wean off 700 to 800lb calves.he was an stanch beleiver in weighing his calves an cows at weaning time.
 

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