Salt and minerals?

[rk]

I understand negative perception of animal protein, but not using animal fat seems like throwing the baby out with the bath water, since animal fat is a good ingredient w/o connection to BSE (since that's what the concern seems to be). If you think feed prices are high now, wait, because they will go up more. In this age of high feed prices, it seems foolish to not use animal fat, especially since its relative value is good and there's no connection to BSE.

 

[TexasBred]

I understand negative perception of animal protein, but not using animal fat seems like throwing the baby out with the bath water, since animal fat is a good ingredient w/o connection to BSE (since that's what the concern seems to be). If you think feed prices are high now, wait, because they will go up more. In this age of high feed prices, it seems foolish to not use animal fat, especially since its relative value is good and there's no connection to BSE.

Just too many people out there scared of anything that says "animal". And most feed store owners would rather not spend their time defending it. Heck I've had people ask me about "D-activated animal sterol" just because it has "animal" in the name.

I will agree that the days of cheap feed are gone and probably will never come back. Corn is trading at $5.24 right now on the futures market and soybean meal at $360.00 fob...Cottonseed meal is probably around $330 and all by-products follow suit just because they can. Urea is not even much of cost cutter anymore. We all better tighten our belts and get ready for along rough ride. :cry2:

 

[rk]

It's disappointing that folks who want to make all/part of their liveliehood from cattle don't make the effort to become better informed about what/how feed ingredients relate to BSE. Not even all animal proteins are related to BSE, neither is animal fat, which is a good, safe ingredient when used appropriately.

 

[dalebarber]

SALT IN MINERAL IS CONSIDERED TO BOTH ATTRACT AND LIMIT INTAKE IN MINERALS. SALT IS VERY EXPENSIVE AS PART OF A MINERAL PACKAGE FIGURE A 25% SALT IN MINERAL, MEANS EVERY 10 BAGS IN A TON IS PURE SALT. MINERALS ARE FORMULATED AT SO MANY OZS. PER DAY SO MIX YOUR OWN SALT TO ACQUIRE THE DESIRED CONSUMPTION LEVEL OF MINERAL, ITS MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE AND ONLY REQUIRES A LITTLE MATH AND MANAGEMENT

 

[TexasBred]

Salt is one of the cheapest ingredients that go into a mineral unless it's loaded up with filler (rice or peanut hulls). Only calcium is cheaper.

 

[dalebarber]

that is very true, it is the cheapest but figure it according to the cost of a total bag of mineral. say for instance a decent 12:12 cow mineral at say $16.00 for 50 lbs. with 25% salt that means 12.5 lbs of that bag is salt. 16.00 divided by 25% is $4.00. out here we can by a 50# bag of salt for less than $4.00. see the savings of buying low salt mineral and mixing salt to meet consumption during the winter when it's necessary.

 

[TexasBred]

Dale if you're going to go that route go buy you a bag of limestone and mix in there. Lime is $1.25 a hundred delivered bulk...maybe a little higher bagged. No need to pay $16.00 a hundred for limestone either. But on the otherhand you get a great bargain on the phosphorus as mono-calcium phosphate is $33.75 per hundred. ;-) In short when you start trying to topdress or add to mineral on your own you are diluting all the other minerals and have basically the whole batch.

 

[dalebarber]

THE POINT I AM MAKING IS SALT IS CHEAPER BY ITSELF, THAN PURCHASED IN A MINERAL, AND MOST OF THE TIME A LOWER PRICED MINERAL IS LOADED WITH SALT, OR LOW QUALITY MINERALS,(OXIDES) THAT ARE IN THE MINERAL AT THE SAME PERCENTAGE AS ANOTHER HIGHER QUALITY MINERAL, YET THEY ARE NOT AS AVAILABLE TO BE ABSORBED BY THE ANIMAL.
MINERALS ARE FORMULATED TO BE FED AT A CERTAIN LEVEL, SAY 4 OZ. A DAY, AS LONG AS THAT ANIMAL TAKES ON 4 OZS. OF MINERAL WITH NO MATTER HOW MUCH LIMITER SALT, CSM, SBM OR WHATEVER, IT DOES NOT DILUTE THE MINERAL. I AM JUST TRYING TO MAKE THE POINT YOU DO GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR, AND YOU'LL SEE IT INTHE PERFORMANCE OF YOUR HERD. HOW CAN SOME OF THESE TOO DURN HIGH MINERALS HANG AROUND FOR 50-60 YEARS IF THEY WERE'NT DOING SOMETHING RIGHT. I AM NEW TO THIS BOARD AND ENJOY THE DEBATE, AND AS A BROTHER TEXAN AM WILIING TO AGREE TO DISAGREE.

 

[TexasBred]

Hi ya Dale. Not trying to be argumentative at all but anytime you take a mineral (with or without salt) and more or less topdress it with anything you dilute the mix that came out of the bag. If you do it that way you need 2 oz. or 4 oz or whatever "PLUS" the salt you added.

And I agree with you on the oxides in mineral. 90% of them go right thru the cow, yet I still think you need some oxides in the mineral as well as the sulfates and some organic minerals. However, you do not want 100% of them to be any one type. As for those minerals that have been on the market many many years, that is not an indication of how good it is. Only that people often don't like to change and/or what worked for grandpa will work for me. And oftentimes it does. Is mineral overpriced? Yes. Most have more than double the margin built into the price that regular feed will have, just becaause they can command that price. But just as you have some cheap calcium and salt in the mineral you may have as much as $15 a pound for one single vitamin. Typical ingredient price for a 12-12 mineral is about $475.00... It will sometimes retail for double that..