Show me your herd bull

[Oldtimer]

This is DDA Alliance 189V- Reg: AAA 19386387- a coming 4 year old bull that I have used the last 3 years. His sire H A R Pinebank 443 202 was a son of the New Zealand bull Pinebank Waigroup 41/97 and he traces on both top and bottom back to some old great Diamond D Angus herd sires. I will have another set of calves sired by him starting in late March. He has a long pedigree of moderate framed maternal cattle and we are just starting to see what his heifers can do. Lazy Bar B Angus !

 

[Warren Allison]

Right,, Beefmaster will put on a pretty decent hair coat..but I wouldnt want too much Brahman influence above the Alabama state line..up here 1/4 Brahman influence does best..

Beefmasters are 1/2 Brahma.1/4 Hereford and 1/4 Shorthorn... a little more Brahma than the 5/8ths/3/8ths.composites like Braford, Brangus and Gert. I have seen all of them do well in NC, Tenn, southern Mo, Ky and VA, and used to be a big breeder around Walnut Ridge, Ark. Reckon why they have him in such a high fence? Did the ad say how old he was? And weight?

 

[alacowman1]

Beefmasters are 1/2 Brahma.1/4 Hereford and 1/4 Shorthorn... a little more Brahma than the 5/8ths/3/8ths.composites like Braford, Brangus and Gert. I have seen all of them do well in NC, Tenn, southern Mo, Ky and VA, and used to be a big breeder around Walnut Ridge, Ark. Reckon why they have him in such a high fence? Did the ad say how old he was? And weight?

Birth 3/2/21..the fence ,he was telling someone else his Dad raised some Elk in there in the past..

 

[Warren Allison]

Birth 3/2/21..the fence ,he was telling someone else his Dad raised some Elk in there in the past..

Not quite two years old! I agree with you..you could drive a brand new set of tires off a truck criss-crossing the south, and I don't think you could find a better deal. I haven't had a whole lot of experience with BMs, but the ones I have were some of the best dispositioned Brahma composites I ever fooled with. If a man had a herd of Angus or homo black simm cows, I guanrantee his calves would top the market and any sale down here. And if one didn't really care about chasing CAB premiums, I bet you would get some real scale-mashers putting him on some Chars.

 

[Travlr]

This is DDA Alliance 189V- Reg: AAA 19386387- a coming 4 year old bull that I have used the last 3 years. His sire H A R Pinebank 443 202 was a son of the New Zealand bull Pinebank Waigroup 41/97 and he traces on both top and bottom back to some old great Diamond D Angus herd sires. I will have another set of calves sired by him starting in late March. He has a long pedigree of moderate framed maternal cattle and we are just starting to see what his heifers can do. Lazy Bar B Angus !
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Wow... This bull reminds me of a couple of paintings my parents had on the wall when I was a kid. Ancient art from the era of Renaissance. They depicted cattle in a similar pose and they looked like fat rectangular boxes on tiny little legs.

Being out west I'm used to seeing cattle that can travel well, and for quite a while they were more popular and I always wondered at the leg to body proportions compared to the old paintings. Now we see cattle that are going to more body mass and less leg, and personally I think they look great. This bull is a great example. Fashions always return...

 

[gcreekrch]

This is DDA Alliance 189V- Reg: AAA 19386387- a coming 4 year old bull that I have used the last 3 years. His sire H A R Pinebank 443 202 was a son of the New Zealand bull Pinebank Waigroup 41/97 and he traces on both top and bottom back to some old great Diamond D Angus herd sires. I will have another set of calves sired by him starting in late March. He has a long pedigree of moderate framed maternal cattle and we are just starting to see what his heifers can do. Lazy Bar B Angus !
View attachment 25909

Good bull OT. A place here had some Diamond D bulls 10 years ago that had terrible feet. Are they getting that solved?

 

[Oldtimer]

Good bull OT. A place here had some Diamond D bulls 10 years ago that had terrible feet. Are they getting that solved?

I've had several cows and bulls with Diamond D bloodlines- and they all had good feet. This bull hasn't had any foot problems. Alliance 189V has some New Zealand Pinebank Waigroup breeding - and they are known for their good foot qualities. At the last sale a month ago I bought a young bull from Diamond D that is half Waigroup breeding- his sire is Pinebank SE 10D a bull owned by Diamond D and Sustainable Genetics.

He seems to have good feet also - and the Waigroup bloodlines are also known for their maternal abilities and longevity- DDA Hodge 51Y Reg: AAA *20309432.

 

[Chapin81]

one of the four sires we have. He’s been on vacation, going back to work next week.

JDH Woodson de Manso 206/7 x Moreno Ms. Lady tequila 378. He’s 5 years old last month. We are probably going to keep him long term. I like his calves.

 

[TwoByrdsMG]

Of course when I want to take a picture, he doesn't want to stand still. This is our 2 year old registered Charolais bull, GRSC Big Iron sired by RBM TR Rhinestone Z38. Lots of good bull characteristics, excellent scrotal, big curly head, plenty of length and still gentle enough for my 13 year old to lead on a halter. He has good angles and a nice smooth shoulder.

 

[Warren Allison]

one of the four sires we have. He’s been on vacation, going back to work next week.

JDH Woodson de Manso 206/7 x Moreno Ms. Lady tequila 378. He’s 5 years old last month. We are probably going to keep him long term. I like his calves.

Chapin, is he a registered Brahma? Or is he a Indu-Brasille? Are there Brahma seed stock producers in that country, or do you import them?

Also are you seeing any Chianina in your area? For a several years now, I have been sending Chianina bulls to my Mexican broker in Chihuahua. Mexico, who is selling them in Guatemala, Venezuela and Brazil. Last month I sent him 3 Chiania x Charbray bulls too, and he said he could use some more like that. What is your opinion of using Chianina and/or Char bulls in your area? I can see the Chi's working out great. They are every bit as heat, parasite and insect tolerant as Brahma, and they are known travelers, but I would think not so much pb Chars. Do you think a Char bull would thrive and be able to cover ground enough to be of use in your country?

 

[MurraysMutts]

Chapin, is he a registered Brahma? Or is he a Indu-Brasille? Are there Brahma seed stock producers in that country, or do you import them?

Also are you seeing any Chianina in your area? For a several years now, I have been sending Chianina bulls to my Mexican broker in Chihuahua. Mexico, who is selling them in Guatemala, Venezuela and Brazil. Last month I sent him 3 Chiania x Charbray bulls too, and he said he could use some more like that. What is your opinion of using Chianina and/or Char bulls in your area? I can see the Chi's working out great. They are every bit as heat, parasite and insect tolerant as Brahma, and they are known travelers, but I would think not so much pb Chars. Do you think a Char bull would thrive and be able to cover ground enough to be of use in your country?

The JDH (J.D. Hudgens) and Manso bloodlines are pretty popular Brahma breeders

 

[EasTex]

The best, I believe

 

[Chapin81]

Chapin, is he a registered Brahma? Or is he a Indu-Brasille? Are there Brahma seed stock producers in that country, or do you import them?

Also are you seeing any Chianina in your area? For a several years now, I have been sending Chianina bulls to my Mexican broker in Chihuahua. Mexico, who is selling them in Guatemala, Venezuela and Brazil. Last month I sent him 3 Chiania x Charbray bulls too, and he said he could use some more like that. What is your opinion of using Chianina and/or Char bulls in your area? I can see the Chi's working out great. They are every bit as heat, parasite and insect tolerant as Brahma, and they are known travelers, but I would think not so much pb Chars. Do you think a Char bull would thrive and be able to cover ground enough to be of use in your country?

The four bulls I have are all registered. The other three are jdh clanton son, jdh mosley manso and Brc Noble. From the maternal side their mothers are Karu 800 daughters except the Woodson son. To answer your question I’d have to ask around to see if anyone is working with that breed cross down there. I’ve been told that in the cooler parts of the country ranchers used simmental or simbrah but they do not look as good as the ones we have up here. Usually thinner smaller frame. but who knows if they really are pure breds. I’ll ask around tomorrow and get back to you I belong to a group chat with about 120 buyers and sellers of livestock in guatemala.

 

[Chapin81]

The JDH (J.D. Hudgens) and Manso bloodlines are pretty popular Brahma breeders

The problem I am running into is not enough purebred breeders or they have not introduced great or newer bloodlines or the donor cow isn’t great the condition of the bulls are not great. Obviously you’d want a bull to work out in the pasture and not be fed grains everyday. Down there it can break the bank just up keeping their condition. One breeder did tell me that if the clients wants a pasture bull he will wean the bull off grain 2 months before handing him over to the buyer and graze the bull on bad pastures. Another buyer did tell me of course this is hearsay that a buddy of his brought a great looking bull and now he’s bones and skin. It had something to do with where he was raised and the location he was taking to he didn’t adapt well. Guatemala it’s either cool or hot depends what part of the country, the topography changes plenty.

 

[Infinity]

New owner and new here...I am curious as to the "why" of the preference of black bulls. There cannot be any difference in the meat. AND!!!!!!.....Why is there a prejudice at the sales for anything with a belt? We bought a few brangus cows last summer and then, separately, purchased a Belted Galloway 18 month bull. I had done research on the marbling of meat and they were rayed higher than Aberdeen Angus. We won't be selling calves...they will go into the freezer, but I AM interested why the negativity. Thanks!!

 

[Mountaintown Creek Ranch]

Someone ask and I posted a pic of our tank 🙂...but here are some of the boys in our tank. I believe we have about 15 - 20 bulls to choose from.

We carry a lot of some bulls that have low birth weight to use on our heifers.

Others that have specific traits we might only carry 3 or 4 straws especially due to cost....some of these bull's straws are expensive !

We do not own these bulls...just straws.

 

[Travlr]

New owner and new here...I am curious as to the "why" of the preference of black bulls. There cannot be any difference in the meat. AND!!!!!!.....Why is there a prejudice at the sales for anything with a belt? We bought a few brangus cows last summer and then, separately, purchased a Belted Galloway 18 month bull. I had done research on the marbling of meat and they were rayed higher than Aberdeen Angus. We won't be selling calves...they will go into the freezer, but I AM interested why the negativity. Thanks!!

Welcome to the forum...

It really all comes down to what commercial buyers prefer... and commercial buyers like consistency. Outliers, unpopular breeds due to low numbers, low numbers due to being unpopular, go hand in hand.

I've seen some great belted cattle. Good bulls and cows that have frame and will raise a great calf. But they, like most breeds, are the ones you most often see in advertisements and not out in the pasture. Most belted cattle I've seen are not that great and the good ones are the exception. But then... that is also the case with most cattle when we bother to think about it.

Oddly, and in my opinion without real world relevance, buyers discount color. That's a can of worms here because some people support color discrimination while others just try to raise great cattle. Breed discounts have more relevance especially when you can't fill a feedlot with similar animals that will do well on a ration suited to them specifically. It's easy to see that a lot full of Corriente will feed out far differently than a lot full of Simmental, and no one wants a lot full of ten different dissimilar breeds.

 

[Travlr]

Someone ask and I posted a pic of our tank 🙂...but here are some of the boys in our tank. I believe we have about 15 - 20 bulls to choose from.

We carry a lot of some bulls that have low birth weight to use on our heifers.

Others that have specific traits we might only carry 3 or 4 straws especially due to cost....some of these bull's straws are expensive !

We do not own these bulls...just straws.

View attachment 26074View attachment 26075View attachment 26076View attachment 26077

Do you buy based on EPDs? Advice from the guy selling semen? Price? Looks?

Tell me why you like the first bull... second bull... third bull.

 

[Mountaintown Creek Ranch]

I do most of my own research.

Unfortunately in the United States Wagyu epds are still in their infancy compared to the Australian wagyu and Japanese Wagyu. So I go on actual carcass data mostly and of course word of mouth from reputable ranchers.

Prior to buying straws I bought a high end bull....but the more I studied wagyu (red & black) genetics....for about 3 years... the more I realized I needed diversity due some of the shortcomings of Wagyu ... not having other traits that I desired in my herd.

I also rely on other wagyu ranchers that have had success with certain bulls.

#1 we bought this guy to use on our registered Angus that had Pathfinder pedigree. He was a decent milker but he had good REA and marbling. Unfortunately she went 0 for 3 due to a reproductive track that was like a roller coaster.. She made good steak !

#2 and #3 we're for size, milk, and maternal... Red's are much better than most black at milk and maternal.

#4 is Brady Bull, he is an up and coming bull. His brother sold last year for $500,000.
We had a son of Brady a few weeks ago. 🤞

 

[Infinity]

Welcome to the forum...

It really all comes down to what commercial buyers prefer... and commercial buyers like consistency. Outliers, unpopular breeds due to low numbers, low numbers due to being unpopular, go hand in hand.

I've seen some great belted cattle. Good bulls and cows that have frame and will raise a great calf. But they, like most breeds, are the ones you most often see in advertisements and not out in the pasture. Most belted cattle I've seen are not that great and the good ones are the exception. But then... that is also the case with most cattle when we bother to think about it.

Oddly, and in my opinion without real world relevance, buyers discount color. That's a can of worms here because some people support color discrimination while others just try to raise great cattle. Breed discounts have more relevance especially when you can't fill a feedlot with similar animals that will do well on a ration suited to them specifically. It's easy to see that a lot full of Corriente will feed out far differently than a lot full of Simmental, and no one wants a lot full of ten different dissimilar breeds.

What a fabulous explanation! Thank you so much for taking the time to explain.
I will post a picture of him when back home. We are on the road until the end of the month.